silver to gold?

Discussion in 'Home Cinema Speakers' started by peggysue, Jan 31, 2009.

  1. peggysue

    peggysue
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    :Dhi people . im wondering if anyone has had a the silver range of speakers and upgraded to the gold? i recently bought a bronze br lcr speaker. my first monitor audio speaker and it sounded great but the tweeter was faulty. i took back to sevenoaks and they were gonna swap it straight over but the look of the silver range caught my eye so i paid extra and left with a new rs lcr and i was stunned at the sound difference. was worth the extra money. now im curious how much difference there is between the silver and gold? is it a big jump? im planning on buying my floorstanders soon but wondered shall i buy the golds (gs20) ......instead of the rs6,s . any advice?
     
  2. jagr

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    The golds are in a totally different league and are worth every penny. They have so much more presence and are remarkably musical. They can take anything you throw at them and just sound out of this world.

    Your problem would be though that you would need to upgrade your centre as well to get the full benefits.

    Golds do take a really long time to bed in and sound as good as they can. One review I read said they can take upto 500Hrs:eek:
     
  3. birdseed

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    I also have listened to the bronzes, then the silver and there was no contest, the silver was markedly better.

    Just to confuse you and offer a diametrically opposite view of the silver vs golds....

    I had the silver 6 and centre, and upgraded to the GR20s and Gold centre.

    I really cant tell the difference, and if I was unlucky enough to be burgled, I wouldnt be buying the gold again. I did change my amp from a harman kardon to an arcam 300 and that was a better improvement.

    However, i bought the Golds off ebay, so I dont know their history before i got my hands on them.
     
  4. peggysue

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    lol 2 different opinions but i reckon if funds allow i will def upgrade to gold..... it seems they would be better run on higher end sources which im planning on upgrading soon too.:D
     
  5. warrior-kid

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    Obviously GR20 and an old Gold Reference centre are not the same thing as GS20 and GSLCR. As I posted elsewhere, I moved RS6 to the sides and upgraded all the front three to GS20+GSLCR. Both are head and shoulders above RS6+RSLCR. The centre is critical for voice in movies and would be the first thing to upgrade. GS20 are great for music and have that clarity that goes far beyond anywhere RS6 could touch. Worth every penny in my opinion.
     
  6. jagr

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    I don't think the OP was comparing the old 'Silver' series speakers but the 'RS' range. Correct me if I am wrong but I thought the 'Silvers' were replaced by the 'Gold Reference' range so are superior quality than the 'RS' speakers?

    The old Silvers were closer but still not in the same league.
     
  7. Dave964

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    When I bought my GS10s I also auditioned silvers (whatever the silver equivalent is).

    I have to say - although there was a difference, I wouldn't say the golds were in a different league. In fact, I didn't really think the golds were £500 better - but since the cost wasn't really an issue at the time, and the golds were better I bought them.

    I confess though that in the time I've owned them, they have impressed me a lot - even though I currently have a different set of speakers plugged in for home demo. And in fact - in my lounge, the difference between the GS10s and the speakers I'm listening to at the moment is much less than I expected. Which is surprising considering the difference in price is very significant.
     
  8. warrior-kid

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    Sorry, Dave, but I'm comparing floorstanders, the like with like, GS20 and RS6. I have both used together and it's easy to compare just by moving them around and flipping the cables. Telling there's no difference is beyond belief, the difference between these floorstanders right here in my home, for these particular ones, is massive.
     
  9. Dave964

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    I didn't say there was no difference. I said that the difference was not that great, and didn't really justify the difference in price.

    And - as with all things hi-fi - it comes down to personal taste and opinion. Which I'm assuming is what the OP was asking for.
     
  10. Knyght_byte

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    There is a step up, but you also need to step up your amp and source to make sure you get the benefit.

    Also there is not a vast difference between the Silver S and Silver RS series. There is a more marked improvement from the older Silver 'i' to Silver S/RS series. Likewise the GR-GS difference is not that amazing either, the main revision was in the tweeter which led to a crisper treble.

    Personally I'd recommend the upgrade, but only expect leaps and bounds if you use similarly leaping and bounding equipment with them. In other words, if you are using an AV amp worth up to £1200 (give or take) then you wont notice so much of a difference. Plop both sets of speakers on an AV amp worth around £2k+ and you should easily hear the difference. Likewise with stereo, there wont be such a noticable difference on something up to £500 for the amp, there should be a difference heard up to £900 and then £900+ the Golds will come in to their own and the Silvers wont sound any better. Source wise it will vary of course depending on what you are listening to in respect to genre, but with CD you will probably want to be spending around £600+ to get the best out of the Golds with £1k+ being the most obvious noticable difference.

