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SAGEM HD-D45 Lamp

Discussion in 'TVs' started by batfink9086, Jun 15, 2005.

  1. batfink9086

    batfink9086
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    Hi all first posting hope you can help,

    I have been looking to purchase the HD-D45 instead of an LCD once I seen the great picture in my local Curry's store, but how long will the lamp last. Could anyone please answer the following questions, to put my mind at easy :-

    How long would the lamp last, I am looking to use this as a main tv, so it would be switched on for prolonged periods ?

    I am going to use the tv for standard broadcasting and freeview until Sky bring out HD. Would I get a good picture until HD comes out/

    How much are the lamp to replace ?

    I have read on the forum that someone recommended that you sit 3m away for the best picture. Is this correct ?

    I have read on other websites that the tv would have to be switched off to allow the lamp to cool down every 3 to 4 hours to prolong the life of the lamp, is this correct ?

    If I did purchase a DLP, would I in theory be looking purchase and have a new lamp fitted every 2 to 3 years based on my usage ?

    Please let me know your thoughts, as I don't want to make a mistake.

    Any information would be a great help

    Simon
     
  2. Razor

    Razor
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    I hope the above helps you out and welcome to the forums :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
     
  3. Ambient Fish

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    Hi Razor, ther is an economy mode on the Sagem which extends the life of the lamp, I expect that the cost of replacing the lamp will fall over the next few years as DLP becomes more widely accepted in the user community, until I saw the picture quality on the Sagem I would never even have considered purchasing a rear pro TV, now I can't imagine watching anything else, I think that many other people will come around to my point of view as more and more quality DLP sets become available.
     
  4. Caimbeul

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    Thats promising to hear 8,000 - 10,000hrs BUT I have read on many web pages and in many forums figures ranging from 1,500 - 3,000 / 2,000 - 4,000. Some have also said 6-8 or 8-10 for some of the Optima models.

    It would be good to get an idea from owners of all types to list there knowledge on this and say what their experiences are for life-span, cost of replacement and ease of replacement ie: can the user do it or an engineer? I'm sure this would help alot of forum members, myself included as my purchase is looming ever closer.

    **I am currently torn between Plasma and DLP. With DLP my main issue is the uncertainty around bulb life and cost (The TV would likely be on up to 8 hrs a day as people in the house whilst im at work etc) plasma has better life but! I play alot of console games and am worried about burn in on images such as life bars, maps and various other displays associated with different types of games that are usually on display for long periods of time. with DLP burn-in is not an issue but if I am going to be shelling out for bulbs once a year (8hrs a day = almost 3,00hrs) I'm pretty much left with neither to choose from. Anyone have any comments in relation to that??? :confused: :suicide:
    :lease:
     
  5. batfink9086

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    Thank you all for your thoughts,

    Like yourself Caimbeul I don't know if I should go for a plasma or the DLP. The one thing I would say is that most shops I go into, the picture on the majority of the plamsas are poor. What I cannot understand is why people are buying these like hot cakes if this is the case.

    I have seen on another thread members saying that John Lewis is offering 5 years warrenty on the sagem and this MAY include the lamp. I have to be honest if this was the case then I would buy the Sagem tomorrow as I would get around 6 to 8 years out of the tv without further outlay. However, some members say it does include the lamp.

    Regarding the economy mode what lamp life would you you expect with this ?

    From what I have seen the SAGEM gives a better picture than Plamsa or LCD and is HD ready. However, it's just this additional outlay, anyone have an further thoughts regarding the life of the bulds ? John Lewis warrenty does it include the lamp ?
     
  6. neilmcl

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    Cambeul, generaly the quoted times for bulb life for DLP TVs is around the 8K to 10K mark, certainly that's what both Optoma and Samsung claim and I think Sagem also. There has been some confusion because DLP projectors also have a bulb life which can be around the 2K mark, the confusion arises because some websites just mention DLP and don't distinguish between the two types of format. It's true that the manufacturer claims may not reflect real life situations and it would be useful to find out about true experience but if the manufaturers claims are totally unrealistic then I'm sure consumers would have some recourse against them.

    As far as replacement is concerned this can be done quite easily by the user following the instructions laid out in the user manual, the whole lamp assembly housing the bulb is replaced so you don't actually have to handle the bulb itself.

