Remote Gaming PC - HDMI/USB over CAT6 to AVR

ARNiTECT

Active Member
I am currently remote gaming in our living room using an nVidia Shield with GameStream, which is great, but I would like to improve the gaming image quality, by connecting to my PC over extended HDMI instead.

My PC is in a room upstairs, with 2 no. CAT6 points to a patch panel in a central cupboard.
The AVR is in the living room, which also has 2 no. CAT6 points to the central cupboard.

I'm looking for near zero latency, no noticeable artifacting, HDCP and surround sound etc and I only want to spend what is necessary. I understand HDbaseT is probably what I need, but I was hoping for specific product recommendations. I don't need a switch/matrix.

Our TV is an OLED [email protected]; however, my next TV (in more than a year) will likely be HDMI2.1 [email protected] I suspect I am best to just deal with what I have now and replace the remote setup in the future when we get a new TV.

My GPU is a 2070super, but will upgrade to a 3080-20GB, as soon as I can get hold of one.

If the remote connection devices need a dedicated cable, it would look like this:
PC>--HDMI-->Device>--CAT6-->Socket>--CAT6-->PatchPanel>--CAT6-->Patchpanel>--CAT6-->Socket>--CAT6-->Device>--HDMI-->AVR
Total Distance from PC to AVR, should be around 15-30m.

If there is a suitable device that works by IP, (more flexible for me, but not necessary) then it would follow the same path, but be limited to 1000BaseT, as I have used up my 10GBaseT switch sockets (until I upgrade).

My wireless controllers just about work from the PC upstairs, to the Living room, but I would like to send USB down to the Living room for a stronger signal, as long as it doesn't add noticeable lag. Should I look for a product with both HDMI and USB built in, or would I be better suited with separate products?

Thank you for any suggestions!
 
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mushii

Distinguished Member
Hi. I think that you are pretty confused here. The only things that need to be on the same network and have wired connections are your Shield and the PC that is running Gamestream from. That is it.
Just connect your PC to your wired network and connect your Shield to the same wired network.
I have a Shield in my upstairs cinema room and my gaming PC in my office on the middle floor. They are both connected to a Gigabit switch and I can game with almost zero latency, nothing else is required. The Shield is connected via HDMI to my AVR which connects to the TV.
You need to pair the wireless controller with the shield for it to work properly.
 

ARNiTECT

Active Member
Hi, I have no problem using my nvidia shield with gamestreaming, I just want to game directly from the PC's HDMI instead, for better quality visuals. (just edited first line to try and make it clearer)
 

mushii

Distinguished Member
Sorry mis-understood your need. Using HDBaseT extenders there will most likely be latency, upto 500ms which is not going to fare well for any sort of twitch gaming. There is a degree of processing that has to take place at either end, which causes the latency.
 

Joe Fernand

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
As mushii says any form of ‘over CAT’ extender will introduce some delay so you would need to purchase and test before you could say which, if any, solution would work for you.

UHD over LAN and HDBT solutions do exist which support HDMI and USB over a single cable.

HDBT is designed for a point to point connection so running the signal via a Patchbay, wall plate etc is best avoided.

Joe
 

ARNiTECT

Active Member
hmmm, I was hoping someone had a storey of success with these.
If I'm going to try a product, is there much difference between them, as they vary in price quite a bit?
I found AVaccess & Cyp, some as KVM with USB
I'll need surround audio, such as 7.1 or atmos etc, I suspect only HDCP1.4 as the TV is 1080P, no HDR.
 

mushii

Distinguished Member
@Joe Fernand has deployed a lot more HDBaseT than me, but I have installed enough in domestic 'smart homes' to know that the solution is pretty much unplayable, there is way too much lag for online multiplayer gaming. You are also likley to encounter EDID issues as GPUs in general do not play nice with HDBaseT for anything other than straight forward AV resolutions and refresh rates. Also given that these are patch-plate connections and not a single end to end cable you are diminishing the likely success of this solution. HDBaseT hates multiple connections.
 

