Sky House Move : House now Swiss Cheese

aquiss

Novice Member
I just thought I would share my experience of a multi-room house move install and how a sky engineer + a lad helping (i think was his son) has made my brand new town house, new build, into swiss cheese.

Engineer turned up on time. I told him where I wanted the dish, on a wall with direct sight to pick up signal, but more importantly where no rooms in the house could see it, thus ensuring that views from windows was not ruined, but also complying with house builder rules of where dishes could be fitted (i even told sky on the phone all this).

I showed the engineer where in the house the install needed to go, both in lounge and in one of the bedrooms on 3rd floor. I showed him the most logical way to route the cables (saving him time + cable), but again complying with rules set out in house deeds.

I went off to make the coffee whilst leaving them to get on. I heard the drills fire up in the lounge, drilling from the inside of house to the outside. Whilst I could hear drills outside, which was the lad putting up the dish. All seemed normal. I popped into the lounge to supply the drinks, where the engineer told me he had 12 jobs to do today and that he had only been back on Sky installs for 2 weeks after been doing Digital Switchover installs for the last 7 months. I joked that I hope he remembers what to do....I should have kept my mouth shut! Now bear in mind I had not gone outside at this point.

Anyway, I showed him upstairs to the bedroom, where again I left him to get on. Once again I heard the drills going on upstairs, inside the house. Again all seems normal, need drills for holes. I also heard hammering alongside the house, which was the lad tacking up cable (ok to be fair there are going along the route I said). Things go quiet....I don't suspect anything, but I get shown to my boxes to make sure there working....ok, that's not unusual. There working, brilliant I thought...job done.

I come outside to see the guys off, to find the dish is on the back of the house, wrong wall. I queried this to be told, they could not get a signal. I pointed out that the next 3 houses in street all have them exactly in the placed I asked. They insist no signal. I accept they could be right, I have no way to test otherwise, but seems odd.

I then notice a drilled hole in the wall, below the dish. I asked what that was for. He said it's there for health and safety so we can attach the ladders. Now bear in mind he drilled this after doing all the work, so he had not bothered to use the hole anyway.

The engineers left. 15 mins later I was out the back of house, when the site manager of the new build estate came over, who I get on with really well, said. "i love what they done to the place". I was like yeah, this hole and that. Unknown to me, he went on to say...."hole...try a brick". He quickly knew I was not aware....so he showed me...the install on 3rd floor, the whole brick face has come away, leaving the air holes inside the brick exposed. The cable is just dangling in the wind, until it gets down to the 2nd floor, where the lad has nailed it in. Its now clear to me, they knew what they had done and where quick to get away from the job.

We then checked the drilled hole from lounge, whilst not as bad, it's half broken and just been filled will clear decorators cork. No protection cover which every other house in the area have.

To top it off, no phone cables were attached to sockets, so I have the box upstairs unable to call Sky, which means I break my contract.

I phoned Sky, who I have to say have been superb in handling my case. Been put in contact with a lady direct, who has written to me, explained what's going to happen. I have never had to complain before, but I explained the whole situation and there was a real concern about the workmanship and how he has left the install. They have spoken to AVC (i believe) who I'm told will be sending out someone to review the work, within 5 days.

My fear now is they are going to say this is acceptable workmanship, with myself having to repair, at some cost, brickwork to make sure the house is watertight.

We been a customer of Sky since there were just 4 channels, back in the 80s. In all that time, I never had an install go wrong.
 

logiciel

Moderator
That's one of the worst we've had reported.
There's a crumb of comfort in it, that it will get you substantial compensation from Sky - I wouldn't accept anything less than a year's half price subscription.
 

simon194

Well-known Member
They are supposed to drill from the outside in because it avoids exterior damage the OP described. I've never come across anyone commercial installer that does it the other way.
 

Trollslayer

Distinguished Member
This is why it's worth finding a local Sky installer and dealing with them rather than letting Sky pick a monkey for you.
 

logiciel

Moderator
Inside to out is the usual way but why wouldn't the reverse produce interior damage on the same scale?
 
