Sky+ lipsync problem

L

leng

Guest
Sometimes when playing back a recording I find that the lipsync is completely off. Usually, stopping and starting the recording will cure this. I believe I have seen it live, but I won't swear to that.

Anyone else seen this, or know how to prevent it? I made a coaster the other day dumping some stuff to DVD R
 

stricko

Active Member
All the time, all the time.

Discussed at length elsewhere (see the digitalSpy PVR forum). It is a problem on live broadcast, but changing channels usually stops it. It seems to be more of a problem on Sky+ recordings, and almost appears to be embedded in the recording. It's not consistent, it's no cumulative (it doesn't get worse, it just drifts in and out). It's very frustrating. But from what I've read, there isn't a solution.
 

STOWITBELOW

Active Member
I wish I'd not read this )-: I get it regularly live but have never noticed on recordings. Hope I don't see it either.
 

Starburst

Novice Member
Seen it three times (twice on sky1 and once on MTV) in 31 months of using SKY+ connected via scart to a RPTV TV and phono/optical to an amp.
 

ShaneyB

Standard Member
Get it constantly on several channels and changing the channel doesn't help, nor does putting Sky + on standby. I was at first told it could be something to do with the Plasma but since been informed it's a Sky problem. Always happens when something good's on..? Never happened on a recording yet though.
 

essex

Standard Member
My wife got this problem a couple of days ago. She said the sound was out of sync when she was watching a recorded Friends episode which made it unwatchable.

I stopped myself explaining to her that even with proper lip syncing it would have been unwatchable anyway............

PS also saw it 'live' whilst watching the commentators during lunch at the england v west indies test match yesterday.
 

CARLOS

Distinguished Member
The only channel i really notice it on is UK Gold and that just seems to be out of sync all the time.
 
J

jsmurray

Guest
Mine was on a recording. Stopped it, powered off, and back on. The same recording played back perfectly.
Must be a software bug.
 

essex

Standard Member
I have noticed the Mother of all Lip sync problems last night. I was watching a recording of the Simpsons and noticed the lip sync problem!!!!!

I promise I have not been smoking (or drinking) anything strange, but honestly, it was so bad I noticed it from a cartoon.......

With all these problems that SKY seem to be having, does anyone know of any companies offering warranties on these SKY+ boxes, as I seem to have had most of the major symptoms mentioned on these boards.........
 
S

skybluescooby

Guest
Hi all, i have just come across this problem since swapping my old thomson 32" for a new jvc 32". im getting real bad lip sync from sky news, but when i check the same channel on my other set upstairs (on a sky eye link),via rewind and re-play then re-wind and re-play main tv i dont get the lip sync problem which tells me its the tv ?? ithink
 
J

johnblaum

Guest
Just got here so I guess lots to learn. Anyway I have 4 cheap digital freeview receivers. All have lip sync problem. Cheap so I think OK. I have cheap DVD player. Guess what. Lip Sync Problems. I have Sky+ delighted no lip sync problem. Got JVC Surround sound with Optical In. Connect this to Sky Plus DD. Lovely sound but guess what, Yes lip sync problem. In fact if I turn up TV it sounds like Bruce Almighty trying to answer everyones prayers at once. I think it is processing time and cheap means slow but i didnt expect it from JVC. Is there a cure.
 

FaxFan2002

Well-known Member
The only cure I can think is feeding your sky+ thru an amp with audio delay features. I see it very rarely but can be cured straight way via the amp. This is seemingly a big problem on DVD player / plasma or LCD TV combo's (Although I've only seen it - heard it? - on a handful of DVD's). - do a search on the plasma tv forum.
 

Nick_UK

Banned
Any time that you encode/decode sound, it will take a little time to do it. Even NICAM is only "Near Instantaneous" (that's what the NI in NICAM stands for). We can tolerate a small delay, but when it gets longer than about 1/4 of a second, we start to notice.

