Replacement Rear Lights And Insurance

Fatti

Novice Member
My wife has a Peugeot 206 Cabriolet and, after recently deciding the rear lights were a bit boring, ordered herself a set of Lexus-style replacements. At the same time, her insurance had just been renewed and she was waiting for the new documents to come through. She gave the AA a ring to confirm they were on there way, mentioned that she had replaced the original lights with some new ones and asked them if the new lights would have any affect on the policy. At the time they didn't know but would get back to her. They phoned back today to say that the insurance firm she had the policy with would now not insure her with the new lights. They've changed her policy to a new firm who are now more expensive...just because she's changed the back lights:confused:

Can anyone on here who works in insurance shed any light (pardon the pun) as to why replacing the rear lights could cause one firm not to now offer insurance and another to put the price up. They are only lights...they don't make the car any faster, and, they are probably cheaper than if she went to Peugeot for OEM replacements.
 

Mylo

Novice Member
Unfortunately some insurance companies will not allow any mods at all. Others will allow non-performance enhancing mods, but you have to tell them.

There is always a possibility with rear lights that they either don't meet the UK standards or are for show use only. The other possibility is that the insurance company may class them as unsafe as they are not standard OEM.

An expert will be along soon though hopefully to give you a better educated opinion.
 

sean5302

Banned
I work for a manufacturer.

Lights, as with all components, undergo extensive testing by us, and are certificated to comply with EU standards. You will have seen the "E" markings.

"Bling" lights usually are sourced cheaply from China and Korea, rarely carrying "E" markings.

At worst, they may be smoked excessively, emit low levels of light and someone could rear-end you because you had inadequate brake lights. Some folks think that running into the back of someone is automatic blame. It's not. If you fit inadequate lights, most District Judges will blame you. If you haven't declared them to your Ins. Co., they can deny liability and you'll pay for both vehicles.

At best, they'll be OK, but will make your car more attractive, hence more likely to be stolen. That was the point in fitting them, n'est ce pas?

Finally, Ins Co's authorise repairs to insured vehicles, based on their knowledge of time delays in sourcing parts. Some Japanese personal import vehicles end up written-off because a headlamp could take 3 months to obtain. Only fair that you disclose non-standard parts up-front.

I wasn't going to write this, but for completeness, some Ins Co's look for any reason not to pay out. Fitting these lights could amount to that.
 

riget

Banned
My son has a 206 and he fitted cheap lexus style rear lamps, they are road legal and have the E markings, he was rear ended luckily the lamps were not broken but it needed a new rear wing, the insurance inspected it and never mentioned the lights. It was repaired at a peugeot dealers and the other party's insurance paid for it.
Some 206 models have them fitted as standard.
 

Fatti

Novice Member
Thanks for all the responses guys. The company's FAQ mentions that a majority of it's lights are E-approved for use in the UK and will pass an MOT. They clearly mark those lights that are not road legal. It would appear the Peugeot ones are OK :)
 

Beobloke

Active Member
Fatti said:
They are only lights...they don't make the car any faster............
:rolleyes:
Oh don't be so silly, of course they do - why do you think they are fitted to so many Novas and Saxos??
As a rough guide -

Set of Lexarse lights = extra 7mph
Huge fart can exhaust = extra 10mph
Neon lights under the car = extra 8mph
Pounding subwoofer = extra 12mph (unless you get the phase wrong of course.......)
Shopping list of tat stuck to the car on the front wing = extra 3mph
Huge ironing board spoiler = extra 16mph (18 if it's a different colour).

So, by adding the lot to your 1.2 Nova, you have increased its top speed from 96mph to 154mph, which is why you should never try and race one, because you'll always lose.........
;)
 

SeanT

Distinguished Member
Interesting thread, although I think Lexus style lights are hideous, where does one stand when fitting parts from a more stylish (or up to date) model of the same car.
Doesn't matter a bit to me, as my car is extensively modified and my insurance is therefore with the only firm who will cover it :)
 

sean5302

Banned
A very clever question, SeanT.

I think you tease us, knowing the answer.

I heartily recommend GSF carparts. www.gsfcarparts.com
They used to sell vastly cheaper genuine parts for VAG, BMW, Merc etc.
Also, they sold copies, even cheaper.

Daimler-Chrysler were miffed and sued.
The writ claimed safety as prime objective. If you put a copy of the Merc tri-star badge on your car and mowed a pedestrian down, that copy badge could inflict more damage than the OE item.

That copy Merc alloy wheel could shatter if you drove over a pebble in the road.

The EU has been asked to prevent the supply of any parts other than genuine OE manufacturers ones. We're awaiting the results.
 

Layne RIP

Novice Member
SeanT said:
Interesting thread, although I think Lexus style lights are hideous

I agree those lexus style things look real tacky!!

As a note though peugeot did those lights as an option... i remember having to fit some to cars when i did the PDI's...
 

Steve.J.Davies

Novice Member
sean5302 said:
A very clever question, SeanT.

I think you tease us, knowing the answer.

I heartily recommend GSF carparts. www.gsfcarparts.com
They used to sell vastly cheaper genuine parts for VAG, BMW, Merc etc.
Also, they sold copies, even cheaper.

Daimler-Chrysler were miffed and sued.
The writ claimed safety as prime objective. If you put a copy of the Merc tri-star badge on your car and mowed a pedestrian down, that copy badge could inflict more damage than the OE item.

That copy Merc alloy wheel could shatter if you drove over a pebble in the road.