    But as said, it all comes down to personal preference, some people cant distinguish past a certain point of quality, my dad still reckons the bathroom radio sounds best to him...lol
     
  11. Canti1982

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    That is very true, I upgraded from some Silver S to Gold R and the difference was quite noticeable. The real big differences come when you are using a far better source and amp.

    Im recently upgraded my source from an Arcam DV78 to a DV139 and the difference was amazing, Im upgrading the amp to an Arcam AVR600 in the next few weeks so hope for more improvements. I certainly dont think I have hit the ceiling of what these speakers are capable of yet :thumbsup:

    Also if you can bi-amp them do it as this made a significant difference to the quality and definition.
     
  12. dean999

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    i would agree with knight byte & canti totally.

    knight byte- my mum is just the same as your dad- she thinks a tatty old mono radio sounds the same:eek:( they are both lucky, no crazy spending on electronics).
     
  13. n.simpson

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    I demoed the Silver and Gold bookshelf speakers and was blown away by the GR10s (I've since traded them in for AE1mk3s but wish I hadn't). Shortly after that my brother nearly bought a Silver series 5.1 system but I suggested GS10 fronts and centre and after listening to them he was blown away too so he bought the GS10s and GS LCR and RS FX.

    I liked my GR10s so much that I recently bought some MA Gold equivalent in-ceiling speakers and I love them.

    Perhaps what impressed me most was just how good the Gold series sounded with fairly modest equipment and they just got better as I upgraded. However, given the differing opinions on offer you really have to demo them for yourself. It seems you'll either love them and will happily part with the cash or will be indifferent, in which case you should save your money unless you are after the piano black finish which I don't believe you can get on the Silver series (at least you couldn't when I bought mine).
     
  14. GYRODEC1

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    Hi guys,

    I'm very much interested in the Monitor Audio GS20's.
    I am using a MF A5cr Pre & Pwr amps with Kef Reference 1:2 Spks. How would the MA GS20's compare against my spks?

    Even though I love the sound of my Kef's I feel I they could sound a bit more faster, exciting and greater clarity.

    I mostly listen to R'n'B, Dance and Pop music.

    Thanks
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2009
  15. GW43

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    I went from Silver S1 to GR10, and the difference was easily worth the money. Still, I got some new end-of-line GR10s and they only cost me £450 against £800 for the GS10 so they were a bit of a steal!
     
  16. tdtm82

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    I'll second that. Amazing voice reproduction on the GSLCR
     
  17. oskarbootie

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    Well, I have just plunked down and brought home a pair of rs6s'. You could say I've gone from nothing to silver.
    I've never posted on a forum so maybe I'm on the wrong thread.
    First impressions right out of the box were "good grief! what 'ave I done? So I opened a bottle of whine and took it slow. When that began to kick in I put on a few familiar disks and sat back. Things soon began to level out. I knew this was a serious step up from what had been used to.
    I'd been quite happy with a mod 2 surround system from Orb Audio. They really are sweet little speakers. But then I got that damn itch. More dynamics please, more soundstage please, better transient response please (whateverthatmeans).
    I like stereo; I like surround but that'll have to wait for now. (how about Sea Change in surround!!! or Talking Heads or early Elton?? I've got them bi-amped to my elite 56txi with certified 16g lamp cord. Any suggestions on that? It's only been a couple of days but if anyone is interested I'd be happy to give an update as they (apparently) break in.
    Cheers from Toronto
     
  18. marscay

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    quite a few ppl actually prefer the GR series to the GS in fact - there's not alot between them @ all either way....they're extremely similar in sound signature.

    one major difference is that the GR series were manufactured in GB whereas the GS are outsourced to Asia - don't automatically assume something is better because it's newer....quite often the reverse is true in audio.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2009
  19. chapeau

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    Excuse what might be a duffer question but only recently got interested in this hifi stuff again after many years.

    Seems to be the advice that if you go from a silver to gold you need to upgrade your amp significantly too. Looking at this in a non-subjective way (my amp sounds better than yours) surely the thing that really matters most is speaker sensitivity and power being delivered by the amp.

    So an GS20 has sensitivity ([email protected]) of 89 dB. What looks like your equivalent silver speaker, RS6, has sensitivity ([email protected]) of 91 dB.

    So to my newbie brain, your GS does indeed need more power to get the same SPL, but in the grand design not a great deal more. If you listen to your RS6 at -30db, you will need to turn the volume up to -28db to get the same sound. Same amp remember, so it 'sounds the same' whatever that means.

