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Samsung LCD rear projection TV's

Discussion in 'Televisions' started by 38H21543, Jan 6, 2004.

  1. 38H21543

    38H21543
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    Have been looking into plasmas, LCD and rear projection TV for everyday family lounge use. (Analogue aerial and digital NTLcable TV, and basic DVD/VCR at the moment)
    I have not seen a 30 inch LCD looking good yet showing 'general' tv.
    I have not ruled out plasma, but have seen considerable 'burnt in' sky captions on a local showroom display Hitachi, so it may be too vulnerable for our everyday use.
    Rear projection seems to offer some benefits that may suit our useage, although reading this forum obviously highlights some weaknesses as well.
    Reasonable viewing angle, and size not too huge are important, so I am currently ruling out CRT rear projection, and am interested in LCD and DLP as follows:
    LG RE-44SZ20RD (DLP 1024*576)
    Samsung SP43J6HDX (?maybe single LCD)
    Samsung SP43L2HX (Tri LCD 1280*720))
    Samsung SP 46L5HX (Tri LCD 1280*720)

    I am favouring the SP43L2HX on performance/value criteria. Does anyone own, or have real experience of, any of these sets to give advice? Thanks.
     
  2. bongpig

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    Well, ive been looking at the Samsung LCD rptv youve mentioned and the LG DLP set for a while now.
    Had another chance to actually see them both side by side today, and was impressed by both.

    One thing I have found, is in all showrooms where they demo the LG, the Contrast & Brightness are nearly always set to 90-100%.
    Only up there does it compete with the screens around it.

    Today, it needed to be set very high to compare to the Samsung which was set at a nice 50-60%

    This worries me about the LG a bit. Having the B&C set so high cant be good for the set.

    The Samsung is just starting to edge it for me.
     
  3. 38H21543

    38H21543
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    bongpig, I was in a Comet recently with both models, and I thought they looked easily the best of the RPTV's on display showing terestial tv.
    Can anyone suggest any other sites to get opinions and reviews of these particular (European) products?

    They don't seem to be distributed in the US, but are on the manufacturers EU sites. Interestingly, the Samsung UK web site doesn't list them and they haven't come up with any brochures yet. Is this supposed to be telling me something?
     
  4. LV426

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    The Samsung UK website is dreadful - the main product list hasn't been updated for over a year - who knows why? I have sent them a feedback mail. A thank you response, but no result. Strange.

    In the US the predisposition is towards HDTV devices - not something that exists to any commercial extent in Europe, so models are likely to differ. However, I have seen, on display in places like Circuit City, LCD HDTV RPTVs.

    On a fixed panel device (eg LCD or DLP) high contrast settings do absolutely NO damage so it isn't anything to worry about. LCD and DLP panels cannot be 'over-driven' in the same way as phosphor based (Plasma, CRT) can and don't suffer phosphor burn because they don't use phosphors.

    LCD and DLP advantages over CRT: Lack of visible scanline structure; perfect geometry; perfect stability; perfect (or near-perfect) convergence that doesn't drift.

    LCD advantage over CRT; no visible refresh rate flicker

    DLP advantage over LCD; better contrast (blacker blacks)

    LCD advantage over DLP; no 'rainbows'.
     
  5. bonzobanana

    bonzobanana
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    Samsung uk are a total bunch of pillocks. They often get information wrong and simply don't understand what they are selling. I had to explain to them what progressive scan was and gave them links to read to explain it to them. My Samsung HTDM150 (same as HTDM140) was advertised by them as progressive scan and despite me telling them at least three times it doesn't have progressive scan about six months ago they still haven't changed it. It doesn't even have component out for a start. Its even still there! The model has been replaced ages ago.

    http://www.samsung.co.uk/cgi-bin/ec...adckgglgmllcfekcefedffgdfmh.0&prod_id=HTDM140
     
  6. bongpig

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    38H21543, ive found some info regards this TV on the Samsung US website. These new LCD RPTV sets use something called 'Digital Natural Image engine' ( DNle ) which Samsung is using in all its quality TV sets.

    You can get info about it here:-
    http://www.samsung.com/Products/TV/DNIe/DNIe_tech_01.html

    If you go to the 'Products equiped with DNle' section ( button at the top ) and then to 'Projection TV', you will find the model we are discussing there. 43L2.

