Sim2 new 3 chip @ only 25lbs and 6500:1 contrast!!

sub 1000quid 3 chipper ?

3 years at the earliest and I reckon it will be more like 5.
 
Mr.D said:
sub 1000quid 3 chipper ?

3 years at the earliest and I reckon it will be more like 5.

I don't think we will ever see a sub £1000 3 chipper DLP.
 
lw32 said:
Manufacturer's specs should be taken with a pinch of salt, but I find nothing impressive about a £10K+ PJ that only just betters the HS50 on contrast (6000:1). DLP does not justify this ridiculous premium. You can get fantastic performance for less than £2k now - LCD and DLP! No way is a 3 chipper six times as good. A complete rip-off, IMO, and that's saying something since this is "cheap" for a 3 chip DLP.


And pigs might fly. :rotfl:

SIM2 tend to quote calibrated contrast ratios. calibrate the HS50 and still see if you hit 6000:1. (but still hit a reasonable lumen output)
Also comparing the HS50 to a 3-chipper or even a quality single cheaper with a lower contrast ratio is realy not a wise idea. The HS50 just cannot compete, and while the dynamic iris is maybe the future the HS50 at times just gets the level of a scene just completely wrong. Its too dark or not bright enough etc. + it also exhibits its fair share of the usual LCD issues.
 
Also comparing the HS50 to a 3-chipper or even a quality single cheaper with a lower contrast ratio is realy not a wise idea. The HS50 just cannot compete, and while the dynamic iris is maybe the future the HS50 at times just gets the level of a scene just completely wrong.
I don't think anyone is questioning that a 3 chipper is 'better', but is it really £10000 better? I think most people would say not.

The average user doesn't care about calibrated figures but what performance he gets out of the box, which is mostly excellent for £2k. You'd have to show something amazing to justify an extra £10k. I stand by my opinion - 3 chip DLPs are a rip-off. In fact, I think high-end single chip DLPs are a rip-off too.

LCD is a lot closer to DLP than the premium would suggest.
 
10K better, no of course it is not.

but then, if people pay it why drop the price? why import slate/flagstone from italy that cost £500+ sq/m when you can get english slate for £50. does the same thing but one just looks nicer and is slightly smoother.
Its the same in every market so why would HC be any different.

The best always carries a premium.

"The average user doesn't care about calibrated figures but what performance he gets out of the box, which is mostly excellent for £2k"
Then every punter is missing what there projector can realy do!!
you expect wonders straight of the box? Every projector will need to be calibrated to your dvd player etc to get the best out of it.
But then i think you have highlighted a valuble point, someone paying 10K does care about calibrated figures and performance, and is not so worried at peak lumen or CR quoted figures which is pointless as he knows out of box performance is pretty crap on the whole bar the odd exception

I also doubt you will get a CR of 6000:1 out of the box.
 
The best always carries a premium.
True, but I don't think a 3 chipper warrants a hefty premium. The quoted specs on some models are not much better than single chip DLPs, so in effect the only tangible benefit is absence of rainbows. If it was 1080 res then it'd be a little easier to swallow. 720 doesn't cut it for this kind of price.

you expect wonders straight of the box? Every projector will need to be calibrated to your dvd player etc to get the best out of it.
Maybe I've just been lucky, but my H57 had an almost perfect picture straight out of the box :) . It was amazing really. So good in fact that I've never got round to calibrating it. I admit that calibration is recommended, but if you're satisfied then it's best to leave well alone. Sometimes you can do more harm than good.

I think DLP pricing boils down to it being 'perceived' as the better technology, so deserves a premium. In practice there isn't much real world difference. The BenQ 7700 should change all that. Finally a realistic price for a 720 DLP.
 
There is a huge difference in quality between single and 3 chippers, specs don't tell the full story.
 
Jeff

Could you expand on your statement ? I am keen to know the areas where the 3 chippers excel.

Many thanks.
 
There is a huge difference in quality between single and 3 chippers, specs don't tell the full story.
There's no doubt 3 chippers are superior and for these prices I'd expect them to be. But there's a point of diminishing returns. Once you've achieved a certain quality, especially on SD based material, the difference is marginal. Hi-def will be like night and day but then you'd have to ask whether 720 is adequate since 1080p is just around the corner.

The latest single chip machines (eg. Marantz S4) are very good with first class processing. I doubt the difference would be huge.

The one clear advantage 3 chippers have is brightness. However, I was reading HCC's Screenplay 777 review and the contrast fell short of the quoted specs. And that's from a £20k machine. The Sony Qualia is the better buy if you're in the market for a high end projector. At least it can boast a full 1920x1080 res. LCD is going the same way. 720p is almost quaint these days!
 
720p maybe quaint but resolution is only part of the equation that makes up a good projected image.

I think there are a lot of people out there that get caught up in the 1080p hype.

When lets face it, unless your sat 2ft in front of a screen or projecting really big won't make a huge difference anyway.

Give me 720p @ 5000:1 ANSI contrast without VB or rainbows and I'd rather take that than paying a massive premium for 1080.

Hopefully we'll see more 3 Chip 720P front projectors at this years CEDIA for under 10K. No better way in a limited market for TI to shift chips if you can sell each projector with 3 chips rather than 1.
 
I think there are a lot of people out there that get caught up in the 1080p hype.
Hype or not, the new high-end is 1080p and Sim2's price seems to reflect that.

1080p is not a requirement but if it's available why settle for less? Anyone willing to spend over £10k would want the best resolution they can get I reckon.