There are two issues here. The first is Sky. Lip-sync problems on Sky channels are largely down to the encoding process, and some channels are a lot worse than others. On ITV3, it is often so bad, that there is often a jump where the sound catches up with the picture ! Cheap and nasty encoding ! Not much you can do about it, except complain, and who complains ?

The second issue is with the decoding equipment. Since not everybody gets the problem across all formats, the problem must lie in the decoder speeds. Just as in PC CPU's, a cheaper chip will not be as fast as a more expensive one, so don't expect the cheapest AV amp to work as well as the most expensive one. Many cheap plasma displays have slower chips than the expensive ones.

If the lip-sync delay is always the same, then a delay device will cure it. However, if the lip-sync delay varies, then there is nothing you can do about it, as far as I'm aware, other than swapping out poorly performing equipment.
 

Nick_UK

Banned
My Yammie amp is great. The only thing that would tempt me would be one that upscales from s-video to component and back. :)
 

andyxxx

Standard Member
I have just taken delivery of a 50" DLP set that is having major lip sync problems on sky, and normal analogue broadcasts- so I have purchased a decent digital receiver and am still getting the problem - which of course suggests the set is faulty, but this is a replacement set (The first had the same problem and was swapped after a few days)
 

Starburst

Novice Member
The lip-sync errors you are seeing are probably the result of the delay in the video signal after the processing introduced by the display, this is quite common on modern displays that put the video through extensive processing unlike a bog standard CRT which in comparison dumps the video straight to the electron guns:)

If this case the audio would be ahead of the video, a suitable amplifier can be used to artificially delay the audio to match the video delay.
 

andyxxx

Standard Member
Starburst - thanks for the input.
The delay seems to alter (even during the same broadcast) though I can't be certain of that.
If what you say proves to be correct, any suggestions why more people aren't noticing it with the same set?

If this is the problem the set will be going back (I'm not stumping up another £500 plus for a replacement amp cos a tv manufacturer is selling a £2k box that does not work!)
 

Starburst

Novice Member
As Nick UK has pointed out there are many possible reasons why lip-sync errors occur and that's compounded by the effect being less noticeable to some people.
If the delay is indeed caused by the TV then you should be seeing a fairly uniform effect which would allow you to set an audio delay via a suitable amplifier for each video input.

Why isn't everyone seeing the delay?
Well I suppose that has a lot to do with the multipule digital/analogue sources, cabling, amplification, video processing and how each indivduals brain interprets the visual and audio data it receives.
I honestly don't think there is a simple answer since I've had SKY D since it was launched in 1998 and SKY+ since 2001 I have only noticed lip-sync errors 3 times (SKY1 twice and MTV once) and I have never seen it on Freeview, DVD/VHS and analogue broadcasts but obviously it does exist.
I do see it a lot on my own video encodes and downloaded avi/xvid clips though:)

The question of the performance of the TV is important though, the TV can not be blamed for adding a delay to the video which then causes sync errors when the audio is processed via an external amplifier. If the audio was fed through the TV's processing and the delay was created then I would consider that to be a design flaw.
Have you sort advice from within the DLP forum?
 

HMHB

Distinguished Member
My lip-synch problems seem to be random, but most often occur on the +1 channels of UK Gold and Paramount etc. I'm sure this must be a problem with the transmission
 

Starburst

Novice Member
JohnG said:
My lip-synch problems seem to be random, but most often occur on the +1 channels of UK Gold and Paramount etc. I'm sure this must be a problem with the transmission



If it was then everyone would be seeing it.
However it could be that certain broadcasts are out a few frames and then the STB introduces a few frames of error and then the TV/Amp add a further few frames of error and you get the effect you are seeing while someone else doesn't.

The same thing happended with Pioneer DVD players in the early days, certain disks only showed lip-sync errors on those players while playing fine on other machines. The cause was found to be slight mastering errors on the discs which were being amplified by the Pioneer players while other machines handled the problem without the viewer being aware.
 

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