    As you can see, the specs of all the sets seem the same, expect screen size. I still dont know whats the difference wetween the L2 sets and the L5. The samsung main product page:-
    http://www.samsung.com/Products/TV/ProjectionTV/index.htm
    ...only has info on the L5 range. Maybe the L5 are 3panel and the L2 only 1panel?

    Anyway, this DNle system is awsome. I agree, all other LCD RP screens ( apart from the XBR sony's ) have crappy dark/light contrast and fast motion problems, but not this baby.
    I sat watching the beast for over an hour, looking at an asortment of stuff, including some pretty damn fast moving scenes, and it looked lovely. No rips in the screen at all. ( at least none I could see ). It looked easily as vibrant as the best plasmas on display.


    nigel,
    Regards the LG having its brightness set high, my concern wasnt damaging the TV. If the brightness needs to ba at 100% to get a good picture, what happens when I need more brightness one day? Its like getting a Hi-Fi, that needs the bass turned up to full, in order to get a 'normal' sound. What happens if you need more bass one day!?
    You got to admit, its not a normal state of affairs? Normal should be 50-60%, not 100!
    Maybe the 21 model is better. All the demos are using the older 20, with no component ins.

    Samsung is in the lead... im gonna decide early feb.
     
  7. 38H21543

    38H21543
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    Found both models on www.samsung.fr and www.samsung.es indicating they are both 3 panel LCD.
    L5 is the newer model, about 6 months old, L2 about 12 months old. Over there, both series have bigger versions as well. But spec indicates negligible differences.
    If only someone :lesson: here had experience of them!
     
  8. bongpig

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    They've only just hit these shores, so it'll be a while yet before reports come in. Hang in there.

    Personally, ive seen enough to convince me. Im gonna go to the showroom one last time with my Xbox, and see how it handles that via component. Thats about my final test.

    Maybe in a few weeks ill be able to let you know!
     
  9. peejay

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    bongpig - just to clarify - have you been looking at the 43L2? Or the 46L5? There's a big difference in price between these two. And where have you found it to look at?

    Your feedback (from looking at one of these things for an hour) is the closest to a review of a Samsung LCD RP that I've seen! I'm glad you give it a favourable "review".

    Cheers,

    peejay
     
  10. bongpig

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    Im talking about the 43L2. Available for £1500 if you look around.

    I got to see one in action at a large Comet, somewhere near hendon in london. They are willing to let you plug your own equipment into it if you take it along ... which you really need to, as the in-store feed is god awfull!

    Mind you, even with the in-store feed, it STILL looked better than all the other screens there.
     
  11. 38H21543

    38H21543
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    I can add that the L5 is at Currys, Fosse Park, Leicester, and the L2 is at some larger Comet stores.
    And yes, huge price difference at the moment as only the Dixons/Currys group seems to be doing the L5 at £2999.
    Can you tell us where is the L2 £1500 offer is bongpig?
     
  12. bongpig

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  13. kenada

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    hi all

    i was wondering if anyone knows if the SP43L2HX or the 46L5HX got HDCP (or DVI-D) support on the DVI connection i cant seem to find it anywhere sins i am interested in both models too :) .
    thanks in advanced

    cheers
    stanley
     
  14. peejay

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    kenada - I'd answer your question if I knew what it meant. However you might find the manual helpful. Click on the link next to "Curved CRT" (! - don't you just love Samsung's website!)

    This manual includes info for both the SP43L2HX and the SP46L5HX - so they're pretty similar models.

    peejay
     
  15. kenada

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    hi peejay

    i got both manuals already lol
    but they dont mention it in neither of it :(
    HDPC means High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection
    its something like HDMI but in the direct DVI form just wondering this cause i am about to check the Denon dvd-A11 out and it only connects thru DVI with HDPC i think i will give em a call on this one :D

    stanley
     
  16. Alan_W

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    I have been fancying these Samsungs for a while now but cannot get to see one :mad:

    Apart from PQ I am interested in the high Wife Acceptance Factor of their plasma-like dimensions as opposed to the Toshiba alternatives.

    Please post all the details you can about them.............. cos I may just have to break AV Rule 1......and buy without seeing one :nono:
     
  17. bongpig

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    While we're on the subject, does anybody know about bulb life for these things?

    How long the bulbs last and how much replacements cost could be a factor here. Where to get them from would be a start!

    If anybody has any information regards this let me know.

    By the way, bulbs are NOT covered under warrenty, which is a bit of a bummer. :0(
     
  18. bongpig

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    If anybody is still interested, ive got some more info.

