Sealed Subs vs Ported Subs

Quorra

Member
That's about half what I paid!
That is the price for 1 pb16 .. normally they are 2499 new each .. but during this sale if there are any no damage outlet ones .. they will be discounted to 1999 each
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
That is the price for 1 pb16 .. normally they are 2499 new each .. but during this sale if there are any no damage outlet ones .. they will be discounted to 1999 each
Pb16 output down low under 16hz turns me off a slight bit. But it all depend if you are short on output in the middle of the curve

I assume if you are buying subs at this level you will be eqing them flat so the extra output might not be needed
 

DodgeTheViper

Moderator
I’ve a feeling I ‘may’ stick with Sealed but there’s nothing with U.K. availability that’s really pulling me in. Maybe the ‘next thing’ is coming along :D
 

dts197

Distinguished Member
A pair of these, job done!
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
I’ve a feeling I ‘may’ stick with Sealed but there’s nothing with U.K. availability that’s really pulling me in. Maybe the ‘next thing’ is coming along :D
If your rew sweep is good, see no reason to upgrade mate !
 

Conrad

Moderator
That's surprising. What do you listen to that plays below 16Hz?
Movies.

But those measurements are outdoor 2m ground plane, so you'll get more in room, but how much more depends on placement and room size. It's ported, so not huge amounts.
 

Mr Wolf

Active Member
Movies.

But those measurements are outdoor 2m ground plane, so you'll get more in room, but how much more depends on placement and room size. It's ported, so not huge amounts.
OK, but that content would surely only be a tiny proportion of the LFE content of a tiny proportion of movies. I expect you could probably count the movies scenes on one hand that play below 16Hz, not least because Dolby Atmos commercial cinema installations are only specified to have to play down to 31.5Hz @ -3dB.
 

Conrad

Moderator
OK, but that content would surely only be a tiny proportion of the LFE content of a tiny proportion of movies. I expect you could probably count the movies scenes on one hand that play below 16Hz, not least because Dolby Atmos commercial cinema installations are only specified to have to play down to 31.5Hz @ -3dB.
I think most of the people concerned with UULF are using BEQ to "recover" content. If you're using that then it's definitely worth it. It's also why people have transducers that operate to 10Hz and under, and why people build hoverboss solutions. It's why I care about a <10Hz response.

BEQ tends to then become more of a philosophical debate about whether using it is right or not. I'm not here to convince anyone to use it, but I use it and I find it adds to the whole experience rather than detracts.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
Dodge, any reason why you wouldn’t consider a transducer?

I was against it as having tried and tested before, the sensation never felt natural. It had a mechanical feel to it, but this was before I understood what I was doing.

In my room now, you simply can’t tell the difference between my subs shaking the chair or my quake. I’ve managed to integrate them seamlessly. There is no way any sub will produce the tactile response I am now getting.

Put it this way, I visited Arrow-AV’s demo room yesterday where he had around 16 stacked subs. The bass was incredible, but the lack of tactile response made it feel like something was missing.

As far as my room goes and the money I’ve spent on equipment (and I’ve spent a lot!), the quake is one of the best upgrades I’ve added to my room and certainly the best bang for buck.

I know @steelman1991 feels exactly the same way.
 

Conrad

Moderator
There is no way any sub will produce the tactile response I am now getting.
A suspended floor is your friend here. You won't get it on concrete I completely agree, but on joists you can. But that doesn't suit everyone of course. And bang for buck, absolutely the transducers take it.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
A suspended floor is your friend here. You won't get it on concrete I completely agree, but on joists you can. But that doesn't suit everyone of course. And bang for buck, absolutely the transducers take it.
The crazy thing is the quake is only running at around 20-30% power, if it much higher I’d be rattling the fillings out of my teeth!!
 

Conrad

Moderator
That's always been my issue with them. I reckon lots of people have them turned right up and it's more like a fairground ride, that's not what I'm looking for.

Obviously that's a huge, sweeping generalisation and I could be waaaay off.

It sounds like you have it dialed in slightly more delicately which seems to me to be the right approach. I had to turn my subs down as they were vibrating the floor too much, now it's much more realistic. I aim for what it feels like when a large lorry goes past, close - not being on a bridge in high wind or going over a cattle grid.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
That's always been my issue with them. I reckon lots of people have them turned right up and it's more like a fairground ride, that's not what I'm looking for.

Obviously that's a huge, sweeping generalisation and I could be waaaay off.

It sounds like you have it dialed in slightly more delicately which seems to me to be the right approach. I had to turn my subs down as they were vibrating the floor too much, now it's much more realistic. I aim for what it feels like when a large lorry goes past, close - not being on a bridge in high wind or going over a cattle grid.
I agree with this, you have to get the setting right so it doesn’t always draw attention to itself and just adds to the experience. I played about with slopes, crossovers, timing and gain until I was happy. I still have to turn it off if I’m watching something like Bohemian Rhapsody as the quake can’t keep up with my subs for these sorts of bass notes, but for everything else it’s awesome.

the other thing I did was bolt my seats to a platform and then sit the quake on the platform and not directly to the seats, this gives me a much more even spread across the 3 seats and removes any form of localisation.
 

MI55ION

Distinguished Member
Dodge, any reason why you wouldn’t consider a transducer?

