RGB output problem on Sony DVP-NS900

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by aevans, Nov 11, 2001.

  1. aevans

    aevans
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    I'm keen to have feedback from anyone else who's got a Sony DVP-NS900 DVD Player to help me and the shop I bought it from get to the bottom of the problems I've got;

    1) When playing back some content, either main film or additional features, the TV intermittently switches between inputs AV1 and AV2 (When DVD is connected to AV1, 2 or 3) on Sony KV-32FQ75 or 65.
    2) Whilst playing DVD, TV also intermittently keeps changing screen format from wide to 4:3 etc.

    Both problems only seem to occur when the NS900 output is set to RGB. The default setting of Video output seems to work without problem. But as expected, the picture quality is significantly degraded when set to Video.

    To help confirm the problem is with the NS900 and not the TV I’m keen to know if anyone else is getting the same problem with other makes of TV or not.
     
  2. Doubledoom

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    I saw a thread similar to this the other day in uk.media.home-cinema.

    You may want to take a look there too.
     
  3. Milhouse

    Milhouse
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    Fingers crossed, touch wood I hope you've fixed the problem for me!

    I read your post in the Television forum and tried switching the player to Composite output - yep, pretty crappy visuals compared with RGB which I'd always used. Watched about 10 mins of "Making the Matrix" and no switching - would have expected at least 20 switches during that time. Switched back to RGB output, watched "Making the Matrix" again and... still no switches.

    The TiVo Demo DVD which switched constantly is now no longer switching either when viewed with RGB. Very wierd, but I'm happy :D

    My only thought is this - I've ALWAYS watched in RGB, I don't think I've ever watched a disc with Composite output. The first thing I did on receiving the player was reconfigure it to use RGB output - perhaps there is a bug that requires you to watch something in Composite and then having done that you can change to RGB without fear of source switching. Sounds like a naff suggestion I know, but it's the only way I can explain it right now.

    Still be interested to hear what your engineer comes up with.

    EDIT: I couldn't find anything relevant in uk.media.home-cinema but that could be down to my ISP... I did however find this thread on Google/Deja which doesn't shed any more light on a solution but only confirms we are not alone... ;) Mine is not region modded, by the way.
     
  4. aevans

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    According to shop, Sony have confirmed they get the same problem on their test bench setup. So we're now waiting for them to look into it.

    Hope to have more news tomorrow.
     
  5. Milhouse

    Milhouse
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    Interesting - glad I didn't get mine region modded if it requires a fix from Sony :)
     
  6. Milhouse

    Milhouse
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    Hi aevans - any update on this problem from Sony? Mine has started switching again, so whatever I did provided only temporary respite.

    I purchased mine online from Empire Direct - I don't want to deal with them regarding a "known" fault (I'd rather deal with the organ grinder if possible to speed things along) so is there a number I can contact Sony on?
     
  7. Milhouse

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    Just spoken to Sony myself on their Helpline (08705 111 999), and this is officialy a known fault and is being reported across Europe - oh dear, who tested this design before it went to manufacture?? :eek: Apparently it was first reported by Sony France.

    Sony are working on a fix but nothing is available yet, they'll be phoning me back later this week with an update.

    To be honest if nothing is forthcoming within 1 to 2 months I'm not sure what to do - refund I guess as it's clearly defective and current stock almost certainly has the same fault so no point in a replacement - shame though as it's a top piece of kit (when it's not switching!) At some point I guess Sony will either offer a hardware and/or software upgrade or replace the unit.

    Anyone had any experience of how Sony normally resolve faulty DVD player firmware or hardware? Can't really take it back to the dealer as it was purchased online (would mean posting therefore major hassle) - the benefits of Bricks & Mortar I guess. :)
     
  8. stranger

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    this might sound obvious but it is easy to overlook, make sure component video is set to off in setup menu.
     
  9. Milhouse

    Milhouse
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    It is off - you can't select RGB output if component video is on :)

    I'm now getting this switching problem on both RGB and Component video, although the latter is switching maybe once every 5 to 10 minutes whereas the former switches at least a couple of times a minute.

    Oddly I DON'T get switching during the main feature, only on special features so it may be related to the material and hence a software problem, although aevans stated he gets it during the movie so who knows. :rolleyes:
     
  10. dsb

    dsb
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    you're not alone!
    i'm getting it too-and my tv is a sony!
    i get switching only with NTSC material-PAL switches fine.
    the players a good one but i'm not waiting a few months for a fix-for the price it costs it shouldn't have problems which my 170 pound samsung does!
    does the problem occur with the ns700 or other sony players?
     