The EU has been asked to prevent the supply of any parts other than genuine OE manufacturers ones. We're awaiting the results.
Holy parts prices Batman !

Am used to merc parts prices (sob, graon, whimper..) and this place a revelation. replaced Cat on wifes car a while ago - price in catalog a quarter of the price of Merc one !! (body still convulsing with sobs... head banging on keyboard)

I don't care if they are from GSF as long as made to same spec as merc ones.
and there lies the rub I suppose.
Can see the engineering argument from Mercedes. But also see how that is used to keep up prices...

years ago saw a piece about building a morris minor from parts - it worked out at five time cost of buying a new car. wonder what the modern day equivalent is....

These parts really pukka stuff then ?
 

sean5302

Banned
Steve, my friend,

you can buy a Bosch alternator in a Bosch box for £50.
you can buy an identical Bosch alternator in a Mercedes box for £240.
That same alternator will cost you £372.15 at a Mercedes dealer. For an S280. I have done the homework.

Valeo lamps
Brembo brake discs
Getrag gearboxes
etc
etc.

I buy parts for our family's cars there myself. The place is owned by Stan West. A man deeply concerned with quality parts at bargain basement prices.

I have no business link to GSF, or to Euro, but they are both excellent companies.
 
B

Biskitboy

Guest
One point not mentioned is that mods can often make a car a more tempting target for thieves and higher risk = higher premium.

Each to their own of course but personally I find the "lexus" style lights mostly hideous.
 

Steve.J.Davies

Novice Member
sean5302 said:
Steve, my friend,

you can buy a Bosch alternator in a Bosch box for £50.
you can buy an identical Bosch alternator in a Mercedes box for £240.
That same alternator will cost you £372.15 at a Mercedes dealer. For an S280. I have done the homework.
My god that is scandalous.
Not your homework - the differential :)

have heard that build price for a large car isn't that much more than that for a medium and that not much more than for a small (assuming similar 'stuff' I suppose). unlike the list prices.. and parts prices !!!

Can see why Mercedes trying to quash this in court. thats a mark-up the Mafia would dream of getting - over seven times the price for heaven's sake.

I use a specialist service place that does Merc BMW and VW. But they always uses 'genuine' merc parts. Think I will be looking for one that uses GSF parts from now on - if I can find one that has the mechanics I can trust.

Still sobbing over mark-up on exhaust cat. have also looked at other prices in catalog....emotional distress ensued... they don't do 'all' parts so a mix'n'match approach will be needed I suppose.


Whole new aspect on ownership costs opening up.

Thanks amigo.
 

sean5302

Banned
The reality is that "genuine" parts have different connotations.

A genuine Mercedes part?
Body pressings are stamped by Daimler-Chrysler, so most people accept the description "genuine Mercedes part".
A tyre? D-C don't make tyres.
Alternator? D-C don't make alternators.
Exhaust system? D-C don't make exhaust systems.

Cylinder block? This will surprise you. D-C no longer make cylinder blocks. They buy in blocks from specialist foundries.

So, just what is a "genuine Mercedes part"?

And, next time you see a BMW customer service VW Transporter hurrying along carrying overnight parts, the chances are it calls at the likes of GSF or Euro on its way to the main dealer.
Main dealers and GSF etc loan each other parts. People are surprised at this, but it's a very effective use of warehouse storage space.

Finally, Mercs and similar classy cars are usually owned by companies. Flat battery? Change the alternator. Cost? Who cares?

A private buyer is much more likely to shop around.
 

Steve.J.Davies

Novice Member
Yep, its a complex picture for us non-car-industry types.

thats the advantage you have e.g. Knowing that the 50 quid bosch is exactly equivalent to the 370 quid one.

how does the man in street know that ? ther is no access to the relevant detail information publically available AFAIK. or is there...
 

sean5302

Banned
Let me put it this way:
If you're in the trade you would not go to a main dealer for anything that you could buy from a parts specialist. I'm not speaking about dodgy, pattern, bling or suchlike. I mean the pukka, OEM type parts and equipment.
If the part is made by a reputable, branded maker there is no real difference wherever you buy it.

Take VW. The Golf / Gol is made around the world. Multiple sources of parts suppliers make items to a specification. Then someone (Ferdinand Piech) asks "Why are we buying 58 different cigar lighters? If we only sourced 9 we could generate volume discounts."
A smoker in a Bentley then uses an Audi cigar lighter.
Then people say "the cigar lighter in the Audi needs absolute quality, as it may be used in the Bentley", so it is upped in spec and the price reduces as we buy 5 million of them.
The manufacturer of the lighter (not us) will think that he may be asked to produce 10 million at some point, so installs machinery for it. He then wants to keep his machinery running, so will discount prices and GSF will buy the surplus.

Long-winded reply, sorry, but I think it may shed some light.
 
R

rhoamish

Guest
Steve.J.Davies said:
Yep, its a complex picture for us non-car-industry types.

thats the advantage you have e.g. Knowing that the 50 quid bosch is exactly equivalent to the 370 quid one.

how does the man in street know that ? ther is no access to the relevant detail information publically available AFAIK. or is there...
If it was available, it would do your brain in. You've no idea how often some of the parts subtly change. But it's always been like that: it used to be used by companies to make it harder to supply pattern parts!

Manufacturers will soon have to provide service information by law, in certain markets. That might help a little, but you're basically better off finding a good local motor factors.
 

Steve.J.Davies

Novice Member
So as long as I give the chassis number places like GSF will know if they have the suitable part/model/version/modification/thingy ?

That would be a peace of mind thing..
 

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