RF Out signal from sky - Channel Interference

Discussion in 'Sky Digital TV Forum' started by gkinghrn, Nov 27, 2010.

  1. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    Hi all,

    Had a search around the forums for a bit before posting this and also searched round on the web in general but struggling to really get to grips with what my problem is.

    I have a normal aerial up on the roof ... it connects down via co-ax to an old 'powered' splitter (6 splits)in my loft and thus routes round the house. On some of the furthest away TV's I've had to add in a signal booster to get a decent picture. so far so good.

    Q1 - is there a limit to the length of Co-ax before signal degrades - it bothers me I have had to add a few of these to get a decent signal.

    Now I also have 2 sky boxes and I have taken an RF feed from both of these (changed RF out channels so they dont clash) and fed those up to the powered splitter in the loft so in effect I have 3 RF-In's going to that single splitter.

    However the issue I now have is that the Sky RF-out signals are of very dubious (crap) quality and almost unwatchable on the TV sets throughout the house. I've checked everything seems to match-up (Rf-out channels etc). But beginning to wonder if it's just 'congestion' with the current terrestrial channels , the powered splitter , and if there is an optimin RF-out setting..

    Trial and error has yielded no improvement that I can see.

    am I missing something or would it be worth paying an expert to come in and sort this out.

    Thanks for your views in advance....
     
  2. logiciel

    logiciel
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    Hi.
    You're never going to get much of a result out of aerial cables and the more cable there is the worse it will get.
    Are the results from the aerial to the TVs equally poor on both analogue and digital channels?
    If you've tried the full range of free analogue channels for the Sky outputs there's not much more to be done.
    My way of getting the Sky channels would be by videosender.
     
  3. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    Yep - all co-ax... it was installed by previous owner - thru all the walls so bit of a nightmare to change. I would expect at least a clear signal round the house. Most of the analogue channels are fine and if I add the booster at strategic points they seem ok. It's merely the Sky signals that show a lot of interference and I cant work out if it's due to the signal bosters or just congestion and channels all close to one another.

    Video senders aren't much good i don't think. I am in a brick built house and I have to have 3 wireless hubs in it all wired to each other to use wi-fi seemlessly.. cant think that video being sent wirelessly would fare any better so it has to be wired. ergo my problem...

    :(
     
  4. Rick1

    Rick1
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    There's loads of factors to consider here.

    The quality of the existing cable, the connectors being used, the quality of the boosters used, the settings (if any) on the boosters, routes of the cables themselves .........

    There's a whole host of issues it could be, any not knowing what to look for so working on a trial and error basis, could end up costing you more than getting a good fitter in to do the job.

    Or you could start from scratch and fit a whole new system, just be prepared to do a fair bit of research into how to do it right.

    From the sounds of it your problem isn't isolated to the sky boxes, from your post I get the impression your terrestrial reception is being effected aswell.
     
  5. logiciel

    logiciel
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    Yes, as you don't mention digital terrestrial reception.
    I get the point about wireless but I'd try a videosender, from Argos so you could take it back no questions asked.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2010
  6. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
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    Easy to test. Disconnect aerial cable from Sky Digibox.
     
  7. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    The terrestrial reception (analogue/digital) is ok in the main and it stays fine when I add the sky RF-out's in... it's just the signal quality out of the Sky Rf's is poor everywhere -just seems odd (I have 2 sky boxes with different co-ax cables so it's not a cable issue I don't think) - might engage the services of a man who knows what he's doing but this should be do-able ..clearly there is something fundamental though...
     
  8. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
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    Easy to test. Disconnect aerial cable from Sky Digibox.
     
  9. logiciel

    logiciel
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    What he said.
     
  10. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    maybe i am being thick guys but how does disconnectiong the sky-rf out help me fix the issue of the shy-rf out signals being awful??? I need it connected to see the signal..... If I run direct into a TV from the RF-out from sky box it's fine ...

    Appreciate all the comments and help here but it does seem to be a tear it up and start again job methinks... Might try a newer main control unit - the one here is pretty old I suspect so maye anewer one will do a better job of keeping channles clearer @ Something like this : Triax - Domestic Distribution Unit (DDU)
     
  11. Stevenage Neil

    Stevenage Neil
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    He didn't say that.

    He told you to disconnect the terrestrial aerial from the RF In on the Sky box.
    If your Sky signal improves you have a RF channel clash.
     
  12. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    well because the Aerial in isn't connected - it's the sky signal I am sending not the Terrestrial/Digital TV. Sorry I should have made that clearer.
     
  13. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
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    So how are you able to watch terrestrial TV if your aerial isn't connected to the Sky Digibox for distribution via the RF Output?
     
  14. logiciel

    logiciel
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    Yes, how does that tie in with your first post:
    "I have a normal aerial up on the roof ... it connects down via co-ax to an old 'powered' splitter (6 splits)in my loft and thus routes round the house. On some of the furthest away TV's I've had to add in a signal booster to get a decent picture."?
    Is that connection direct to the TV in the main room then?
     
  15. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
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    I get this every day when people email me for advice. They try to describe a wiring diagram in words instead of simply sketching it out and uploading the sketch for me to see. It wastes a lot of time and frequently, because they can't be bothered, they don't get a useful answer.

    I do recommend everyone with a problem like this to upload a wiring sketch and include the link to it in the first post.
     
  16. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    @Logic : I never ever said it I had the terrestrial wire attached to the Sky box - you assumed that.

    @Martin : Not my intention to mislead and I get the point about a diagram. I'll upload a PDF to illustrate it....
     
