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Sanyo Z1 owners. Do you have Vertical Banding?

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by jtorry, Apr 16, 2003.

  1. jtorry

    jtorry
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    Hi just want to know how many Z1 owners out there have Vertical Banding and here from those that don't.

    My Z1 has just been returned after a repair still with VB yet on the delivery note it says repaired so I need to know if this is on all units.
     
  2. Underscore

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    I did have but tried turning it off at the back each time and I no longer seems to suffer. However, I did change from DVD player (S-video and component) to 1:1 mapped HTPC at the same time, so I don't know which caused the improvement. Last night I didn't turn it off at the back, so I will see whether the VB comes back...

    _
     
  3. Spacecat

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    VB banding is INHERENT part of LCD technology, particularly in the lower budget end of the market.

    You can minimise the efect by a slight de focus and the use of an HTPC also makes a very large difference, some people have suggested a flicker tweak if available.

    However it will not be possible to eliminate completely as it is in BUILT in !!
     
  4. severnsource

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    Not seen vertical banding on my Z1.

    Line pairing, screen door, not quite right colour tracking & colourimetry, not quite black enough blacks, yes; VB no.

    Spacecat, could you explain why vertical banding is an inherent part of LCD technology. I can see why you get screen door and most of the other artifacts, but vertical banding has always seemed an odd effect to me. Its certainly not an effect that I have ever seen on large LCD panels, which I would have thought would be more prone to the problem.

    Bill
     
  5. Gordon @ Convergent AV

    Gordon @ Convergent AV
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    Verical banding is usually caused by the digital video rocessing inside the device, combined with non-optimum settting of contrast and brightness controls. This is one of the reasons it disappears or becomes less noticeable when folk use 1:1 mapping from calibrated HTPC's

    Gordon
     
  6. Spacecat

    Spacecat
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    according to Toshiba VB is the wires in the LCD panel!!

    it can be reduced and in many circumstances practically eliminated but in certain scenes it will be visible, especially
    smokey scenes and one colour sky scenes.
    Is is also referred to as the 'dirty lcd ' effect and has been reported on the SONY VHWT12.
     
  7. theritz

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    Spacecat,

    This quote arose in another thread and was promptly de-bunked - see your own threadhere for details.

    Vertical banding has nothing to do with the "wires in the LCD panel" - this refers to what is commonly referred to as screendoor. Vertical banding is virtually eliminated by 1:1 pixel matching by HCPC in most cases, as it relates to voltage/phase issues in the lcd panel although some PJs are affected by it to such an extent that it can't be eliminated completely.

    Sean G.
     
  8. Spacecat

    Spacecat
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    The RITZ

    I never said that VB was definitely caused by wires in the LCD panel but that is what a TOSHIBA technician told me.

    All I know is that it is a common problem across many LCD projectors(esp cheaper ones) and has been reported on hi end ones as well see Audio Enz review of the SONY VHWT12

    As i have reported HTPC does minimise this quite a lot and it can be reduced.
    From reports I have read the AE300, Z1 and the HS10 have all been reported to have this issue to a greater or lesser degree
     
  9. -Jay-

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    Hi sorry to butt in i'm new to all this pj stuff, i was going to get a z1 but am now getting put off by all this VB talk.
    I will be useing it for xbox & dvds i have no p/scan so am i going to get all these VB on my screen.

    what is (HTPC) like i say i'm new to this so no taking the p*ss:laugh:
     
  10. Bristol Pete

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    Mate. Dont worry about the vertical banding problem. Order from www.nexnix.co.uk and they will do a dead pixel check and have a good look at the PJ before selling you it.

    I spoke to Ross at Nexnix yesterday, and he told me that he was yet to see a Z1 with the alleged VB problem and he shifts quite a few of them.

    HTPC. 'Home theatre personal computer :lesson: ' (I think). Basically, a good spec PC, using a software based DVD player, i.e Power DVD and a good graphics card with outputs such as s-video and DVI as well as a good sound card??

    I understand that using a tool called powerstrip, you can effectively map the DVD image pixel to pixel, which in theory should surpass a standard DVD deck for detail etc.

    Not 100% sure, but I hope that this helps.

    Regards,

    Captain Benefit
     
  11. -Jay-

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    Captain Benefit

    Cheers mate thats very helpful, at the end of the day i may as well just get one & if it has a problem i'll cross that bridge when i come to it:)
     
  12. Spacecat

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    Vb can be practically eliminated from a pj , however if you want to see what it looks like , play the Spiderman DVD , use the scene when spiderman is coming round after being drugged by the goblin on the roof, lots of smoke is apparent , if you look at the smoke you will see VBs if your projector has them.
    Many people do not notice this at all , but once you see it you will always be aware of it.

    HTPC is the best way to reduce/eliminate this issue.

    PS I doubt any retailer is going to Admit to loads of people seeing VBs on their PJs!!:p
     
  13. -Jay-

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    Shock horror :eek:
    You mean to tell me retailers are not honest folk? well i never;)
     
  14. adieacc

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    Sorry to go off topic a little bit, but i have a Z1 inputing through 963 (component) and NTL (S-vid) with the dvd player i get three light blue vertical bands (each approx 1inch wide) down the left hand side of the screen, which are only really noticable on very dark or very light scenes. Has any one got any ideas why? As it is not really noticable with S-vid, my initial thoughts were that it might be because of the fan-out heating the component cable? Or would this not make any difference?

    Thanks for any suggestions
     
  15. 337GUS

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  16. Smurfin

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    I know this thread is quite old now, but having switched on my PJ for the first time in ages the other day (not watched many movies lately), I noticed vertical banding for the first time, and it was quite bad.

    I've had my projector almost 7 months (I think), and I've run up over 250 hours on it.

    Tried the setting above (actually I changed mine from 157 to 140) and WOW, what a difference. Pleased with it all over again :)
     
  17. ROne

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    I spent ages messing with Vertical Banding on the Z1, because it was the one artifact between me and the picture.

    I found that service item no. 14 (I believe the green flicker.) could reduce a great percentage, but it's not without a trade off, if you decrease too much you alter the white balance and increase the combing effect on moving objects.

    The other things that has been observed by another user was that if you leave in stand-by mode for a prolonged period of time the VB is much worse, I was sceptical but it's true.

    If you completely turn the Z1 off the VB remains at your last setting. So best combo is to set-up VB using the item.14 tweak and then turn off the Z1 at the power once finished.

    I am just waiting for my smartIII system now.
     
  18. Smurfin

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    I think thats what I experienced, my Z1 is on standby permanently (i.e for 7 months). It's only after hardly using it for a month, that switching it on the other day revealed the problem.

    Happy now though, tis all sorted:D
     
  19. Crocodile JD

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    Does anyone know for sure what parameter 14 is? ROne believed it to be the green flicker. What is the service menu description of green flicker likely to be. The reason I ask is because I wanted to try the same tweak on my PLV 30, but the index in the service menu might well be different.

    Crocodile JD
     
  20. ROne

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    I'm pretty sure someone published PLV30 service manual settings on here a few months ago.

    They may be similar.
     
  21. Crocodile JD

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    Hi ROne

    They did and I have it, but by description rather than number, what is the parameter that you altered to reduce VB? It's just that I need to be sure that I'm messing with the right one.:smashin:

    Crocodile JD
     

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