    Mainly that the SP43L2HX/XEU and the SP43L2HX are not quite the same set. The cheaper SP43L2HX ( the one for £1.5k at pantheronline ) only has one scart socket according the the manual, whereas the SP43L2HX/XEU (£1999 at currys ) model has 3 scarts, and one RGB scart also. I dont know what other differences there may be yet.

    They also look somewhat different:-
    http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/121533.html

    http://www.samsung.fr/cgi-bin/sef/p...V/2_Projection+TV/Tri-LCD&prodID=SP43L2HX/XEC

    ... so, comparing the Comet price to the PantherOnline price is pointless, as they are not the same.

    As for the bulbs, I was told by Samsung UK, that the bulbs have a life of 12,000 hours, which is great at even half that. Cost is around £250

    By the way, the one ive been raving about is the SP43L2HX/XEU model. Ive never seen the SP43L2HX in the flesh.
     
  19. 38H21543

    38H21543
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    I'm not sure about your conclusion here.
    I wondered if the samsung.fr site was incorrectly using the same image for the 43 and the 50 inch models. On page:
    http://www.samsung.fr/cgi-bin/sef/p...cts/Audio-Visual/1_TV/2_Projection+TV/Tri-LCD
    it shows a certain image for both models.
    On the individual models it shows a different, but the same image for both models.
    If you go to the pdf below, it describes, and shows what may be the correct image for the 43 inch. Where are you finding the manual describing the scarts differently?
    As was said at the beginning of this thread, Samsung are not very good with their web sites!!!

    http://www.samsung.fr/_upload_5/EC_DOWNLOAD/0/000/160/206/SP43L2HX.pdf
    http://www.samsung.fr/cgi-bin/sef/product/product_subtype.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@1045957636.1073598914@@@@&BV_EngineID=cccdadckgglhdidcfekcefedffgdfmh.0&categoryPath=%2fConsumer+Products%2fAudio-Visual%2f1_TV%2f2_Projection+TV%2fTri-LCD
     
  20. bongpig

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    hi 38H21543,
    Some images show the set with a circular button at the bottom, and others show it as a slit.

    When looking at the back of the model at Comet ( which has the circular button ), I saw 3 scarts, and another RGB scart. 4 x scart in total.

    But there are other models knocking around that are described as having either one scart only, or just 3 scarts without the RGB.

    The manual was posted further back in the thread. On page 8, it has a diagram of the TV rear. It shows one scart only.

    I guess my point is, we cant be sure the SP43L2HX many stores are selling, is the same impressive display I saw in Comet, hence the XEU addition. My french is pretty poor, but ill bet from looking at that PDF you've sent, that that version has 3 scarts and no RGB scart.

    Im gonna speak to somebody at Samsung tommorow, and see what they tell me. Ill let you know if I find out anything new.
     
  21. bongpig

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    Ok, I spoke to Samsung and they said the SP43L2HX only has one scart socket. They told me there was only one version of this TV.

    When I told them I had seen the TV in comet and it had 4 scarts they we're just as confused as I was, insisting, that the TV only has one scart.

    SO... i contacted Comet once more, and thier version ( /XEU ) does have 4 scarts ( 1 RGB )

    In a nutshell, the version Comet are selling doesnt exist according to Samsung, even though I saw it with my own eyes ( and was most impressed ).

    I bet thats made everything crystal clear!?
     
  22. Alan_W

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    Good as the product might be............

    Do I really want to buy a tv off these people :rolleyes:
     
  23. bongpig

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    yup ... I was thinking the exact same thing.

    Can you imagine calling up Samsung, to help you sort out a problem, only for them to tell you your TV doesnt exist!?

    ( by the way, I was wrong before ... its only 3 Scarts in total on the set in Currys .... but then that doesnt exist, so why am I still wanting one! )
     
  24. 38H21543

    38H21543
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    I am also now waiting for a reply from Samsung technical to explain exactly what they would supply if a retailer ordered from them today.
    I have seen the 3 scart model in a local Comet and it has /XEU on the model sticker. This, I am told, denotes it is for the UK market.
    Another version does exist on web sites, but may not be for the UK.
    Both have DVI and PC, plus a side V/L/R and S-Video connection.
    Differences:
    /XEU = 3 scarts (2 can be RGB) and 1 component (480i/480p, 576i/576p)
    Brownish coloured stand? and remote control without part sliding cover.
    Maybe EU model or newer version =
    1 scart (can be RGB), 2 V/L/R and S-video, 2 component (480i/480p, 576i/576p, 720p, 1080i).
    Silver looking stand and remote with part sliding cover. The remote is the same as the L5 models and handles the different external connections compared with the XEU model.
    We shall see what they come back and say, but the TV still look's good at the right price.
     