  11. aevans

    aevans
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    Thanks for the feedback.

    I'm really frustrated by this now; I can't believe that clearly both these items have firmware problems.

    The shop I got it all from have been talking to Sony Technical Support every day for the last week and a half (apparently) and so far Sony have not provided any indication of a solution or timescales. All they've done is confirm there's a known problem.

    As I'm sure is true for everyone else, you pay the premium for Sony kit on the assumption that it's high quality kit and it's not going to have problems of any kind let alone major ones like this. Particularly when the items are at the top end of Sony’s product range!

    I'd really like to stick with the Sony set-up if I can, in my view the FQ75 is a great looking set with the best 100hz 32" picture on the market and the NS900 specification wise should be excellent, but I'm not prepared to wait weeks/months for the problems to be resolved.

    I sent Sony a complaint via their web site last Friday outlining the problems I’m experiencing, to which I've had no reply. So I'm going to call Sony myself tomorrow.

    I'll let you know what Sony have to say.

    Cheers
    Andy.
     
  12. aevans

    aevans
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    I spoke to Sony Technical Support today. They confirmed they’ve pinpointed the problem with the NS900 that causes the intermittent Format & Input switching. The problem is to do with the output voltage on one of the SCART pins that tells the TV what screen format to display. The current NS900 is outputting voltage ranges on the pin that are right at the bottom of the specification for SCART, If the TV is expecting voltage ranges at the higher end of the specification then the problem will occur. It’s know to be a problem with some Sony sets, including FQ75 & FX65, and some Philips sets.

    Sony in the UK has made a small circuit board mod to one of their machines, which seems to have fixed the problem. They’re now waiting for the OK from Japan to release it as a fix to retailers. Apparently this should be less than 2 weeks.
     
  13. dsb

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    the place i bought it from(multi region magic) still insist it's the tv at fault-bunch of jokers.
     
  14. Milhouse

    Milhouse
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    So would I have to return the unit to my vendor (Empire Direct) for forwarding to Sony for "repair", or can Sony do a pick up and return from my home?

    I seriously hope I don't have to send it all the way back to the middle man just so that Sony can fix their cock up.

    Thanks for the update aevans - needless to say Sony UK haven't yet called me back, I'll probably try phoning Mnday to see what's going on.
     
  15. aevans

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    I guess the easiest option will be to take it to any of Sony's authorised repair centres, who should mod it under the warranty.

    (unless you've had it multi-region hacked ??, or would they know ??)
     
  16. Milhouse

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    Not region hacked - will contact Sony in a week or two for details of the fix and my local dealer.

    Thanks for finding out the details so far!
     
  17. dsb

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    update from my supplier.
    sony have told them how to apply the fix and they say they have done it so hopefully i should have a fully working player tomorrow.
    basically they say that as the laser moves across the disc the speed of the disc alters,this causes the voltage from the scart to vary although they really didn't know why this should be.
     
  18. Milhouse

    Milhouse
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    Very poor design by the sounds of it - and this is supposed to be the Quality Standard range? :confused:

    Please post an update once you have the fix - you can be the forum guinea pig on this one!! ;)
     
  19. brunobastille

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    Hi everybody,
    I'm bruno from Paris, france, and I got exactly the same issues than you all with my Sony DVP-NS900 : i've bought at the beginning of november. My TV is a SONY 36'' KV-36FS70.

    Each time that I run a 4/3 DVD, the TV switches from the DVD RGB input to, for instance my scope input on the TV.

    And of course, the TV, even if I play will its various auto format parameters, hesiates between large+, full, formats....

    I've bought the DVP-NS900 on november, 2nd. At november 4th, the customer service of Sony France was informed by me about this problem. Their advice was to replace this model by another one. Was done, november 7th.....same thing, and we made some tests in my dealer's shop : same issues.

    I've spent several days to try the largest possible number of combinations between TV-set-up and DVD set-up. Nothing changed.

    I've called several times the Sony France customer service, and their only answer is : we will call you back when we will have run some tests, and when we will have some news for you...

    Since more than two weeks : no news.....and, unfortunately, I'm pleased to know that I'm not alone to have this issue...on a french homecinema chat, we are 3 or 4 people to have the same issues with this DVD player, and only with people who own SONY TV's....

    I hope, that this issue will be resolved asap, and if not, I will warn the largest nulmber of people not to buy this machine and will do my best to get my money back and buy...a Pioneer DVD player (like my previous DVD player)..