    BTW, all of the initial manufacturers warranties provide for lamp replacement within the first year but I'm not sure about extended warranties, I'm kind of thinking not unless the bulb expired prematurely due to a manufacturing fault.
     
  7. Razor

    Razor
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    Hi :hiya:

    I think the reason a front pro bulb doesnt last as long is becuse the image has to be projected across a room rather than a sealed cabinet (rear pro).

    Eco mode just lessens the intensity of the bulb, therefore extending the life of the bulb. This setting is usually used in a darkened room as the picture doesnt have to be as intense to compensate for the light in the room.

    I use my RD65 for at least 10 hours aday as I do a fair bit of work on it (pc connected) :D I am not concerned about bulb replacements, when it happens it happens. Nothing I can do about it. By then prices of bulbs should of decreased a bit :)

    I too had a choice of plasma or DLP. DLP won hands down, better blacks, cheaper to buy, great sense of depth, better overall picture, no screen burn. I wasnt intending on hanging my display on a wall so the footprint of the set wasnt an issue.

    :thumbsup:
     
  8. Tarbat

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    :confused: Will they? I don't understand the logic behind this often mentioned statement. Why won't manufacturers charge as high a price as they can get away with to recoup the cost of developing DLP TVs?

    It also seems to me that most (all?) the manufacturers are very secretive about bulb life and cost. I've searched manufacturer's web sites, and find very little mention of bulb life or cost. In fact, if you were an average consumer with no knowledge of the technology involved, you wouldn't even discover that the bulb needs regular replacement until a couple of years after buying the TV.

    Our TV is usually on 8-10 hours a day so bulb life and cost is a significant factor in any buying decision.
     
  9. LV426

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    My guess (and that's all it is) is that - like car spares (door knobs, trim, and the like) and laptop or camera battery packs and so on - because they are of proprietary design, they will continue to command a high price.
     
  10. neilmcl

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    You're right in saying they'll charge as much as they can get away with but they would still have to remain competitive which may be a factor along with cost in driving the price of spares down.

    The information's there if you look for it on the sites and in some cases on their printed literature. And as far as average consumers being ingnorant of the facts I personally wouldn't have much sympathy for someone spending 2K to buy into a new technology without doing some research on it first.
     
  11. Tarbat

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    Any idea where? I've searched the two leading players in the UK market, Sagem and Toshiba UK websites, and can't find any mention of bulb life or cost. Anyone have links to bulb-life information?
     
  12. dunsters

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    Look to the Desktop printer market for costs of replacement Ink. The OFT has looked into this issue and decided that it is sharp practice but still it continues. I expect £300-350 for a new bulb will remain on the cards for the lifetime of all these TVs.:thumbsdow


    Sorry to put any dampeners on things :( but I never expected the Printer industry to get away with it - but clearly they have and I expect the replacement bulbs form part of the TV manufacturers budgeting process and so they will know exactly how much they want to milk (Opps/charge) us for them.

    Perhaps when the market get strong enough, 3rd party bulbs will be readily available like the cheap inks around but then the PQ and brightness may suffer??? :confused:

    Cheers
     
  13. Tarbat

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    So, assuming I'll need a new bulb every 2 years, over a 10 year lifetime that's £1400. :thumbsdow

    I'm starting to see the catch with DLP technology. Shame, great technology let-down by high running costs. I'm not suprised the manufacturers don't mention this on their sales literature and web-sites.

    Two mentions I can find on DLP lamp life:
    http://www.dlptvreview.com/dlptv/3estimated.html
    http://www.plasmatvbuyingguide.com/dlpvsplasmatv.html
    But, who is telling the truth? 8000 hours or 80000 hours?

