Samsung LCDs vs Plasma for gaming.

Discussion in 'What Is The Best TV For You?' started by Nalien, Feb 12, 2009.

  1. Nalien

    Nalien
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    First of since this is my first post on these boards , hi~


    Next to my actual problem , I've been looking to get a new TV which I'll mainly use for gaming , secondly for watching Anime and HD content.


    Now I've heard about 'input lag' with Plasma TVs when it comes to gaming , how much is behind this statement and will it noticably affect my experience ?


    I've pretty much narrowed my choices down to Samsung PS-50A756 vs Samsung LE46A786 , which would be better for overall picture quality and if it's the 46" , would it be a big difference to the Plasma ?

    As I'd kind of like having a bigger TV without spending too much on it.
    It's these two mainly because of the , what I think to be , decent picture quality and because of the design.

    I'd rather stick to these two if possible since the crystal frame appeals to me and I'd like something that'll play a big part in my environment to look decent.


    Also another factor , since I'd leave it running alot , how would the power usage compare between the LCD and Plasma when gaming ?
    If it's something outrageous I'd probably go with the LCD as well.


    Thanks in advance~
     
  2. Monarch

    Monarch
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    I don't think the power useage difference would be to huge between the two at 50", I haven't seen much on either though. And the choice between LCD and Plasma is a tough one, to be honest it's all about comprimise. The plasma will have better blacks, smoother motion and better colour reproduction, the LCD will have better whites (although plasma whites are fine), possibly better slow motion, not sure on these sets though and of course, the main plasma downfall is IR, which I don't know a lot about on this Samsung, I do know that Samsung aren't the best for IR. No permanent damage should come up though.

    If you get the plasma then just do a lot of research before hand, look at peoples experiences of IR (which will be the main concern) on that set, you should be ok, but it could be bad in the early days of its life, so take it easy on the gaming front until you've got some SD material through it. I use the LG 32PG6000 for gaming and it had IR in the early days (it's still new) but it's dramatically improved since and there's a lot more improvement to come from what I've read. I prefer plasma, even for gaming, others think otherwise. How long will a gaming sessions last? and how many different games do you play? (examples of games too)
     
  3. ziffius

    ziffius
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    The plasma will use more, but all depends on the settings. I have a LE32A456 and it uses as little 69 watts in high energy saving mode, but can double if you turn the energy saving off and really crank the backlight up.
     
  4. Nalien

    Nalien
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    Does the image saving noticably decrease picture quality ?

    What exactly is IR ? I only know at as infra red and can't really create any connection between TVs and this IR .
    Also what does this have to do with playing SD material first ?

    I'm mainly playing Final Fantasy XI and Stepmania , I tend to just leave FFXI run so the times vary greatly from as little as an hour to 6-8 on a day off.

    I sometimes play the newer games but not really alot and only every so many months.

    Also , does anyone have experience with the KDL52-W4000 ? It greatly dropped in price but the contrast ratio appears to be alot lower with only 33000:1 and it seems to lack 100 Hz.
    How would this compare to the Samsungs which are at least said to have 1M:1 and 2M:1 contrasts + 100 Hz.


    Thanks again~
     
  5. Suave

    Suave
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    Hi,

    The Samsung Plasma you have mentioned has got some fantastic reviews from some pretty tough reviewers - it excelled in nearly every possible area - only problem is they are hard to get a hold of since only Dixons sell it as far as I know and it is not cheap!

    Suave!
     
  6. ziffius

    ziffius
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    IR is imagine retention. It's where a partial imagine of what was displayed on the screeen previously is still visibile. Normally happens with games that static parts of the screen such has HUDs, or the start bar/ wallpaper if used with a PC.

    Generally clears after a few hours, and you can help it by tuning the TV into an untuned analogue channel, so all you see is 'snow' on the screen.

    The higher end Plasmas shift the pixels slightly to try to avoid this. People say this doesn't effect the quality. You normally need to worry about it on the LCD, but some people do find LCD's that are 2+ years old suffer from it just as much as the plasmas.

    If I were going to buy a Plasma I would go the Panasonic route, but for LCD I would go for Samsung.

    Ignore the 1M and 2M contrast ratio's. For gaming you need to turn the LED local dimming off as the TV needs to buffer frames to calculate which LEDs to dimm and hence introducing a delay, so it will be the same as any other LCD. For anime though it should look fantastic.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2009
  7. Nalien

    Nalien
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    Getting either of these is no problem , a shop sells the Plasma for 1400 Euro (~1800 USD) which is rather cheap for a TV this size.


    How noticable is the image burn and how long would I have to leave it on for it to occur ?

    A friend has an older Samsung Plasma and it suffers from this alot , I read this improved by now and I'd have to leave the same screen for days but I can't really find anything explicit on this sadly.

    I'd rather stick to these Samsungs or maybe the Sony but it seems to be lacking compared to these 2 ... it'll be sort of an accessory in the room and I really don't like the looks of most other flat panels.

    I'm leaning towards the 756 Plasma atm since I can't really find anything bad in reviews about it. Who actually cares about the Wifi ...
     