Give me 720p @ 5000:1 ANSI contrast without VB or rainbows and I'd rather take that than paying a massive premium for 1080.
Is there a premium? The new Fujitsu costs less than any 3 chip DLP currently available. Of course it's an LCD so the old arguments apply. Assuming traditional LCD flaws have been eliminated 3 chip DLPs are going to struggle, which probably explains the Sim2 price point.
 
Edgeyboy said:
Jeff

Could you expand on your statement ? I am keen to know the areas where the 3 chippers excel.

Many thanks.

Colours, contrast, brightness, optics, video processing, lack of motion dithering.
 
Iw32

The 3 Chip DLP and LCD Projectors are not designed as mass market products - there's no sense in arguing about laws of diminishing returns; if you had the money and the inclination you would buy one.

For the majority of folk who are used to watching TV and Movies on a CRT TV the range of sub 1K LCD and DLP projectors now on the market are way above expectation levels and provide the big screen movie experience 'out of the box'.

95% of projectors sold will be plugged in, switched on and focused - no messing about with calibration discs and the like; stick a movie on an dim the lights please.

The Fujitsu LPF-D711 is a mighty fine piece of kit and very different in terms of what you get and how it operates over any of the signal chip products - even with your eyes closed you can 'hear' its quite different from the norm; its variable shutter/iris (not had time to study the mechanics as yet) are on the go the whole time and you can hear the servos working away.

Standard Definition DVD playback on the Fujitsu is better than most folk will expect - it doesn't rip the source to pieces and make everything unwatchable; it actually does a very good job of making the relatively low resolution/bit rate signal fool you into thinking its a high quality source.

Best regards

Joe
 
Looking at the lumen count for the CX3, this is not realy suited to a small to mid sized lounge. Looks like you would need at least a 10ft screen for it not to induce brain killing headaches. 2500 lumens fired at an 80ins screen would be bad would it not?.
This leads me to believe this is not intended for your HC wannabe but for those who have a dedicated HC which can house a pretty big screen.
(much like most canadians seem to have) Therefore single chip DLP will perhaps remain the best option for most as this is much more smaller room friendly. I have a 110" screen in a 22ftx16ft light controlled room and at 800 lumen (not calibrated figure) the image is bright enough perhaps a tad dim, 1100 would probaly be spot on. so 2500 would be too much unless i increased screen size to spread the lumens over a wider area. or am i smocking with the happy pipe??

I dont realy know so this is intended as an open thought/question, but i cant see the benefit in this for average home use, hence why it carries its premium price (ie small sales count)
 
The 3 chipper will have lamp adjustment so will not be overpowering on smaller screens.

This projector is definitely aimed at the domestic market where many people use screens of less than 10' width.

In my dem room here in Horsham it will be used on a 104' wide fixed frame screen for demonstrations.

Jeff
 
AAhhh

Thats good to know, i didnt realize you could tame the lamp dependent on install, thats a pretty cool feature.(and makes alot of sense).

Thanks Jeff.

P.S when are you expecting to have this for demo? I guess a 3 chipper will not suffer from graduation and contouring as much as single chip DLP does?
 
Hi Dustin,

Should be getting my dem unit very soon so will keep you posted.

Would be most surprised if there are any contouring issues with the C3X, especially using digital feeds.

Jeff
 
Jeff said:
There is a huge difference in quality between single and 3 chippers, specs don't tell the full story.

Hi Jeff,

I totally agree. There are many areas where the 3 chip image is far superior to that from single chip devices.

Colour separation ( Rainbow Effect) is probably the most important. But colour gamut and perceived depth of image, not to mention contrast and black level, make for an outstanding image.

Having been weaned on CRT projectors ( for which I still have the greatest respect) I can honestly say that DLP technology has reached a level now where I have no withdrawal symptoms when watching even the most challenging material.

Jeff
 
I know that there are better PJs out there than my Domino 20, but I have to say that I refuse to replace it until I can get a 3 chip 1080 PJ for around the £5k mark.

Ian.
 
Considering early reports for 3-chip 1080p will hit possibly the 20-30K range on release i think your in for the hell of a wait for a 5K model.
perhaps single chip 1080p may hit this margin in 2yrs but no time soon.

A high contrast 3 chip 720p DLP will probaly be a better choice than a 1080p single chipper. A resolution boost alone does not make for a great projector.
 
RTFM said:
The 3 chipper will have lamp adjustment so will not be overpowering on smaller screens.

Jeff

How about 72"?

Also how noisy is it likely to be?

Cheers,

Jeff
 
Should be fine on a 72" screen but seems a shame not to use it on something wider.

I'm told it is very quiet, should find out for sure this coming week.

Jeff
 
Jeff,

I have a very small room, I'm currently using a 9" Barco with my 72" Stewartfilm screen. Sitting distance is proabably only around 2.5M so it still looks big.

Thanks,

Jeff
 
Iw32

Something to watch out for with a lot of the current generation 1080P fixed pixel displays is that the majority of them cant actually accept a 1080P signal; how mad is that :)

Sony are now offering QUALIA 004 Projector owners a $3K 'upgrade' to accept 1080P on their 1080P array - though the 006 TV owners don't get this option.

Best regards

Joe

PS And of course its only 1080P at 60Hz - maybe it'll be another $3K for 1080P 50Hz support!!!
 

The latest video from AVForums

Is 4K Blu-ray Worth It?
Subscribe to our YouTube channel
Back
Top Bottom