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mattclarkie

Novice Member
I agree that outside to in is the usual way but why wouldn't the reverse produce interior damage on the same scale?
Because the inside is plaster it doesn't break the way brick does so you don't get severe interior damage. Brick is full of cracks and air gaps and it just goes along a weakness, plaster being powdery is much more forgiving to the drill.

I would have spoken to them once I knew they were drilling from the inside, you know for future reference that this is odd.
I have personally drilled from the inside when there were interior obstacles that needed to be avoided (phone points .etc.), if you go slowly with the drill you get practically no damage, so I assume they were incredibly rough when drilling.
 

logiciel

Moderator
There's brick under the plaster on the inside, and maybe wood or plastic skirting over the plaster - more scope for damage than outside?
 

abay710

Active Member
As an engineer who works direct for sky, the way sky ask us to drill is from inside out, no exceptions, so this part was correct.

As to the restof your install, it's a shambles, as is typical of an avc install, sorry to hear it mate.

Good luck with sky and the avc manager, hope you get it sorted
 
There's brick under the plaster on the inside, and maybe wood or plastic skirting over the plaster - more scope for damage than outside?
Very true and it is also usually a lot cheaper and easier to repair and make good the damage to the outside of a wall than to interior decoration where a complete wall may need redecorating to make good any damage caused by "brick blowout".
 

Souldier

Standard Member
Pay £30 get a£30 job should drill inside out use small drill bit 10mm first turn off hammer near end then drill with larger drill bit 3/4 through then drill outside in for a clean hole and no need to use burst plate. If avc the engineer will have to pay for the damage they will send a supervisor round to inspect
 

Raj24v

Active Member
Yep... it's ALWAYS inside to out. Where are you guys getting the daft idea to do it from the outside in?? How are the supposed to see pipes, cables, switches, radiators etc??
 

Souldier

Standard Member
um!! 3/4 through then 16mm and RG6 or Ct100 not that shotgun **** ;-)
 
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spann3rs

Novice Member
I'm sorry you had such a bad install!! I used to work for the company taken over by AVC and can confirm there are some out there just banging out the installs without a care for the customers property. I've seen one install where the engineer drilled through the plastic roof of a conservatory to run the cable. :suicide:

I would suggest calling out a builder and get a quote to replace the blown bricks and pass this bill onto AVC / Sky. Good Luck!

Oh, and if the training is the same as when i was there, you are strictly told to drill inside out to limit interior damage.
 
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MartinPickering

Well-known Member
um!! 3/4 through then 16mm and RG6 or Ct100 not that shotgun s##t ;-)
RG6 is unsuitable and CT100 hasn't been manufactured since 2005. Both required a 10mm hole, not 16mm. If the cable is "twin" type, you split it at the wall and pass it through two 10mm holes. No need to go all industrial. ;)
 

Souldier

Standard Member
Ct100 is still available type on eBay your find loads how do you work out that rg6 is un suitable ? Shot gun is absolute rubbish and is unsuitable for long runs, and you would drill two holes and make it look more like a cheap job and more like Swiss cheese
 

MartinPickering

Well-known Member
I didn't mention "shotgun" (or "Shot gun") and I didn't state that CT100 is "unavailable". I stated that it hasn't been manufactured since 2005. That might make you think twice before buying anything labelled "CT100" (especially on eBay) because it's either fake or has been in storage a long time.

RG6 in the UK has aluminium foil and is not recommended by Sky for use outdoors because of its propensity to corrode quickly and because of its poorer shielding and higher attenuation.

Most people would recommend using twin WF100 or TX100, to be sure of a good, reliable product.

Drilling two separate 10mm holes is easier for the average DIYer than blasting a single 16mm hole and likely to do less damage overall. It's also easier to use "cable tidy" wall grommets indoors for single cables, unless you are taking the twin cable directly into trunking.
 
