Sagem HD-D56 vs. Samsung SP50L7HX

[blackwavesid]

Don't often venture out to the big retailers so having this afternoon off work decided to visit Comet at Fort Kinaird in Edinburgh.

The HD line up was as follows
Sagem HD-D50 G4 - Sagem HD-D56 - Samsung SP50L7HX
All had the same HD feed split from a PC playing the usual HD clips we're all well use to seeing now.

The remote for the 56 was there so I was able to change the settings, I already own the original HD-D45 so was familiar with the settings and the Eco on / off option.

No matter how I tried I just couldn't get the Sagem 56 close to the Samsung.

The Samsung beat the 56 hands down on colour depth and detail / sharpness with the picture looking far more 'natural'. Not sure if the anti-reflective coating on the Sagems has anything to do with this (although it is a lot less noticable than my HD-D45) but PQ on the Samsung was noticably better than the Sagems.

Has anybody else had any experiences with similar direct comparisons? I did leave the store wondering if I could actually live with that pedestal!

Sid

 

[indie24]

i love my samsung, have had it since april and even today if I see a new hd film my jaw drops. its the best DLP from the current line up in MY OPINION. Great depth and colours and no blurring / solarisation etc whatsoever. Also handles SD television beautifully

 

[polygon_monkey]

Do they not have the SP46L6HX at Fort Kinaird? I was planning on heading there tommorow to check it out

 

[kmhtkmhtkmht]

you said the lineup is "Sagem HD-D50 G4 - Sagem HD-D56 - Samsung SP50L7HX"

You didn't comment on the G4... Shouldn't you be comparing the SP50L7 with the 50G4?

I am interested to see what's the difference.

 

[blackwavesid]

Hi polygon monkey

Yes they did have the SP46L6HX, it was next to the Sagem HD-D50 G4. Unfortunately it had a different feed and although HD it was through the PC input not the HDMI input. I was disappointed to see it was the worst PQ behind the three I mentioned above. I suspect this was mainly down to the feed so it was hard to make as direct a comparison as with the other models.



Hi kmhtkmhtkmht

It would have been more interesting if the HD-D50 G4 was right next to the Samsung but it wasn't and it didn't have its remote control with it so I couldn't alter the settings (the HD-D56s remote didn't work). Both Sagems had the same 'feel' about the PQ, hard to explain but down to the type of screen I think. Neither were as good as the Samsung (and I'm a Sagem owner).


All the best

Sid

 

[kmhtkmhtkmht]

I called Kinnaird Park today actually and they denied having the 50 G4...

I think I'mma have to turn up there soon and have a look.

Shame about the feed, I was told the G50 is supposed to be really nice.

As people know the 56B I have is going back, and it's between the 50 G4 or the 50 L6 from Samsung, I would do the Pedestal 50 from Samsung but it doesn't have a Native DVI or HDMI slot...

 

[blackwavesid]

Hi kmhtkmhtkmht

I'd be interested to know what you think if you make it along to Kinnaird Park Comet. What do you mean by native HDMI slot? The Samsung SP50L7HX has a HDMI input.

 

[kmhtkmhtkmht]

Native DVI... Last time I looked at the 50L7 there wasn't even ONE HDMI and it only had 1 VGA input...

DVI is really important to me as I am using this to connect to my PC...

I know you can get VGA to DVI cables but I think this makes it an untrue signal, its just a different connector. Pure DVI to DVI is the best....

Why didn't you compare the G4 to the 46L6 or 50L6 with the G4 in it?

I personally dislike the Sagem menu structure, I think it's boring and set out VERY poorly.

 

[blackwavesid]

I wouldn't have thought there would be any compromise to the signal quality using a DVI - HDMI lead or converter.
The Samsung website definitely states that the SP50L7HX has a HDMI input.

 

[kmhtkmhtkmht]

Oh well, I went into John Lewis to look at it and I might've missed it - there certainly isn't a DVI on it which throws me off totally.

 

[aflowers001]

It's got HDMI, see http://www.samsung.com/uk/products/television/dlp/sp50l7hxxxeu.asp?page=Specifications

and HDMI is fully compatible with DVI, see http://hdmi.org/consumer/why_hdmi.asp and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI

 

[mray]

I saw the new Sagem 50" alongside the Samsung 50" pedestal and 46" HX?
I thought the Samsung 50" had the best pic, though they were all showing the same composite feed. The Samsung 50" seemed to have better detail.