    And "Toshiba claims a service life of 6000 hours for High Bright and 8000 hours for Low Power" - at http://www.ultimateavmag.com/directviewandptvtelevisions/505toshiba/ - that's only 19 months :(
     
  14. Razor

    Razor
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    Im going to try large candles first :devil:

    Seriously though plasmas need re-gasing alot of customers dont know about this. It seems that they do have us by the Balls on this bulb issue. Why does it cost so much to replace is anyones guess. I certainly wont be keeping my RD65 for 10 years as I hope to get a bigger set within 3 years with 1080i or 1080p. This industry has become a throw away industry where manufacturers would rather we binned or old gear and bought new. My 5 year old 46' £3000 crt rear pro isnt worth much at all now and it would be better to replace than throw loads of cash at it. Especially as the picture quality of rear pros has improved so much with the arrival of DLP technology. What will DLP technology be worth in 5 years time is anyones guess. It may have been replaced with something totally new and far superior. As I have said before I will worry about the bulb blowing when it happens. Also remember that this HD2, HD2+ etc DLP technology used to cost around the £5000 -£8000 mark on front pros and the bulb life wasnt no where near as long as it is with these rear pro sets. The rear pro sets are cheap as chips compared to what this technology used to cost in their front pro big brothers.

    Relax and enjoy what you have and when it goes it goes, who knows how much it will cost to replace the bulb in 2-3 years time. :D Hey you could always swap one out with a display model on Currys/Comets shop floor. :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: Just make sure you dont get caught :rolleyes:
     
  15. Tarbat

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    Well, I didn't know that - how often do they have to be re-gassed? I though most plasma screens were being quoted with a half-life of around 50000 hours.

    But I don't have a DLP-RPTV, I'm trying to decide whether to buy one. Buying something without having at least some idea of the running costs is rediculous. That's why I'm searching for information from the manufacturers on running costs. I need to know:
    - Expected life of the bulb.
    - Cost of a replacement bulb.
    - Cost of disposal of the old bulb - they can't just be thrown away, they have to be disposed of properly.

    Is that too much to ask?
     
  16. Razor

    Razor
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    To be honest I dont know the life expectancy of plasmas, but as I understand it the picture suffers long before the gases wear out. The life expectancy of these displays has increased greatly over the years.

    With regards to disposal of bulbs, I wont be paying for it to be disposed. The swap out of a bulb is easy to do apperently and it is shown in the manual (about the only thing the Optoma manual does show :eek: ). In the bin it will go or to my next door neighbours small kid as he can be a pain in the arse :devil:

    For me it all came down to picture quality and DLP won out over Plasma screens by a long way. Also for me to get a 65' plasma screen it would cost me well over £12,000 and the picture quality again wouldnt be anywhere near as good. If i have to spend some cash on a new bulb every 3-4 years then so be it, I'd rather that than spending £12,000 + straight away.

    I am affraid if you want the best picture then bulb life is something you will have to consider. Front pros have had this issue from day one and it hasnt stopped hundreds of thousands of units being sold world wide.

    If you can live with an inferior picture and save cash by not paying for bulbs every 3-5 years then great (works out £70- £115 per year on a £350, a fiver to a tenner a month). I persoanlly couldnt do that, which is why I have gone the DLP route.

    I wish you luck with what ever you get as i know how much of a headache choosing the right peice of equipment can be. :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:
     
  17. Tarbat

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    Razor, I don't think we want this to become yet another DLP vs. plasma thread. I like DLP, not plasma. We're just looking for some facts about:
    - Expected life of the bulb.
    - Cost of a replacement bulb.
    - Cost of disposal of the old bulb.

    Why is that so difficult? If manufacturers seem so reluctant to disclose this information, then I, for one, am very suspicous about how short the bulb life is.

    I note your comments about just throwing the lamp away. Note that the Sagem manual states
    I suspect these bulbs have a significant environmental impact.
     
  18. Razor

    Razor
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    cjpers :hiya:

    The best thing you can do is phone the manufacture of the display you want and hear it from the horses mouth. I have helped you as much as I can.

    :cool:
     
  19. Caimbeul

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    Just got off the phone with John Lewis Customer Services: They offer the 5yr Guarantee on all Large screen TV's (which is all of their DLP TV's) and is included in the price. I have been advised that the warranty INCLUDES the bulb as it is part of the workings of the TV! :clap:

    Looks Like I will be shopping at John Lewis depite the slightly higher prices.
     