  25. bongpig

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    The one at PantherOnline for £1.5 has 3 scart sockets and one Composite, ive just been told by thier store. So I assume its the same as the Comet one.
    The very same set Samsung UK dont know anything about. As far as they are concerned, there is only the 1 scart, 2 component, version 38H21543 mentions above.

    This subject gets muddier and muddier!

    38H21543, ild very very interested to hear what Samsung get back to you with. No doubt something completly different to what they told me!
     
  26. Maninblack

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    Frm samsung for the 46 model
    Highly Compatible and Versatile
    This is multimedia-ready TV fully compatible with diverse digital devices such as PC, digital STB, DVD, game console, digital camcorder, and much more. You can enjoy this TV either for home entertainment or for business multitasks. Plug and play of various components has never been so easy. The TV immediately identifies which application is plugged into the front or rear jacks.
    HD Component Video Inputs
    This enables the LCD Projection TV to receive any digital broadcast, whether from terrestrial sources, satellite receivers or cable. For seamless connection to your favorite digital media.

    DVI-Digital Interface
    DVI input enables an all-digital rendering of video without the losses associated with an analog interface. DVI adds the quality and functionality of a digital interface while maintaining the simplicity of supporting uncompressed video formats.
     
  27. quadmad

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    After reading the spec's I noticed that whilst the screens are very bright they only have a contrast ratio of 750:1 - this doesn't seem very high as some of the better LCD & DLP projectors are brighter but have contrast ratio's af approx 1400:1

    How does this effect their ability regards black on moody movies, the CRT RPTV's get round this by having a generally duller picture and the new Toshiba sets have black stretch to enhance contrast further
     
  28. bongpig

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    Quadmad, regardless of the actual specs, I saw no problem with the contrast and brightness of these new LCD rptv's

    Most of the time, we cant use the specs as an absolute reference to performace. If that was the case, Panasonic plasma screens, at 4000:1 would have four times better contrast then a Hitachi at 1000:1 .... but this simply isnt the case at all.

    I owned a plasma screen which claimed to have a contrast of 3000:1, but it certainly didnt look that way when I got the bugger home!

    In the case of these Samsung rptv, I think the DNle feature playes a big part in improving the contrast.
     
  29. Oddbodd

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    Hi all, I called into my local Currys and saw this t.v.(http://www.samsung.com/Products/TV/ProjectionTV/TV_ProjectionTV_SP46L5HX.htm) "in the flesh". Aesthetically it's a beaut., it looks very good thanks to it's thin bezel surrounding the screen and the build quality looks excellant. It was wedged in a corner but I managed to stick my head round the back and can confirm it has:- 3 Scarts,I think only 1 is R.G.B.(full manual here:-(http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/200311/20031125105517593_BP68-00269A-00Eng.pdf), 1 Component, 1 D.V.I., 1 P.C., 1 RS232 and several phono's. Unfortunately it was displaying a crappy eastenders feed so did'nt look that impressive. The shop was closing so I did'nt have time to get anything else fed through it. There was several stickers on the screen high-lighting it's main features such as Progressive scan, D.N.L.E., X.G.A. resolution for P.C., D.V.I. input and so on. I must admit I was going to buy a Toshiba 51" R.P.T.V. soon but having seen this I've changed my mind. The only trouble is it's nearly twice the price :( (£2999.00), includes the stand though ;)
    Currys are doing 12 months interest free at the moment also :)
    The price takes it into plasma territory but as mentioned earlier in the thread L.C.D. does'nt suffer from screen burn and the geometry is better than the C.R.T. sets. Can't wait to try it with a better feed :smoke: I've got a feeling it's going to be awesome.
    Cheers,
    Oddbodd
     
  30. Maninblack

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    I am really interestin in this t.v. if the price were to be better.
    At the moment I can only find currys/ dixons selling it for 2999.
    Currys oxford were not including the stand!
    Im sure etailers will sell it eventually.
    Obviously its smaller than the 51 tosh.
    Ive seen it right next to the 42 tosh and there were pro's cons, for both sets.
    It is a nice looking box!
     

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