After this viewing I ordered the 56" Sagem, specifically because of the HD2+ chip, which is supposed to deliver a sharper pic than the HD4? models. As far as I can tell, it does, though the bright whites with Sky+ are bugging me at the moment.

 

[rEVILospud]

Tis true, there is no DVI on the Samsung SP50L7HX but there is definately 1 HDMI connection; so a DVI-HDMI cable would not compromise on quality (equally HDMI cable with DVI Adapter is good option too).
I am going to buy the Samsung soon and my original plan was to use the VGA for PC, HDMI for HD upscaling DVD (Samsung DVD-HD850) and component for Xbox360
Doesn't leave much choice for future investments though!
Lack of DVI did originally put me off, but I think this set up would suit me.

I am still debating whether I should bother with the DVD Player mentioned or to build a dedicated HTPC. Any thoughts? What would I gain from having a HTPC when used with the Samsung? And would it be worth the extra money?

 

[sirp]

where do you locate your centre speaker with the samsung set?

 

[tiburs]

Vertically, nearby the stand !

 

[sirp]

does it lok ok like that? looks like a nice set i may consider one..i keep going round and round with plasma/lcd now this!

 

[the_pauley]

After this viewing I ordered the 56" Sagem, specifically because of the HD2+ chip, which is supposed to deliver a sharper pic than the HD4? models. As far as I can tell, it does, though the bright whites with Sky+ are bugging me at the moment.

Bear in mind "sharper" does not necessarily mean "better" as anyone who has boosted the sharpness control to the max on their TV set will tell you.

There seems to be the danger of a myth developing, that because the latest generation HD4 chip is cheaper than the HD2 chip, that it is somehow inferior. This is far from the truth.

First of all this is a few generations away from the origianal HD2 chip. As all technologies mature, they become cheaper / easier to mass produce. Take DVD players. The first models on the market were round about a grand, and six years later they are out spec'd and outperformed by a £150 model from the likes of Pioneer.

The HD4 is cheaper to produce and operates differently, some would argue to better effect.

HD2: 1280x720 mirrors, each mirror produces 1 pixel displayed on the screen yielding a 1280x720 final resolution; pixels are rectangular shaped and don't overlap, individual pixels are visible on the screen.

HD4: 640 x 720 mirrors, each mirror quickly moves (the so-called wobulation) to produce 2 pixels displayed on the screen yielding a 1280x720 final resolution; pixels are diamond shaped and slightly overlap, producing a smooth "pixel free" image - refered to as the smoother more cinematic effect.

There are those that have convinced themselves that less mirrors equals less quality. Not the case - it is simply a newer, different and perhaps more efficient way of doing things.

My first choice for a DLP was going to be a Samsung SP50, but I had reservations about the pedestal design, however PQ was the prime consideration and I was ready to buy this when the SP46 was released, which didn't have the pedestal. However PQ was still going to be the ultimate decider.

I auditioned both of these sets several times with the same discs, sources and feeds, and believe me there was not a jot of difference picture wise. If the SP50 had been a hair's breadth better than the SP46 I would have bought it - pedestal or no pedestal.

In the USA -where larger screen sizes (up to 71") are available and differences will be more apparent- consumers are raving about the smoothness and "pixel free" quality of the image that the HD4 chip produces.

So let's nip this particular misconception in the bud before it becomes a DLP urban myth.

 

[polygon_monkey]

I went to Fort Kinnard today and saw the DLP/3LCD sets. The SP50 looked stunning. Better than the Sagems. The SP46 and the Sony looked terrible, especially the Sony but they were running from different feeds (I think from the Samsung DVD player under the SP46 - The SP46 was connected by component and the Sony by HDMI). The SP46 is the one I'd be edging towards due to price but the picture quality put me off. However, if the_pauley says the picture quality is the same as the SP50 when set up right I'll take his word for it.

Went to Currys and they had a Sagem set with the screen all banged in along with the SP50 and some other make. Looked terrible there.

