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RGB Scart to RGB 15 Pin D

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by dougall, Sep 16, 2003.

  1. dougall

    dougall
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    Random question but......

    Does anyone know if an RGB scart to RGB 15 pin D lead is available to link a sky box to a plasma?
     
  2. Dutch

    Dutch
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    Hi Harry,

    You will need a converter between your digibox and plasma. I use the excellent one from www.js-technology.com Not the cheapest available but regarded by many as the best.

    Steve

    Edit: Not sure now if this will work with the Hitachi - anyone know for sure?
     
  3. dougall

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    Thanks Dutch but this won't work with the Hitachi and was trying to get away with a lead as it will still be better than plugging it into the s-video port...

    I have tried the rs convertors but they do not appear to be compatible with the Hitachi
     
  4. JamesTapp

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    The RGB to Component should work though?
     
  5. MAW

    MAW
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    A recent thread has a bit about this, the 15 pin d-sub will never work with scart horizontal frequency, but you can use a scart to rgb&synch cable to the BNC's. Careful what you connect, most rgb scart is sync on composite, but sync on g is not unknown. This can be set in the screen menu, where you select component or rgb for these inputs. BTW this is a PMA400 isn't it? Not a PD?
     
  6. cynicaltaf

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    The minimum vertical frequency on the Hitachi 15-pin inputs is 24Khz, so these inputs will not sync to PAL/NTSC signals. Therefore for RGB you must use the PMA400 Component phono inputs - R connected to Pr/Cr, B connected to Pb/Cb and G connected to Y. If you do not have sync on green, and I expect this applies to the Sky box as it does to my NTL box, then you will also need to connect a standard Composite output (or a combined sync H/V if available) to the Composite input on the panel to act as a suitable sync. This obviously then rules out using other Composite inputs, but with the PMA400 you cannot use these anyway if you connect an s-video connector to its input.

    From the Yamaha 620 manual, it looks like you could use its Component switching ability to connect 2 RGB sources (DVD and Sky). This will work as long as the Component and Composite are switched simultaneously for the sources, and have no additional processing which may delay the Component/Composite signals relative to each other. Try it and see!
     
  7. MAW

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    That does indeed work, the lead is made by QED, or a good installer can knock one up for you, and for less than the £80 QED want. Scart to 4BNC is what you get, but of course connected to the right pins. A key advantage with this method when installing is you get a composite picture straight away, so you can see the menu to enable RGB. Connecting composite and component from the 620, and using the component as RGB also enables you to daisy chain a VCR onto the STB, and use scart to switch between them.
     
  8. symanski

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    For the Hitachi screen I recommend using RGB to Component (YUV). It also keeps any other input free. One interesting aspect about the Hitachi is that it seems to have two component inputs, one discrete and one VGA port which can be reconfigured to component. Very nice.

    All the best,

    Dr John Sim.
     
  9. cynicaltaf

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    My own preference is to always minimise the amount of unnecessary video processing, and for the Hitachi panel there is no need to convert to YUV when it accepts RGB directly. The only additional socket required is the Composite input, which is likely to be unable to be used anyway, as inserting an s-video plug for other sources will disable it. I suggest putting some of the money saved on a convertor, and the extra lead required, towards a good quality SCART to 4/6 Phono lead in this case.

    To use the component inputs on the PMA400 VGA plug you require a minimum vertical frequency of 24KHz, therefore ruling out 15.625Khz RGB or simple RGB-YUV converted signals. So this is only suitable for inputs such as 720p/1080i, such as from compatible DVD players with component outputs, and not the standard RGB available from a Sky box or similar. Again there will be no need for a simple RGB-YUV convertor.
     
  10. dougall

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    I think I am going to use a half decent scart to s-video lead for the sky box as i am using my component inputs for the dvd player and am more than happy with the results...
     
  11. JamesTapp

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    Not all SKy boxes output SVideo. Better check that one first, although Jon does an excellent RGB to S Video convertor...:D

    James
     
  12. symanski

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    I wonder how all those that I sold converters to got it to work then? While this input doesn't work with the Plamsa VGA converter, it certainly does with component video signals and via my RGB to Component converter.

    All the best,

    Dr John Sim.
     
  13. cynicaltaf

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    Thanks for the information, as this directly opposes what the User Manual, Service Manual, Keene Technical and Hitachi Technical departments say!