Ct100 is still available type on eBay your find loads how do you work out that rg6 is un suitable ? Shot gun is absolute rubbish and is unsuitable for long runs, and you would drill two holes and make it look more like a cheap job and more like Swiss cheese
You have to bear in mind that many items on ebay are not to the exact spec that they state - many are copies of original spec "trademarked" items some of which may be as good as the original but others and in particular cabling may very well be a lot lower spec and in some cases (particularly mains electical cabling) may be actually be of a hazardous and illegal spec (e.g. lower copper content in the core and insulation that produces highly toxic fumes if heated or burnt).
 

Souldier

Standard Member
I didn't mention "shotgun" (or "Shot gun") and I didn't state that CT100 is "unavailable". I stated that it hasn't been manufactured since 2005. That might make you think twice before buying anything labelled "CT100" (especially on eBay) because it's either fake or has been in storage a long time.

RG6 in the UK has aluminium foil and is not recommended by Sky for use outdoors because of its propensity to corrode quickly and because of its poorer shielding and higher attenuation.

Most people would recommend using twin WF100 or TX100, to be sure of a good, reliable product.

Drilling two separate 10mm holes is easier for the average DIYer than blasting a single 16mm hole and likely to do less damage overall. It's also easier to use "cable tidy" wall grommets indoors for single cables, unless you are taking the twin cable directly into trunking.
well we will have to agree to disagree i would never drill two holes and there is a grommet to fit two rg6 or any other cable, and i would not use triax (TX100) as i find the centre core flimsy
 

MartinPickering

Well-known Member
The centre core of TX100 is 1 square mm copper - identical to that of WF100. So either your perception is incorrect or you are referring to a fake version. Maybe you got it off eBay?
 

Souldier

Standard Member
The centre core of TX100 is 1 square mm copper - identical to that of WF100. So either your perception is incorrect or you are referring to a fake version. Maybe you got it off eBay?
i never said i buy from ebay i said it's available on ebay and RG6 = 0.170 as for my prep well i leave that to my customers, i just don't like TX100 and if you silicon grease the outside f's corrosion should almost not be an issue
 
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MartinPickering

Well-known Member
i just don't like WF100 and if you silicon (sic) grease the outside f's corrosion should almost not be an issue
So you don't like WF100 or TX100 - considered to be the most cost-effective cable available for Freeview and satellite.

Corrosion with aluminium foil cable outdoors is often an issue because the PVC outer sheath becomes porous under the action of ultraviolet and abrasion caused by wind and dust. Eventually it soaks up moisture. The resultant electrolytic action between aluminium screen and copper braid causes severe corrosion, which can be so bad that the cable ends up looking like a snake that swallowed eggs. It's the main reason that Sky stopped using aluminium foil cable - even though it is a lot cheaper.

Professional installers know this and won't use it. If you are using it outdoors then you must at least protect it with paint or conduit. However, it will still have higher attenuation than copper on copper cable.

I don't understand "RG6 = 0.170".
 

Souldier

Standard Member
So you don't like WF100 or TX100 - considered to be the most cost-effective cable available for Freeview and satellite.

Corrosion with aluminium foil cable outdoors is often an issue because the PVC outer sheath becomes porous under the action of ultraviolet and abrasion caused by wind and dust. Eventually it soaks up moisture. The resultant electrolytic action between aluminium screen and copper braid causes severe corrosion, which can be so bad that the cable ends up looking like a snake that swallowed eggs. It's the main reason that Sky stopped using aluminium foil cable - even though it is a lot cheaper.

Professional installers know this and won't use it. If you are using it outdoors then you must at least protect it with paint or conduit. However, it will still have higher attenuation than copper on copper cable.

I don't understand "RG6 = 0.170".
it's just the triax i don't like,so now you want me to paint the cable for the customer:nono: Dielectric Core O.D: 0.170:boring:
 

MartinPickering

Well-known Member
"Dielectric" is referring to the white plastic. I don't see that it's relevant. I thought you were referring to the copper core. I don't expect you to paint anything but I would expect you to explain to your customers that you are supplying sub standard cable to save money and at least give them the chance to make it last a bit longer.
 

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