 

[blearyeyes]

I went to Comet Kinnaird park today to compare Sagems and Samsungs. The Samsungs (50 and 56) were displaying the same material as the Samsung (SP50L7X) and there was an obvious difference between them. The Samsung was brighter and PQ more detailed from about 8 feet. I was not alone in thinking this - others commented the same. In short the Samsung stole the show. Incidently, they also had a SP46H6 side by side with a Sony 3LCD 50 inch KDFE50A12, but due to technical problems both their source connections, could only have a Samsung 850 feed upscaled. The only obvious difference between these two sets was that the Sony did not quite have the depth of black as the Samsung and was not quite as bright. Angle of view for both was about the same. As regards PQ there was little to choose from given the compromised feed but carefully comparing similar video sequences such as fast panning and colours, I suspect that they would compare favourably once showing true 720p material. Apparently the assistant shrugged this off, saying that they wouldn't bother trying to feed all sets with the same source, since "something was knackered" - and I could have seriously wanted to buy this Sony!

At Currys across the road they had the new 50 inch LG which I wanted demoed.

Me: "Would it be possible to see this LG set with high quality source material?"

Currys ass: "One moment sir I'll just get a DVD and a scart lead."

Exit left.

I've reached the conclusion that the only way to assess these sets fairly is when an abundance of quality material becomes available which will probably be released by Sky to promote their new service next year. Alternatively, when HD DVD is released they will need HD displays to promote sales and so this will do the trick. Until then, I reckon most demos are left to chance with whatever the retailers decide to throw at them.

 

[blackwavesid]

Looks like we'll be having an AV forums meet at Fort Kinnaird, Edinburgh in the near future! Can you imagine the look on the faces of the staff as three (or more) punters all turning up independently discuss in detail the merits of various chips and other in-depth DLP / HD technical issues

 

[blearyeyes]

Should have said compared Sagems with Samsungs!

 

[the_pauley]

The last thing you should rely on is the PQ of the in-store set ups. I spent a couple of months auditioning sets, and although it was a pain in the arse, I brought my own DVD player, lead, and discs to each store, and reset the discs using the THX Optomizer.

In every case the results were better than the prior set up of each set.

Although it is, of course, desireable to see how these sets perform on HD, this should not be the sole factor in making your decision. It will be a few years before HD broadcasting and / or DVDs are widespread. In the meantime a significant amount of time is going to be spent watching SD feeds on your set, not to mention that fairly large collection of SD DVD's most people on these forums have accumulated.

Almost every set looks impressive on HD - even the Toshibas' PQ flaws are covered up to some extent on HD feeds. The proof of the pudding is how these sets perform on SD material, that is where the PQ differences begin to show. So although it is a pain, take along the DVD player, discs and connector you will be using at home and give them a thorough going over.

I had to take my player along as many of the stores I was auditioning at did not have a player of comparable quality and many were attempting to demo with sets around the sub-£100 mark. This is worth doing if you have a quality player. I had my first audition of a Sagem 45 in Comet on a fairly cheap player. The next day I brought in my player and the difference was dramatic. You really do need to see how these sets perform with the equipment you are going to use on a day to day basis.

One of the pleasant suprises for me when I got the SP46 home was how much better the PQ was over even the best in store demos, once you had the time to really tweak and play with the settings of both your set and player.

I am so impressed with the quality of picture via my Pioneer 757Ai through component feed, that I have to keep reminding myself that there is the delight of HD not too far away. Meanwhile, I can honestly say if HD didn't materialize, I'd be more than happy with PQ of this standard for the rest of my days. Let's not forget guys in our current euphoria over HD, that SD DVD is pretty damn good too.

 

[polygon_monkey]

Do Comet pricematch?

 

[AndoverRed]

Comet do pricematch, but your local Currys, Dixons etc MUST have the same display in stock. I tried this with a Samsung SP46 recently and Comet claimed that my local Currys store did not have this display in stock.

Comet will beat the competitors price by 10%. If your local Currys does have the display you're after in stock, then get Comet to pricematch.

I think the Samsung SP50 is calling to me at the moment. Just waiting for the price to drop a little. Perhaps by Christmas/New Year it will be sub £1,500?

 

[polygon_monkey]

Right. Well, Robetsons website say they have the set and there is a store in Edinburgh...