Using REW EQ to assign filters to be used in jRiver's PEQ. Which equaliser have you chosen in REW's drop down, 'Generic'?
Hey Conrad, apologies for the delay in my response to your last post (which was quite excellent btw). I have not yet implemented all of your suggestions from the last post, but to be fair, if I don't fully understand every detail then I tend to take my time with stuff so I don't screw it up. That means that usually I end up being the turtle and not the hare, lol. And I am glad to hear that the full frequency response looks good; I had done some acoustic treatment in the room and was curious on if I had overdone it or anything along those lines. Here are my replies to the parts of your post that I quoted above.
1. - I knew that the VNF subs would be tricky and might not measure as well as the others would, but I had hoped that with those subs it would help to smooth out the overall response and maybe gain some additional output as well. My primary goal though was to provide some really good slam and give a good TR at the seating positions since I had decided against doing butt kickers.
2. - In the connection chain that you listed, you had the AVR's sub output 2 going to input 1 in the minidsp, so I wanted to clarify - I would need to use a Y-splitter (2 female to 1 male) to combine the 2 sub outs on the AVR to have them both going into input 1 on the minidsp, correct?
3. - You are right sir, that is indeed how I was splitting the signal for the 2 sub pairs coming out from the minidsp.
4. - If I am to use a splitter for the 2 sub outputs on the AVR going to input 1 on the minidsp, would that mess with the signal being sent to the minidsp at all? And when you say the trims, I'm assuming that you mean the individual channel trims - I have 3 different ways of adjusting the the levels for the subs in my AVR (levels, trims, and sub adjustment) so I just wanted to be sure.
5. - I do like the small bump in overall output that the front center sub gives me, but to your point, I could simply adjust the sub levels to compensate so I am considering taking it out of the sub chain to flatten my response.
6. - To be honest, I'm not really sure why the subs run that hot. I try to ensure that the Dynamic EQ function is turned off in the AVR when I run my sweeps, and I did level match everything to around 75dB in the minidsp per your advice. For what its worth though, when I watch TV or movies or listen to music the bass doesn't sound too overwhelming or too intense (except on some content that was mixed to be intentionally bass heavy), but I guess that could just be my personal perception/preference.
And as far as craving the ULF bass, I'm not sure if that's what I really want or not since I'm not sure that I've ever had any real exposure to ULF capable subs in a system. So far, I am really happy with the smoothness of the bass response after all the work I had done, and it has been much more refined with your excellent contributions. I just like having a strong 'kick' or 'pop' on the bass effects in a movie when it's called for.
7. - I will take your tip on potentially changing out the 6 subs for 2 or 3 really good ones under consideration. It was a battle to get wife approval on having that many subs in the room so I don't want to revert to a smaller # of subs too quickly, lest I put myself at a disadvantage for future negotiations, lol. What led me to take the approach that I did was a combination of 2 things - budget (I got those 6 subs for under $780 in total) and a desire to get the smoothest response that I could get. So far, I feel pretty happy with how the bass is performing in the system, but who knows how I may feel down the road if I get bitten by the 'optimization bug' again, lol.
I hope you had an excellent thanksgiving holiday; that is if you celebrate it where you are located. I think I remember your post saying 'with you being in the US'. I'll be looking forward to hearing your advice again when I start trying to properly integrate my mains with the subs. Until next time, take care sir!
AVR output 1 - minidsp input 1 - minidsp output 1 - Y splitter - front left and front right subs
AVR output 1 - minidsp input 1 - minidsp output 2 - rear sub (1.5ms delay)
AVR output 1 - minidsp input 1 - minidsp output 3 - center sub
AVR output 2 - minidsp input 2 - minidsp output 4 - Y splitter - VNF Subs (7ms delay)
- Does that statement change based on the correction in point 2?
- You have it so you might as well use it. It's not too detrimental and it does give a nice mid-bass bump. By using more subs you can lower the overall gain which means less distortion.
- Only you can determine this. If this sounds good to you and you're happy, great. It looks hot, but it might not sound it. Watch the opening 10/15 minutes of Overlord or Godzilla: King of the Monsters and see if that sounds too much.
not so much in the low end,That's the drawback. You could end up compromising the rest of the system in the process. I still think it's worth a go just to see what results you get.
Is the goal to get more low end output from the Subs?
not so much in the low end,
actual sweeps of subs located anywhere at the front of the room show a wide dip between 26Hz to 59Hz
Adding a sub at the rear, and running REW it looks as if it fills in the dip, then running EQ returns a flat FR
but I think in reality that only hides and doesn't fix the lack of output from the front
inputting the room dimensions and MLP position into Room Sim there are no good positions for subs at the front of the room unless you move the MLP dead center
there are some restrictions for positioning
I usually use front right and rear left corners
once Q'd I can get a flat response but because of the poor FR at Front right have always thought that the front right sub was wasted
I have just bought some SVS subs which are not performing to the hype so I am revisiting sub and MLP positioning
the rear left sub does fill in and hides the front dipDoes the rear sub fill in any dips in the front subs response or are they fighting each other? Individually mine don't look wonderful but combined and EQ'd they're much better. If their combined response looked naff I'd be a bit more concerned!
I have also added crossovers (subs EQ'd)
Hi ConradThanks. I think I agree, the front sub isn't really adding anything. A little bit of low end and some smoothness between 80 and 100Hz. From 28Hz up to about 75Hz the rear is doing most of the work.
Probably worth investigating other positions.
As Jase says though (and I'm sure you know) two poor responses don't matter, it's the combined response that matters. That said, two good responses would be preferred.
Is colocating an option? You can use the alignment tool to see what a duplicate of the rear sub would give you with some time alignment.
I can hardly move a 9 stone PB16 so lifting onto the MLP is a no goJust a thought. Can REW be used to run a sweep in real time like a Velodyne SMS-1/DD Sub or Anthems ARC Quick Measure?
If you placed a sub at your MLP then went around the room with the mic to see where the best responses are it would certainly save shifting subs all around the room and measuring each time.
I can hardly move a 9 stone PB16 so lifting onto the MLP is a no go
Guys I am heading out,thank god I hear you say Lol
look forward to more comments will call back later