    I also just knocked up a quick lead and small circuit to test this myself. The panel correctly identified the input signal frequency, showing "15.63KHz 50Hz" on screen, and then promptly displayed "!out of frequency" and turned to standby as expected. I have contacted Hitachi Technical again, for confirmation of the 24KHz restriction on the VGA inputs, but it appears at the moment that the table on P.31 of the User Manual is correct - the only component signals compatible with these inputs are 720p/1080i (>24KHz hfreq). Finally the PMA400 service manual shows the optional video board output, which provides the composite/s-video/component (480i/576i) inputs, feeding in after the VGA inputs. So the video board being present is unlikely to have any impact on the VGA input frequency range.

    So, just to ensure that we are both have the same understanding here, what you are saying is that a standard RGB signal (15.625KHz/50Hz or 15.734KHz/60Hz), such as from a Sky Box, converted to YUV component signals through your box will work fine on the Hitachi 42PMA400 plasma screen when fed directly into the VGA 15-pin HD inputs (NOT the phono component inputs)?
     
  14. MAW

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    So what you are saying is the VGA port is only for PC VGA effectively, as 720p and 1080i signals are not exactly widespread here(yet!). And there we were thinking the PMA had 3 usable component inputs.
     
  15. symanski

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    I've had a couple of customers who have done exactly this. Therefore I believe you can use the component features of the VGA input for video.

    Since you're technically minded, then what to try is to connect composite video in to the Y (green) connection on the VGA connector. You should get a black and white picture up. If so, then next stage is to connect a component source to this input to get a colour picture.

    All the best,

    Dr John Sim.
     
  16. cynicaltaf

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    That's exactly what I am saying! In quoting me, symanski seems to imply that the VGA plugs will work as long as you use his RGB to component convertor. I do not believe this is the case, and only certain component input signals will work (DVD progressive component 576p output should also be OK as this is 31KHz hfreq).

    So if you have a standard 480i/576i RGB source (Sky/NTL box) then with the Hitachi you may as well connect this directly to the component PHONO inputs or via a suitable AV amp, and save yourself the price of an unnecessary YUV convertor. When it comes to video processing, less is (nearly) always more!
     
  17. cynicaltaf

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    It would be great to get the exact details of what equipment was connected and how. At the moment with all the evidence I cannot see this working with anything other than maybe progressive DVD signals. However from experience I know it is never a good idea to disagree completely until all the facts are known! ;-)

    I have indeed tried exactly what you suggest, as well as more complex connections using sync separation circuitry, etc. In all cases there is no picture, not even black and white, but the panel recognises a 15.625KHz frequency and promptly displays "!out of frequency". Sorry, but nothing I have yet seen suggests the VGA 24KHz constraint or the manuals are incorrect.
     
  18. MAW

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    As these screens are fast becoming the most popular, it'd be good to get to the bottom of this. Any more PMA owners comments? BTW your open-minded ness does you credit, many ALIS panel owners would have got abusive by now, they are a defensive lot. What I'd like to know is what use we are supposed to put this feature of YUV in via 15 pin vga if it's so restrictive. Is it just for HDTV in US and Japan?
     
  19. JamesTapp

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    I think there is some confusion here.

    Using the VGA connector, some screens allow you to pass component signal colourspace to the plasma instead of VGA RGB into the 15 pin DSub. If you then set the VGA input as Component in your plasma menus, you will not be subject to the frequency limitations specified.

    VGA signal input from John's RGB2VGA boxes won't work on this screen. Component signal input will. Hence, the RGB2YUV box is the one needed. If this plasma is able to accept component signals on the Dsub interface (I've checked the manual, I think page 22 says that it does, but you need the optional video unit) then a 3 RCA to DSub cable will work, but is only really needed if you are already using the component input for your DVD player.

    The other alternative is to buy an amp with component switching and this resolves the problem and lets you put the plasma remote in a drawer!!:D

    Hope this helps.

    James
     
  20. cynicaltaf

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    Glad to say... I was wrong! Thanks to an hour with a Video Generator, I can confirm that the 15-pin VGA inputs will accept 480i/576i component signals. The problems I had were with sync levels, which the PMA400 appears sensitive to. Unhelpfully it displays the '!out of frequency' message if there is any problem with the sync, not just if the frequency is out of limits. There is however definitely no option to use standard 15.625KHz RGB with these connectors, unlike the external phono component inputs which work great.

    Apologies to all for the FUD. I'm off to eat humble pie, and order a new DVD player with component outputs!
     

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