    If your amp - any amp - is well within its limits driving your RS6, shouldn't it be well within its limits driving your GS20?
     
  20. marscay

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    don't think of it in terms of power as such, it's more along the lines of better or cleaner amplification to bring the best out of the speakers.... the better quality of speaker the better amplification it deserves really.
     
  21. Dankeech

    Dankeech
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    Hi Chapeau, the GS10's you're looking at getting will be restricted in performance by the AV receiver you're currently using. If you got GS10's and used them with the CA640R you have, you'll get an improvement, and one I'm sure you'll be happy with, but the GS series deserve something more refined. With a better AV receiver, you'll get another jump in performance as it all works of course like a convoy does - held up by slowest vehicle (held back by lowest quality component).

    Not sure if you plan to buy GS10's new, or go 2nd hand like the RS series, but if you go new, you'll be wanting to demo. If you arrange a demo, you could bring your AV receiver and compare against what your dealer has to offer and see if the difference is worth the outlay.

    I'm guessing you may be looking 2nd hand though, so your options will be limited on electronics and will get less chance to try before you buy.

    You're familiar with the MA sound with AVR280 and CA640R. Denon electronics will generally be a bit brighter, that is to say has a bit more treble and a bit sharper, some will like this extra edge, some will find it tiring. Rotel as I understand it is also more forward. NAD is more laid back. Yamaha tends to be more clinical and plenty of detail for movies, but I've never personally enjoyed the musicality myself, each to their own.

    To summarise, you'll get the cosmetic benefit & WAF of the GS10's anyway, and some of the detail improvement whilst not losing a great deal of bass or bottom end. (GS10's apparently have very good quality and extension at the bass end of the spectrum, probably not a world away from the RS6's).

    An upgrade to your AV electronics whether now or in the future can offer you quite a bit more from the GS10's. For now the CA will drive them, but don't be surprised if the sound quality jump isn't as large as you'd hoped when you switch them over.

    I still think an AVR280 would make an ideal purchase, but the chances of getting one brand new are practically nil. The second hand market has a number for sale normally thoug.

    If you're ever down this way again, let me know. You could always bring some kit down and we could swap some bits over and you can see the difference and if it's worth the outlay to partner with GS10's. I'm looking at buying a flat now, with viewings starting in a fortnight. Potentially by summer I'll have a flat wuith a reasonable size lounge so would be able to provide a more comfortable & better room than the demo I provided when you collected the RS series.:thumbsup:
     
  22. chapeau

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    Hi Dan,

    Looks like you worked it all out :)

    Have reserved that Arcam 280 you bumped into so will be able to compare it with my 640r. Will let you know whether it's a real step up for my tin ears :)

    Thanks for your advice,

    Richard
     
  23. Dankeech

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    Not sure how great a demo they'll be able to do for you. Didn't see a demo room and the highest end speakers I saw were the RS6's (No golds spotted I'm afraid). The store didn't seem to be too busy on the Saturday I went, hopefully they'll be able to demo reasonably without background noise.

    I was surprised to spot the AVR280 to be honest, hence the phone call. With the price it is, you may find perhaps you get a comparable sum back or more for your 640R, so may cost you little or nothing for the upgrade - I was going to suggest to check out the trading forums here, but I can see you are already:thumbsup:

    Be interested how you find the AVR280 in your setup assuming you get it.

    Oh, and my pm inbox has a bit of space now:suicide:
     
  24. chapeau

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    Well,

    Eventually got some GS10s and did some really simple direct comparisons with the RS6s using the CA 640r. Just to get it out of the way they look a lot better to the mrs :)

    After some listening I would agree that the GS10s are quite a bit better than the RS6s and the 640R is quite capable of drawing that out. I am not quite as eloquent as some of the people who post on here and provide excellent reviews. However I would sort of say the bass does not go quite as 'deep' on the GS10s, but sounds better when you can hear it. I guess that is why you can buy subwoofers. The mid range and treble are quite a lot clearer and the soundstage is a lot more obvious.

    Well, that really tested my power of creative writing :D

    I will test them all against an AVR280 when I get the time, and report back!
     
  25. kidloco46

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    They sound great when hooked up to the AVR280, just make sure you bi-amp them (thats is your not using the full 7.1), it makes a very noticable improvement.
     
  26. chapeau

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    Yes, have been wondering about that. Certainly there is a lot of positive comment on bi-amping but I'd have thought the biggest benefits come theoretically when the crossover is set in the amp. From what I can see in the 280 manual you cannot set the crossover when bi-amping. You can only set a crossover when setting up the subwoofer.