  17. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    Here's what it looks like....
     

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  18. logiciel

    logiciel
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    I didn't assume anything - I asked you a question, guessed the answer, and find that my guess was correct.
    So, to go back to the problem, in answer to your question there isn't any setting that can be done to improve the signals from the two Sky receivers, though I suppose you could give them individual amplifiers. You suggested congestion as the explanation but presumably you've handled that by giving the two Sky outputs channel numbers well away from the terrestrial ones and from the Freeview carriers. Apart from that there's the question of the cable quality and of the plugs and connections, which have to be right to get the best effect from this sort of system.
     
  19. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
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    OK, I've looked at your wiring sketch but it doesn't show how your Digibox RF feeds are connected to the 6-output amplifier. Unless that amplifier is designed with 3 RF input sockets AND you've ensured that all three input signals are at the same level (and not overloading the amplifier) then the problems you have are inevitable.
     
  20. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    Ah ok thanks guys - I suspect that the way the Rf-In is configured then is probably the fault then. On the old distribution box... All 3 Rf-in's go into the one socket :blush: through one of those Y-shape connectors (actually more like an X connecvtor I guess) - used to split 1 signal to 3 outputs but in this case is used in reverse as 3 into 1 and therefore into the single RF-In.

    so would replacing the distribution panel with one with 3 seperate RF-In's do the trick possibly?

    Appreciate the continued responses...
     
  21. logiciel

    logiciel
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    Good one MP - I was just taking it for granted that the amplifier/splitter had three separate inputs.

    There are plenty of other factors though, so a new panel wouldn't guarantee a result.
     
  22. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
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    I doubt such a thing exists. A LoftBox has two UHF inputs - one for the TV aerial and one for a CCTV camera modulated RF.

    It's usual to daisy chain TV aerial -> [anything else] -> Sky Digibox RF2.
    The latter comes last so that a magic eye can have control.

    It is possible to connect up to four Sky Digiboxes if an SPC4 "Super Plus Combiner" is used.

    I'll let someone else link to it. ;)
     
  23. fernandez

    fernandez
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  24. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
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    Thanks, F. You're a pal. ;)
     
  25. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    Thanks guys. Dont midn spending £28 to try something. Tho I appreciate this may not be all my issues resolved but it helps to do it a bit more 'correct'.

    Just need to think how I connect this now...


    Would this take my sky RF out plus the existing terrestrial aerial as the inputs then and I simply feed a single rf-out from thos box to the existing loftbox then?

    see pic...
     

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  26. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
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    Unfortunately, I can't see how this would work.
     
  27. logiciel

    logiciel
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    That looks like the new device will be taking over from the Y-combiner that you've been using.
    Its intention is to give separate control of each receiver but I don't know if it will also improve the picture quality.
     
  28. gkinghrn

    gkinghrn
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    ok thanks guys. Seems such a simple thing to try and do (essentially 3 x RF-out feeds to go to multiple rf-outs) ... maybe I need to re-think the entire thing including the technology at play here.

    Really appreciate the time you guys have taken to try and help me out - very much appreciated.
     
  29. logiciel

    logiciel
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    That's OK, and if you do think again about the whole thing include the possibility of videosenders.
     
  30. Dazspire

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    Hi Guys

    been reading the thread with interest. I bought the house next door some time ago and started running two sky boxes one for the main room and our bedroom (direct feed on RF66) which was fine and the other box for the family room run to the kids rooms on RF66). Both ran beautifully very simple system. We could change channels without running downstairs but it worked.

    Then I decided to get a proper system including powered amplifiers, remote eyes, new cabling, new aerials including FM and DAB as I love listen to radio and upgraded aerial ready for freeview and the digital switchover which here is next August. I got in a local specialist who seemingly did a really good job for the lot and when he left everything was fine no interference same RF's on both boxes. He used good quality cable connectors etc and I had new aerial outlet boxes put in each room for TV and FM/DAB. Some months later we had some work done on the house and a re-organise of bedroms etc and I asked him back to re-jig where necessary. Again just the main sky to our bedroom and the conservatory and the second box signal to other rooms.

    He ended up linking in another amplifier near the second sky box and relaying some cables. Afterwards the kids suddenly had access to my sky box (watch rather than control) and their own box (watch and control) but the picture from box two was awful. He had apparently changed the RF on box two to 60 but there was interference and whichever RF I tried the same problem (slight better or worse) the result was the same.

    I got him on the phone and he then said the RF range was just to crowded and until the analogue switch off the problem would remain. I asked him why the kids now could see my box and he said he had had to re-route things and add another amplifier because I had added a feed into the conservatory and there was nothing he could do. He said he would not come back very disappointingly he had come highly recommended.

    To cut a long story short he has rogered my system which was ok until he came back. I have tried to get him back again but to no avail just the same excuses. The questions bugging me are-

    1) is he right when the anaolgue switch off comes will the interference go if i give box 2 a new RF out number or will the free view digital channels take up the RF's left vacant and we are back to square one?
    2) Shall I just get in someone else to try and fathom what he did and undue the thing?
    3) Or is there a simple answer and I am missing something really basic?

    I am reasonably ok with things like this normally being an enthusiastic amatuer but I am finding this one hard to work out and almost resigned to getting in another bod unless he is right about the analogue switch off being my salvation.

    The kids are driving crackers complaining about the picture quality in their rooms (so would i be incidentally if it was my picture. There freeview pictures are fine reallly good in fact just the sky on box 2. Oddly the picture from the main box on RF60 is fine but that just makes their frustration worse. Help would be really appreciated. :lease:
     

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