ARNiTECT

Active Member
thanks both of you,
I’ll think of an alternative arrangement then.
I could just carry down the PC on occasion, it is small.
There’s an hdmi cable in the floor below my PC that goes to my AVR, intended for a future projector in the living room ceiling below. I can see it through the floor boards, but annoyingly I can’t find the coil end, even using borescope.
Just downloaded Virtualhere to improve the USB connection, particularly with my steam controllers.
 

Joe Fernand

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
I think in this case trying to 'place shift' the PC using extenders is, as mushii says, unlikely to meet your requirements and either a second PC or physically move the PC is going to be the realistic option.

As video signals increase in complexity and bandwidth extending them becomes more complex and adding game play into the equation is a step too far - unless you are me and any video lag is the least of my worries when playing a game.

Joe
 

polkadot

Standard Member
For me HDBaseT was an upgrade over streaming using my NVIDIA Shield.

I was planning on getting a Ruipro 8k gen 3b/c fibre optic cable. But I only have a NVIDIA GTX 970 GPU so I can't send 4k120 HDR and 1080p60/120 HDR is adequate. Even if I upgrade GPU I can still send 4k60 HDR with G-sync with this kit.

This was the cheaper option since I found an unused AV Access 4KEX70-ARC-H2 HDBaseT extender for £40 on eBay (it's £180 on Amazon). The USB extender for the controller was £6.50 on amazon and so was the Bluetooth dongle. I spent £16 on each 25m Cat 6a pure copper cable (3 in total), but was always planning on running ethernet and USB over ethernet so it basically came down to £55 for 25m HDBaseT or £240 for a 25m HDMI 2.1 cable for video.

In my experience the video signal is better quality than streaming and lower latency.

I have more control of the image framerate and colour space which, unlike resolution, can't always be set in game e.g.

  • 1080p 120Hz RGB 8 bit colour (SDR)
  • 1080p 120Hz YCbCr 4:4:4 8 bit colour (SDR)
  • 1080p 120Hz YCbCr 4:2:2 12 bit colour (HDR)
  • 1080p 60hz RGB 12 bit colour (HDR)
  • 1080p 60hz YCbCr 4:4:4 12 bit colour (HDR)*my default
  • 4K 60Hz YCbCr 4:2:2 10 bit colour (HDR)
  • 4K 60Hz YCbCr 4:4:4 8 bit colour (SDR)
  • 4K 60Hz RGB 8 bit colour (SDR)

4k pushes it above 10Gbps data rates so display screen compression is being used but it is imperceptible in motion. It is certainly better than H.264 encoded streaming video which can introduce macroblocking in detailed areas and/or dark images. I've read that HEVC encoded video is better quality (my CPU/GPU don't support it) but I believe it adds latency as it is slower to compress/decompress on most clients (e.g. NVIDIA Shield).

I can't measure it but I wouldn't be surprised to find that HDBaseT latency is in the order of 18μs.

It is low enough for me not to notice it playing Doom Eternal in HDR.

In conclusion, HDMI over ethernet was an upgrade to in-home streaming for me. It may not be for you.

Caveats:
  1. I had a shield TV tube which doesn't have a USB port - no virtualhere USB
  2. I had intermittent poor Bluetooth signal on the Shield with my controllers (Xbox One and DS4) not always being recognised, disconnecting and lagging. Possibly caused by interference from next door or my wireless sub; I changed all my HDMI cables trying to solve it.
  3. I was sick of trying to integrate all my digital games onto steam big picture or moonlight; too many workaround (GLOSC, powershell scripts) to get display and controller hooked simultaneously, especially with Epic games store or UWP Xbox gamepass games. I now have all my libraries integrated into Playnite and can see all the games I own on one controller friendly interface. I can post details of the setup if there is interest; it does require some utilities/extensions/scripts to automate and control the multi monitor setup using just a controller in front of the TV e.g. automatically launching Playnite fullscreen from the controller, switching primary/secondary display automatically, turning on/off HDR automatically, switching audio output when playing games etc.
 

ARNiTECT

Active Member
Thanks for sharing your successful HDMI over ethernet setup!
I'll keep a lookout for bargain AV Access HDBaseT devices on ebay to try.
I use the nvidia shield/geforce experience app to access the games and it is not reliable; I will investigate Playnite.
 

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