SIM2 Nero 3D-2 Single Chip DLP 3D Projector Review

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by The News Bot, Dec 18, 2011.


    1. The News Bot

      The News Bot
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      <img src="http://reviews.images.static-avforums.com/reviews/250/thumb.jpg" align="right">Reviewed by Stephen Withers, 18th December 2011.
      Whilst perhaps not quite as decadent as its imperial namesake, the SIM2 Nero 3D-2 is a classy and assured projector that is capable of delivering opulent 2D images and a reference 3D performance. Whilst it might not be cheap, you definitely get what you pay for and proprietary features like the Live Calibration Software can deliver an unprecedented level of image accuracy. If you are in the market for a bright and capable 2D projector, that can also deliver some of the best 3D that you will see, then we suggest you give the Nero 3D-2 a demo - Highly Recommended.
      Read the full review...
       
    2. vyogee

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      Steve,
      Did u see improvements in black level compared to the optoma 83?
      The review does rate black levels as excellent and the optoma as good, just wondering.
       
      Last edited: Dec 19, 2011
    3. Webmonkey

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      I would like to hear about this too :D

      I was puzzled by the fact the the Optoma HD33 got the same marks for black level and dynamic range as the Hd83.
       
    4. Phil Hinton

      Phil Hinton
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      Guys, the marks are very much in relation to their market position. Not for one second can you seriously compare the HD83 to the Sim2 as the price difference is £14k.
      The HD33 and HD83 are marked in their class point and on their performance in relation to that in most cases. The HD33 and HD83 are essentially budget machines that perform exceptionally well in that sector of the market. The Sim2 is a different beast entirely as it is aimed at a different market point. It has extremely expensive optics, it actually produces the lumens quoted so is ideal for large custom installations into perfectly designed rooms with large screens. It also has superb video processing and calibration results and it offers stunning dynamic range meaning it hits reference levels of performance at the reference end of the market.
      You just cannot compare the two budget models which are built to a price point and to a different market, that don't have the same quality optics or other advantages that the Sim2 has. The biggest drawbacks of the two budget machines is that they are made to a price point and do not offer any kind of quality dynamic range or blacks, it is a drawback of DLP at this price point (but DLP also has it's strong points at this end of the market for brightness, but even then they cannot compete with the Sim2). It is like comparing a Ferrari to a Mondeo, both get you from A to B but are completely different machines with seriously different performance levels, for different markets.
       
    5. Webmonkey

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      So Phil - the fact that the HD33 and HD83 got same marks is not to be taken as you guys believe that they are in the same class?
       
    6. Phil Hinton

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      They are different models. The HD33 is marketed as a bit of an everymans machine for gaming, films and sports in an ordinary living room where you might use it for a multitude of uses, and its brightness helps with that, but of course the black levels suffer because of this use and design. It is not supposed to have serious black levels, but a bright and useful image for 3D and everyday use in far from ideal surroundings (maybe even projected on a wall). It is why it is priced as it is.

      The HD83 is designed for the film enthusiast and is part of the Themescene range. It is designed to be used in cinema rooms where care has been taken to make the room it is used in as projector friendly as possible. It's chassis design is more suited to this with a central lens, better quality glass and features, including some better calibration controls. It is bright for its market point and the Blacks are ok in a well suited room, but it stuggles with dynamic range with the low end not visible, even in the best surroundings. It will work in less than ideal rooms like the HD33 because of its lumens output so it covers more bases. Obviously surroundings impact of dynamic range and black levels for both machines. The HD83 was also tested against it's peers. As this is a Sim2 review thread any further discussion should really be in the Optoma threads.
      Neither the HD33 or HD83 compare at all to the Sim2.
       
    7. vyogee

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      Phil, I understand that they are in different leagues. The reason I ask us that, both dlps chips are from TI. The weakness of the technology is black levels as when it's projecting dark areas they are supposed to project in a dark corner inside the housing, I believe. The better optics will help in getting better light output as light coming out of the projector is less scattered with better optics The area that has me curious is how since all these guys get their chips from TI and TI has limited products how the black levels fare.
       
    8. Phil Hinton

      Phil Hinton
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      There is more to it than just the chip used. There are all kinds of tricks that different manufacturers use within the optics path to reduce stray light and so on to improve the dynamic range and black levels. As you can imagine at the Sim2 point of the market they will have more R&D to make these improvements to the optical block and light path to improve the performance (married to expensive glass etc.) Just because the chips are similar and from TI (there are different chips for different price points and use of course), there is more to the projector design than that alone, which is why we see such big differences between the price points and why the budget models do give a more similar performance in relation to blacks and dynamic range compared to each other, which are the weak point when compared to other tech. But budget DLP also has a few strong points, such as motion, 3D performance and of course, brightness for use in less than ideal rooms.
       
    9. vyogee

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      Got it Phil. It crossed my mind that they put in more r&d in improving the light path and stray light. I have seen the older sim2 and they were always better then the cheaper alternatives. The one area that I never got to compare when calibrating projectors is the relative performances of these projectors in the same screen and room. Going by memory is difficult and that's why I rely on the reviews here. Thanks again for great reviews. As I mentioned when we met during the THX class in London earlier this year in asia the release dates are almost 3-6 months after the uk. So these reviews are all we have for now here. The optoma hd33 was just launched here a couple if weeks ago and I just saw one in action recently. Will keep a lookout for the sim2 when it finally gets here.
       
      Last edited: Dec 19, 2011
    10. Steve Withers

      Steve Withers
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      Apologies I've been out all day but thanks to Phil, I think he has answered those questions fairly comprehensively.
       
    11. mlang46

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      One of the points I was interested in was since it is a very bright 3 d projector how much can you attenuate the lumen output using the variable iris. If it is perfect for 3d it will blow your eyes away in 2d
       
    12. Steve Withers

      Steve Withers
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      As I mention in the review I had the bulb at its minimum power setting and closed down the iris for 2D viewing but the iris control didn't seem to make a great deal of difference to be honest. Of course how bright the 2D image appears will depend on other factors such as the viewing environment and the size of your screen. Personally I liked the added brightness, partly because I have a reasonably large screen but also because its good to know there is room to play with both in terms of 3D viewing and also as the bulb inevitably dims.
       
    13. mlang46

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      I like the high brightness also but after 20 ft lamberts it becomes uncomfortable and if the 3d glasses attenuate the light by 75 percent and say 20 ft lamberts is how bright you view cinema than in 2 d you would have 80 ft lamberts.

      I am surprised that the Iris did not have much effect if it was placed at the stop position it would adjust light as the square of the change in radius. changing the brightness of the lamp which changes the current going through the filament will change the temperature of the filament and shift the color

      I have owned two Sim projectors and my knock on both of them were they were sharp but not bright enough. the problem with brightness on a single chip is that as you increase the brightness the flicker rate your sensitive to goes up so you will be more sensitive to rainbows.

      I find my eyes are more relaxed when I am watching a 3 chip but you will not get enough brightness from a non DLP 3 chip and you really can't exploit the advantages of a JVC 3 chip unless you put it in a black room.

      money money money
       

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