    But the proof of the pudding is in the eating so I shall listen for myself :)

    And I'd hate anybody to think they don't sound great with the 640R, because they do. Just putting that in for subsequent searches - I know I did enough!
     
  27. BlueWizard

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    I'm not quite clear on what you intend to do. Are simply going to upgrade the CENTER speaker from Silver to Gold?

    The leap in cost from Silver to Gold is not small, not small at all.

    Personally, I would consider upgrading the front left/right speakers to decent MA Silvers, that would make much bigger improvement than merely upgrading the Center to Gold.

    You are planning to spend OVER £500 on a new Center, but for just under £500, you can have the Silver RS5 and for just over £600, you can have the even larger RS6.

    Keep in mind that the upgrade never ends. If Gold is so much better than Silver, then why not go to Platinum? The Platinum Center is only £2500. Seems a bargain for that great quality.

    By the way, did you actually give us the model of your front speakers? You started out with Bronze, but what Bronze? And are you still using Bronze for the left and Right? BR2? BR5? BR6?

    Perhaps, there is something I missed; I confess I scanned the thread very quickly, but are you planning to upgrade just the center or the whole front end?

    Steve/bluewizard
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2009
  28. chapeau

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    Have given this some further thought using my rather ancient knowledge of how speakers/amps work and what happens in resistors/capacitors/inductors in general when electrons are flowing.

    The AVR280 doesn't have a crossover so all channels are amping the whole frequency range when bi-amping so no benefit there. When single and bi amping, all frequencies are presented to the binding posts on the back of the speaker.

    When single amping, the speaker's passive crossovers are in parallel and so the high/low filters act to pass low frequencies to the bass driver and high frequencies to the tweeter. All available power has a low impedance route through the parallel crossovers and is so passed through to and used by the driver units and none is wasted (well, assuming 100% efficiency but I digress)

    When bi amping and so the speaker terminal connector is not present, the passive crossovers are separate units and do not 'see' each other. So any electrical energy that cannot pass through the crossover due to it its frequency has nowhere else to go. The high pass filter blocks the low frequencies and as this energy canot be used anywhere else it is turned into heat in the crossover.

    The low pass filter blocks the high frequencies and as this electrical energy has nowhere else to go it is turned into heat in the crossover.

    So all bi-amping is doing is increasing your electricity bill and turning your speakers into a component of your central heating system. I fail to see how biamping can improve sound quality in a system comprised of AVR280 and GS10s :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2009
  29. Dankeech

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    With bi-amping, your speakers will have more reserve power available and for decent speakers this shows itself in better control of bass and for some reason seems a bit cleaner on top end. Maybe its about doubling the ability of the receivers ability to throw out power in a short go for bass, I'm not sure. Maybe try it without laying the extra wire under the floor. If you notice the difference, lay the extra cables. For me it made the difference and was quite clear. I agree its strange on the theory though.
     
  30. Member 96948

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    Actually, that's not quite correct, although you're quite right about the improvements it can bring. Chapeau appears to have missed the point slightly too.

    When bi-amping, no extra power is really available or at least not enough to make a significant difference at any rate. Amplifiers simply amplify the voltage of a signal - it's the impedance of the speakers that draws the current, thus if a crossover blocks the low frequency content to the tweeter, that current simply isn't drawn to be lost as heat. The mid/bass unit is the heaviest user of the available current and thus it's this driver that will cause the amplifier to hit it's limits first. The extra power made available to the mid/bass driver by hiving off the tweeter to another amplifier is relatively minimal in comparison - You'll gain an extra dB or so of output at best.

    Where the difference is really made is in the upper mid and treble. Reproducing bass is a current heavy job that inevitably introduces a lot of distortion into the process which of course is not restricted to bass frequencies and therefore affects the reproduction of higher frequencies. When bi-amping, you hand the duty of the upper mid and treble reproduction over to an amplifier that isn't having to supply the lower frequencies, damp back EMFs from a the heavy bass driver, or work anywhere near it's limits.

    Simply put, the tweeter has been isolated and it's output is superior because if it. It'll sound cleaner at all volumes which will tend to give the impression of more power being on tap, but it's the fact that it sounds better that is important.

    Of course, there are issues regarding the capabilities of (especially cheaper) receiver's power supplies and exactly how isolated the amplifiers are from each other but IMHO, bi-amping is unlikely to sound worse and can offer significant improvements.

    Russell
     

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