    Regards,
    Bruno
     
  20. dsb

    dsb
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    i do not know what french law is like but british consumer law says that if something faulty is supplied the customer can demand a refund.
    my supplier has accepted this and promised me a refund if the player still does not work.
    of course i would prefer to have a working player-if i wanted a different model i would have bought that one to begin with.
     
  21. brunobastille

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    I think that the french laws also allows the customer to get his money back : of course, me too, I would prefer to have a good working player...the SACD quality is great, but it needs to be burned-in a very long time.
    After all the tests I've made, I saw that the picture quality was better when the DVD is setup as S-video and when I use a Scart cable connected on the AV2 or AV3 of my TV. The RGB setup of the DVD is not so "precise" in term of picture quality, compared to the s-video setup...
     
  22. trucho

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    here you can see scart pin arrangement. http://www.mpeg2-dvb.com/scart.htm Possible solution could be to remove pin 8 from scart to stop switching signal reaching t.v.
     
  23. dsb

    dsb
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    that will work-that's what i did originally.
    but to be honest-why should we?
    with a 450 quid player workarounds should not be necessary.
    and if you plan to use the scart passthrough with sky digital etc you really do need switching or you'll be pressing the screen aspect ratio button on your tv control a lot.
     
  24. trucho

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    good point. As a matter of interest, whats the svideo picture like on this model? I can't tell the difference between RGB and Svideo on my Pioneer DV717
     
  25. brunobastille

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    you are right : I had, before the DVP-NS900, the 717 of Pioneer..and the RGB output was the best, even compared to the s-video...but with the Sony (and a Home-cinema magazine has the same conclusion with the Sony dpv-ns700), it is obvious that the s-video has a better precision on the picture (definition, sharper image)....
    Bruno
     
  26. aevans

    aevans
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    Hmm, not sure I agree with you there. I'm sure that during my tests I found RGB to give me the sharpest picture. It could be because mine is connected to a different TV (KV-32FQ75). It could also be that I've just forgotten what it looked like...... seen as the NS900 has been back at the shop for almost 3 weeks now !!!

    Just to clarify what Sony told me with regard to the problem, the reason the problem is linked to the laser moving is simply due to the fact that when the servo motor activates to move the laser it's causing a slight voltage drop to the circuitry supplying the SCART output. The fix that they've come up with is to put a link wire on the circuit board to bring power from somewhere else to supply that piece of circuitary.

    I don't know what the rest of you think, but I'm having serious second thoughts about keeping the NS900. If Sony have managed to build this fault into the shipped unit it doesn't give me much confidence in the quality of the rest of the componentry.

    That said, the Sony engineer I spoke to at Sony Technical Support did a good job of talking me into keeping it. He was raving about it saying what a great piece of kit he thought it was and that he was planning to upgrade to it himself..... or though he would say that wouldn't he ?

    Andy.
     
  27. aevans

    aevans
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    I just got a reply to the complaint I posted on Sony UK's web site regarding the problems I'm having with the KV-32FQ75 & DVP-NS900. It's only taken them 11 days to respond !

    This is real customer service quality, just what you'd expect from a premium brand like Sony.. Not !!


    -----Original Message-----
    From: SUK, General CIC [mailto:SUK.GeneralCIC@eu.sony.com]
    Sent: 27 November 2001 11:56
    To: 'a.d.evans@btinternet.com'
    Subject: RE: COMPLAINT


    Dear Mr Evans,

    Thank you for your e-mail, I apologise for the delay in replying.

    I am sorry to read of the problems you have been experiencing with your Sony
    DVD Player and TV. The problems you have described are not known to us
    though we deal with product information and not actual service issues. If
    you have been told we recognise this is a problem then that would seem to be
    correct but any requests for the timescale of investigating this will need
    to be put to the retailer who can then chase his contact within Sony on this
    matter. Unfortunately I have no way of knowing who they have been dealing
    with so have no way of chasing this enquiry.

    Yours sincerely,

    Richard Stephens,

    For and on behalf of
    Sony United Kingdom Limited



    Great help Eh !
     
  28. dsb

    dsb
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    got my supposedly fixed playeer back today and....
    it has exactly the same problem as before!
    refund time i think-shame really as in many ways it was a great player.
     
  29. Milhouse

    Milhouse
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    Phoned Sony Helpline to follow up my original call from the 19th and theres been no progress other than to escalate the issue to a supervisor :confused:

    Will give it till next week to chase again and then demand some sort of resolution if it's not forthcoming.
     
  30. Milhouse

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    Holy cr*p - this doesn't sound good :eek:
     

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