  20. neilmcl

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    It really isn't that difficult:

    - Expected life of bulb - around the 8000-10000 hrs mark as both Samsung and Optoma have published (upto 8K for toshiba). All of the manufacturers use similar lamp technology so it's a good bet that Sagem is around the same figure which they'll no doubt tell you if you contact their customer services.
    - Cost of replacement bulb - I think it's around £200 at the moment, the best thing to do is to ask Currys to see what they charge.
    - Cost of disposal - When your lamp runs out if you want to be environmentally conscious simply take it down to your nearest recycling centre, it doesn't cost a penny.

    I'm currently in a similar boat, I can't decide between the new Panasonic TH42PV500 or the new Samsung DLP models that are on the way but to be honest bulb life expectenecy doesn't feature in my choice it's more about PQ. I wish you well with whatever you go for.
     
  21. Tarbat

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    Thanks Razor. I've done just that, and finally got an answer from Toshiba's customer service line (08704 424 424) of an expected life of 2000 hours for the 46WM48. Now, that's a very dissapointing figure, and is contrary to the 8k-10k hours being suggested by other posts. Can anyone that has quoted this 8k-10k number in their posts give me a link to a manufacturer who states this.
     
  22. Lion

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    toshiba ?
    I thought this thread was about lamp life on the sagem hd-d45. :confused:
     
  23. Razor

    Razor
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    IMG :eek: 2000 hours lamp life is very poor indeed. Shocked

    Have you thought of looking at a samsung set, I am sure their bulb life is longer. The picture quality is far better than the tosh set. No offence to all the tosh owners out there. :D

    Here is a link to my set the RD65 which has the bulb life quoted at 8000hrs

    http://www.themescene.tv/ts/PDF/RD65/RD_ENG.pdf

    Its on the 4th page under display. :thumbsup:
     
  24. Tarbat

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    I also phoned Sagem on 01784-898158, and they've just returned my call with a "we don't know" answer. Great :( At £300 a go, for me lamp life is a significant factor in any decision on which TV to buy.
     
  25. Son of Shaft

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    About 2 to 3 years ago a friend and I were looking for a replacement lamp for his fathers Philips DLP projector. We found a Philips boxed replacement lamp for €250,-. After looking at the old lamp ourselves we used all numbers found on the lamp frame and googled around and found on Ebay a store selling DLP replacement lamps. There was a lamp for a LG projector which was exactly the same as the Philips, even the frame was the same. Cost around €175,-. The Philips was probably OEM-ed from LG.

    So researching a bit can save a few pennies.

    But I don't know wether DLP TV's use custom designs for each model, so it could be harder to find alternatives.
    The bulbs themself are probably very alike but the frames are made to fit the particular model.
     
  26. Razor

    Razor
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    Son of Shaft

    175 Euros is a good price. BTW I cant find the EURO key on my keyboard :rolleyes:

    There are a few places that sell replacement lamps on the net you just have to hunt them down. Most will be cheaper than if you got the part directly from the manufacturer. The bulbs are also ment to be very easy to fit, otherwise they wouldnt list it in the manuals. Instead they would leave it down to the service engineers to do and not mention it at all in the manual.

    :thumbsup:
     
  27. neilmcl

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    Here's one from Samsung USA - http://erms.samsungusa.com/customer/sea/jsp/faqs/faqs_view.jsp?PG_ID=3&AT_ID=6152&PROD_SUB_ID=41&PROD_ID=153
    I've also heard the low lamp life for the Toshiba, I wonder why they're significantly lower, maybe they use the same bulb as those used in front projectors. I've seen Sagem quoting 8K-10K but I can't recall where that was, possibly on a retail website, it's pretty poor of their customer services not to know the answer. I'd give their helpdesk number a call - 0870 248 8227
     
  28. Son of Shaft

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    € right alt+5

    The manual of the Loewe Articos 55 only mentions that the light has to be replaced by a (Loewe)technician. No info otherwise on replacing the lamp. But I know from projectors of friends that it's very easy to replace such a lamp. I can even see the lamp from the back of the Loewe, sits just behind the airfilter. Weird thing is that after downloading al the service manuals and tech. specs etc. from the site of loewe, not one mentions lamp replacement.
     
  29. LV426

    LV426
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    On my keyboard, it's Ctrl+Alt+4 €
     
  30. Razor

    Razor
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    € :clap: :clap: Found it :D Cheers

    When the time comes son of shaft will you be changing the lamp yourself or will you pay a qualified engineer to do so?
     

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