I was against it as having tried and tested before, the sensation never felt natural. It had a mechanical feel to it, but this was before I understood what I was doing.

In my room now, you simply can’t tell the difference between my subs shaking the chair or my quake. I’ve managed to integrate them seamlessly. There is no way any sub will produce the tactile response I am now getting.

Put it this way, I visited Arrow-AV’s demo room yesterday where he had around 16 stacked subs. The bass was incredible, but the lack of tactile response made it feel like something was missing.

As far as my room goes and the money I’ve spent on equipment (and I’ve spent a lot!), the quake is one of the best upgrades I’ve added to my room and certainly the best bang for buck.

I know @steelman1991 feels exactly the same way.

Having a deja vu moment::D

Do all Ported Subs fart ?

A suspended floor is your friend here. You won't get it on concrete I completely agree, but on joists you can. But that doesn't suit everyone of course. And bang for buck, absolutely the transducers take it.

Agree. It's one of the reasons why risers and platforms are often employed in multi sub systems across the pond. They then build the BOSS system into them or attach transducers such as Buttkicker, Earthquake, Crowson et al. On suspended floors you can get the same effect with enough output at ULF region, just means generally a lot of subs must be employed.

With transducers, as with subs, the key is seamless integration. Even now I'm about 90% of the way there, I've still got some fine tuning to do on my combined HoverBOSS, Transducer & sub system.
 

DodgeTheViper

Moderator
Dodge, any reason why you wouldn’t consider a transducer?
It's really just for the reasons that you've mentioned yourself. It just appears to be false and I don't want that kind of feeling. Plus, I don't fancy spending a lot of time attempting to get it just right. It just doesn't appeal to me tbh.
 

MI55ION

Distinguished Member
It's really just for the reasons that you've mentioned yourself. It just appears to be false and I don't want that kind of feeling. Plus, I don't fancy spending a lot of time attempting to get it just right. It just doesn't appeal to me tbh.

Get in touch with Chris @AmericanAudio, recently had a demo of my system and I think he'll attest it's anything but "false". In fact he seemed interested in building one for himself. Dialing it in properly is a must and I can see why that might of off-putting but for someone familiar with REW and setting up subs it isn't that much of a stretch. :)
 

DodgeTheViper

Moderator
Get in touch with Chris @AmericanAudio, recently had a demo of my system and I think he'll attest it's anything but "false". In fact he seemed interested in building one for himself. Dialing it in properly is a must and I can see why that might of off-putting but for someone familiar with REW and setting up subs it isn't that much of a stretch. :)
I hear what you're saying. The other thing is, I don't fancy bolting stuff to my lovely leather reclining sofa and hiding even more cables. It's not a carpeted floor but a big rug.

Yeah I know, I'm putting excuses in the way :D
 

MI55ION

Distinguished Member
Dodge, I think you really need to get that demo of a proper tactile system, @mb3195, @Conrad or even mine. If you do, guaranteed we'll see a thread pop in the DIY section and you'll become a frequent contributor to the BEQ thread! ;):D
 

DodgeTheViper

Moderator
Dodge, I think you really need to get that demo of a proper tactile system, @mb3195, @Conrad or even mine. If you do, guaranteed we'll see a thread pop in the DIY section and you'll become a frequent contributor to the BEQ thread! ;):D
How dare you say I'll be posting in the BEQ thread :laugh:
 

MI55ION

Distinguished Member
Although anecdotal, this might be relevant. Had a mate with an insanely good sub system get in touch about 6 months ago. Wanted to know what he could do to improve the bass in his system and suggested spending a fortune on fancy power cables. I gave him a few virtual slaps across Whatsapp and introduced him to the miniDSP and BEQ. He's not been normal ever since! :D
 

Furnace Inferno

Well-known Member
Personally I can’t say I’m interested in tactile during movies, I put it in the D-Box motion and 4-D categories, a fun gimmick but not something I expect when watching a movie.

But when it comes to my racing simulator that’s a different story, I’ve got the full complement of tactile, motion and simulated g-force because that is what my brain expects to feel to match reality.

Perhaps if movies go the VR route in the future I’d be all for it but watching on a flatscreen it’s just not for me as tactile from sound pressure/waves hitting you has a completely different feel to me compared to bass shakers vibrating what you are sat on.
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
I’d be all for it but watching on a flatscreen it’s just not for me as tactile from sound pressure/waves hitting you has a completely different feel to me compared to bass shakers vibrating what you are sat on.
I do see your point, I had a full on racing rig up until last year, VR, motion platform, etc, and yeah the level of immersion is insanely accurate to real life.

However, my bass shaker doesn’t feel any different than my subs, they are just able to generate more movement right down the bottom end. My subs are capable down to 10hz, but they don’t move the seat enough until your going up towards 30hz and beyond.

My quake has a crossover of 35hz, the seamless integration means you can’t tell what is moving the seats, the quake or my subs, it’s certainly not a fairground ride, it just adds to the effect.

Up until I integrated them myself, I had exactly the same viewpoint as you, I’d be pretty sure you’d change your mind if you sat in my room.

I’ll tag in @Apollo as I know he was very skeptical about me installing them, whereas now he feel completely different.

Bare in mind, my room is completely dedicated to films, with literally no compromise for immersion. I wouldn’t want one in my lounge that’s for sure!! 😆
 

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