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RGB or Component - Preferences ?

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by briandzo, May 31, 2003.

  1. briandzo

    briandzo
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    I thought i would start a thread about what we've found to be our preferred source for feeding our plazma's (& crt's).

    My system is generally configured for component.
    But last night just for a change i connected a cheap VGA cable configured for RGB to the plazma.

    It seemed that not only was the image more colourful and accurate (skin tones) it also seemed sharper.

    It would seem we are led to believe that component is the way to go. My experience in digital broadcasting equipment would suggest that YUV (component) is the easiest and best way to manipulate digital video. As the 'Y' part is the black & white luminance segment of the video where the 'U' & 'V' components hold the colour parts of the video. Manipulating the Colour & luminance channels separeately is far easier than manipulating digitized RGB.

    Furthermore DVD is recorded YUV therefore decoding the DVD into its purist form YUV would seem the best method.
    (hence component output dvd players being a selling point)

    This is Where our display technology differs from the prefered digital video methods.

    As traditionally our display plazma's & crt's have Three Colour Guns red green and Blue to display the picture.

    So again it would seem the best signal to supply a display would be RGB as the feeds need no converting, just directly fed to the Gun. Or little charged Plazma's in our case.
    therefore when we insist on feeding our plazma with the finest
    raw component signal stripped from DVD, it will then get
    converted to RGB for the final display and viewing for our Eyes.

    So who if any have tried both methods RGB & YUV and what did you Prefer ?
     
  2. philipb

    philipb
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    I have my 3800 connected by component, but i did once try it using the RGB scart out via a RGB/VGA converter and it seemed as good if not a touch better. Still not as good though as via DVI fromma PC.
     
  3. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
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    This isn't really new. We have always rec component over svideo over composite for say DVD connection. However MANY panels / panel projectors have poor internal electronics that REALLY benefit for a RGB signal. The Panny AE100 is a classic example of this needing to work at 480wide (RGB) for optimum performance. Howver all these devices are PS and it is illegal to output a PS RGB signal from an internal DVD player, only component is allowed (BUT Arcam can do it). Hence the interest in 'external' boxes.

    Think of it like this all the best CRT use RGBHV signals and all the best panel based equipment uses DVI! HDCP aware of course...
     
  4. symanski

    symanski
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    Early on in the development of the RGB to Component converter, one of my customers did a comparison of RGB via the Plasma VGA unit and component. Keep in mind that the component converter is a high-bandwidth design, but on his Panasonic screen, was slightly softer than the Plasma VGA route. But for some displays, going via the component route will give a better picture.

    Essentially, RGB and component are both very high quality signals. Your source, and your display, are both critical to getting the best picture. Without one or the other, you're stuck. And if you need a converter to get the best from your screen, then get a converter. You must use the right signals to begin with, anything else would be folly.

    All the best,

    Dr John Sim.
     
  5. RAMiAM

    RAMiAM
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    My thinking when I set up my system was to keep the signal path as pure as possible and to eliminate as many format conversions as possible.

    So for DVD, which is recorded/stored as YUV and my player had YUV outputs I kept the signal as YUV - so hopefully no format conversions at all.

    But with Sky Digital I opted for RGB(HV) which would negate the need for one last RGBS to YUV conversion.
    Sky Broadcast = MPEG = YUV which is then converted to RGBS internally to output via Scart.
    So I have taken the RGBS via scart and simply stripped the sync from composite into H&V.
    This would also benefit me two fold, if my theory is correct, that the panel will convert all signals to RGBHV anyway?
    And if this is true maybe I should take the RGB from my DVD player which probably has a better YUV to RGB processor in it than my Pio Panel.

    The end of the day it's best to try each signal format and see which looks best to you on your panel with your source equipment :)

    RAMiAM
     
  6. symanski

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    Agreed. Some will work best with a certain signals, some with others. But from experience, we can say what will work best and what advantages each route will offer you.

    Converting from one video signal to another doesn't mean that you're going to loose quality though. If the conversion is done correctly, it will be fine.

    All the best,

    Dr John Sim.
     
  7. StooMonster

    StooMonster
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    As we are all aware:
    1. MPEG2 is in YUV
    2. Screen display is RGB

    Question: is it better to have source or target do the YUV to RGB convertion? (e.g. DVD player or screen)

    I am in a position to test this because I have an Arcam FMJ DV27+ DVD player this can output progressive RGsB as well as regular YUV (naughty naughty Arcam). I have a Panny5 50" screen that will allow YUV inputs to be set to RGsB. Therefore can use same BetterCables Silver Serpent cables, same inputs and just change firmware settings for comparison tests.

    Test one: target does YUV2RGB convertion
    DVD player outputs YUV, cables carry YUV signal, screen converts to RGB for display.

    Test two: source does YUV2RGB convertion
    DVD player converts YUV and outputs RGsB, cables carry RGsB signal, screen displays RGB.

    Result:
    Can't see a difference, with film sources vs video or Region1 vs Region2 or progressive vs interlace!

    Any suggestions for DVDs to play/compare? Where differences may be more apparent.

    Notes:
    1. A thought is that RGB has more bandwidth, and could require better cables (no pun intended) to not degrade the signal.
    2. I’ve talked about this on these forums before, and someone claimed that plasma’s convert incoming RGB2YUV before converting it back to RGB for display; this in their argument that YUV is better output from player.

    Therefore, it’s open – to me they look exactly the same. And I have no preference of one over the other.

    StooMonster
     
  8. Nike

    Nike
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    Component; This is the only way I can utilise my players PS output.
     
  9. StooMonster

    StooMonster
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    So you haven't tried both then? ;)

    StooMonster
     
  10. Nike

    Nike
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    My previous player's 'best' output was RGB scart, so I used the screen's RGB input with this (via a JS tech RGB scart to RGBHV converter).

    The component progressive was such large improvement, that I didn't bother trying this connection method with my current player. (have now sold the converter box)
     
  11. briandzo

    briandzo
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    stoomonster,

    Did you notice a differance in the ampification of the signals
    that is to say did you have to adjust the brightness/contrast
    settings quite a lot after doing the switch.

    because on my orig test when switching to YUV i had to
    reduce both settings quite a lot.

    As the signal was all washed out when switching from rgb2yuv.

    Thus suggesting the Y signal was on the large side.

    Oh i wish i had a scope.
    both RGB & YUV signals should be 700mV when terminated (75ohm).
     
  12. StooMonster

    StooMonster
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    Brian

    The amplification on both signals looks exactly the same. I don't have to change any settings on screen.

    With the Arcam DV27+ and the Panny5-50" it takes seconds to change settings; and switch between the two standards. I can almost flick between them, and the picture looks the same; I do not have to adjust brightness, contrast or any other setting.

    The DV27+ is particularly good at progressive RGB; even though this is not officially supported. It looks to me like the Arcam provides an equal RGB and YUV signal.

    After starting down the DIY path, I have been checking eBay for a cheap scope. :blush: I must go going mad. :eek:

    StooMonster
     
  13. briandzo

    briandzo
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    Stoo,

    ive noticed you can buy pc s/w that emulate osciloscopes.
    not sure what the cost is, but probably cheaper than the real thing.

    After further in depth tests Ive also noticed there appears very little differance between the 2 video formats displays.

    So ill stick with YUV.

    Mind you the pioneer display does need readjusting.
    its not like the panny where you can switch between the two
    and all levels remain the same.
     
  14. StooMonster

    StooMonster
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    Not that I would have the faintest idea how to use it! ;)

    Just checked eBay and some look to be quite cheap -- less than my digital sound meter anyway.

    StooMonster
     

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