  8. Monarch

    Monarch
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    As said above IR is basically when an image which stays in the same place on the screen for a long time stays after the image dissapears, obviously, the longer it stays on and the brighter the colours compared to the background, the more you will see it. My LG 32PG6000 suffers a bit, but it improves over time (which is why playing freeview, with no static images) for a while before gaming helps, this gets it past the initial 'burn in prone' stage. You shouldn't get anything permanent, any IR that you get should just wash out by watching regular TV for 10 minutes or so (depending on how bad it is). For plasmas Panasonics are very resistant to IR so they're the best to go for if you use it for long gaming sessions. The Samsung is good though, not as resistant to IR though, which is the main concern for plasmas with gaming. Bare in mind as well that these images which does temporarily stay on the screen are only visible if you look for it on a completely black screen from close up, and as soon as there's something on the screen you can't see it.

    The Sony you mentioned is very good though, it's one of the top LCDs you can buy. Pay no attention to contrast ratios unless you're comparing TVs made by the same brand though, it's a marketing ploy, contrast ratios are vital but you can't tell how good it is by the specs. 100Hz also does very little difference in my opinion, especially if the set handles motion well anyway, which the W4000s do. The blacks, motion and colours wont be as good on any LCD though compared to the plasma.

    To reduce IR I would just say to switch to regular TV every hour or so if you go for a long gaming session (if there's static imags on screen, I'm not familiar with the FF series so I can't really say) and don't game for too long in the sets early days, look out for it when you do game as well. Do a lot of reading on IR as well so you know all about it.

    Personally I prefer plasmas, I think the risk of IR is worth the better blacks, colours and motion, as well as other things. The Panasonics are resistant to IR and have a brilliant picture in SD and HD, I would say go for the PX/PZ80's though instead of the 70's.
     
  9. ziffius

    ziffius
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  10. Monarch

    Monarch
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    750?! is that an example of them showing the power use when every pixel is lit? that's a common thing to happen.

    I'll give you and example of how ambiguous this can be, Some people are measuring more than the quoted amounts on some sets (mainly Panasonics) however, on the LG 32PG6000 there is a quoted power useage of 230 Watts (about 100 more than the LCD equivalents) however, when tests have been done most people come out around 125-150, similar to the LCDs, some people even came out below 100Watts (as low as 75) so it's all on what you watch with plasmas
     
  11. bigjohn

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    I've measured the power consumption on my LG 32PG6000

    55w with very dark picture
    183w with almost all white picture
    130w with average picture

    J..
     
  12. Monarch

    Monarch
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    There we go, much lower than the quoted consumption, some people with Pannys quoted at 335Watts have recorded measurements as high as 400Watts, I'm yet to see a PG6000 owner whos recorded higher than 230 though
     
  13. ziffius

    ziffius
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    It's the rated i.e the maximum that it consumes, but it's still a scary amount. If you go into Comet/ Currys you will notice the Samsung plasmas put out a lot more heat than the Panasonics or LG's = wasted energy.

    Even still, LCDs are still known to use a lot less power than Plasmas. HDTVtest do now measure them, both at default settings and once calibrated.

    50" PZ800

    Default Average 449 watts
    Calibrated Average 314 watts

    55" A956

    Default 208 watts
    Calibrated 121 watts

    60" PG7000

    Default 532 watts (average)
    Calibrated 320 watts (average)

    Wether or not it actually matters to you depends on how much you use it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2009
  14. Monarch

    Monarch
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    Yes, I've also read though (in several places) that as the screen gets bigger plasmas close in and eventually become more efficient. All of this depends on its use though
     
  15. Nalien

    Nalien
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    Ok then hopefully the last thing still unclear to me about this , still heavily leaning towards the Plasma so far.

    How is the input lag ? I read Plasmas are overall slower than LCDs and the W4000 really excells at this with reaction times of 0~10ms while on the PC (at least according to a review , after properly set up).

    Other TVs are said to have noticable lag when plugged into a PC , eg you see the windows follow slower than you drag them around , not alot but visible.


    The 750 Watt power consumption appears to be for the 63" version of this TV , the 50" seems to run at 550 Watt peak , so I guess that'll be fine if it's just the max consumption and not fulltime.
    Especially when looking at this:

    As for FFXI , the only 'static' image in the game is the chat log , which disappears as you leave it idle for a few seconds , everything else is in motion at all times , even if just slightly.
     
  16. Monarch

    Monarch
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    I haven't noticed any input lag on either of my plasmas, it's fine
     
  17. ziffius

    ziffius
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    Normally around 30ms or below is fine. Might be worth checking the manual to see if the Samsung has a game mode which should reduce the lag.
     
  18. Nalien

    Nalien
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    Going for the 756 Plasma then.

    Thanks again to everyone who helped me figure this out.
     
  19. Monarch

    Monarch
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    you'll enjoy it, in my opinion the Panasonic plasmas are the best sets you can get for the money, Pioneer plasmas are better but will cost you your arm, leg and house and of course they're closing down so you wont get any guarantee or anything. Pannys are pretty flawless though
     

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