1. Join Now

    AVForums.com uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

REL: time for a critique…….

Discussion in 'Home Cinema Speakers' started by andyp, Feb 4, 2001.

  1. andyp

    andyp
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2001
    Messages:
    295
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +7
    My newly assembled HC system consists of Sony 29" 4:3 TV, 725 DVD player, Sony 940 A/V amp and all B&W 600 series speakers. I am now (obviously) starting to think about a sub-woofer.

    OK, I’ve never been into home hi-fi or cinema before the above system was recently put together. I have always listened to music on either a midi system or ghetto blaster! This was because my main passion is cars, and therefore my ‘hi-fi’ interest and experience has always been with in-car equipment. A very huge and competitive market, especially in the USA.

    My HC system was mainly influenced by magazine reviews, this site (!) and advice from retailers, oh - and listening myself! Therefore my choice of sub-woofer will not surprise most people here when I say it starts with an ‘R’.... yes REL seems to be THE sub to have. My budget will just about stretch to a Q100, but no way will it stretch any further.

    Now, my experience from car hi-fi tells me that most quality equipment looks the part too. So why does the main driver unit in the Q100 look like it cost about 50p from Maplin’s? Also, I read it has a steel chassis, what??!! All the quality car hi-fi subs have aluminium chassis’. And why do I not read anywhere any mention of the built in amplifier? Is this also made by REL, or do they buy them from the ‘no brand’ bin at Maplin’s too??

    Sorry this all sounds a bit cynical, but what EXACTLY does my £500 buy me?? MDF isn’t that expensive is it? ;-)

    Andy P.



    [This message has been edited by andyp (edited 04-02-2001).]
     
  2. Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    If you're not convinced by the Q100, you might want to consider the new Yamaha YST-SW320. I auditioned it alongside the Q100, and opted for the Yammy. For appearance and build quality it gets top marks, and the performance on movies is outstanding. Both depth and slam are excellent, and in a 11'x17' lounge it's virtually idling in terms of power use. For the record, it's partnered by a similar setup to yours, namely:

    Sony STRDB935 amp
    Sony 725 DVD
    Mission 761i fronts, 77DS rears, 77c1 centre
     
  3. dUnKle

    dUnKle
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2001
    Messages:
    13,618
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Ratings:
    +1,455
    perhaps you could try listening to it b4 dishing out critiscms

    I have had my 100 since just after its release and it sounds as good today as it did back then. I looked at purchasing soemthing better but after lots of demos I have yet to find anything that beats the 100 by a good margin for less than £700
     
  4. andyp

    andyp
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2001
    Messages:
    295
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +7
    Wow there! I have, and thought it sounded great, though I have yet to compare it to anything else. As I said, I was just curious about the details. So why is it so good then?

    Andy P.
     
  5. Ramius

    Ramius
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2000
    Messages:
    1,062
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    Ratings:
    +306
    andyp

    Go the DIY route! For price/performance it can't be beat. Sounds like you've possibly had some experience of enclosure building in your car audio days.

    There's loads of info around.
    Check out my 'DIY pics' thread below for starters.


    You ask "what EXACTLY does my £500 buy me??" in the Q100.

    As you know REL make quality products.
    Take the top of the range 'Studio II' how much? £4000?
    Two Volt 10" drivers. According to http://www.voltloudspeakers.co.uk/ their B250.8 is very similar and will give nearly the same performance as the custom made driver REL use from Volt (so Volt say).
    You can buy the B250.8 from http://www.wilmslow-audio.co.uk/ for £144.
    So, for two say £300.
    http://www.bkelec.com/ provide REL with amplification. Their MF range of mono amplifiers are "very similar" according to BKs sales/technical people. The MF300 is £84.

    REL also use their "ABC" variable bass filter however they advise you to turn it off when the sub is being used in the cinema role and let your amp deal with the crossover settings so you don't need that.
    And as you say, the MDF, 25mm, £30 for a 8'x4' sheet and another £80 for the veneer.
    Thats £500 of bits in a £4000 sub and I bet REL don't pay these prices.

    I'm not knocking REL, we all know they're the UK market leader and make excellent subs.
    I'm just pointing out the performance to be had in DIY.

    There's no 'magic' involved in subwoofer building.

    Cheers

    [This message has been edited by Ramius (edited 05-02-2001).]

    [This message has been edited by Ramius (edited 05-02-2001).]
     
  6. HT Dude

    HT Dude
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Ramius, I have a Studio II. There are some points you missed in building your own (which is a route I am not adverse to - but just want to set you straight on a few points).
    First, the Studio II has a complex internal design. It's not just a box. It uses what REL call ARM loading. Check out this diag : (not of the Studio, but the principle is the same).
    [​IMG]
    Second, the unit comes with a very nice veneer finish, brass feet and a thick piece of stablising glass on top.
    There is circuitry in there to prevent overload (though admittedly mine has NEVER been turned up beyond 1 on the gain).
    You make no mention of the PSU. Apparently REL use components certified for use in Satellites. I.e. they don't fail.
    And lastly there is manufacturing experience gone into the overall design which takes years of experience.
    I don't doubt you can DIY a good sub. But I think it would be difficult to come that close to a unit built by professionals.


    [This message has been edited by HC Dude (edited 05-02-2001).]
     
  7. andyp

    andyp
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2001
    Messages:
    295
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +7
    Many thanks for the replies, this is exactly what I wanted to hear. I have built sub-woofer enclosures in the past for in-car use, and have followed with interest the threads on this site regarding the DIY
    enclosures.

    I have yet to make my mind up about whether to go the REL route, but they are my favourite choice. All those reviews can't be wrong, and if I built my own or purchased a different brand I just think I would forever be thinking, " I wonder how good the REL is.....".

    I know I know, I must make my own mind up based on listening and expert advice. Just wanted to sound out some opinions on how good they actually are.

    Thanks again.

    Andy P.


     
  8. GaryG

    GaryG
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    "if I built my own or purchased a different brand I just think I would forever be thinking, " I wonder how good the REL is.....".

    I have a REL Stata and the sub I just built (I think using the word 'built' is stretching it a bit! see my DIY Garage Conversion Sub thread) goes lower and sounds better than the REL Strata. However, to be fair the quality of the driver I bought is better than the driver used in the REL Strata (no offence to Richard Lord and his Strata design, it's great at the price point he's designed it for).

    Regards
    Gary
     
  9. Ramius

    Ramius
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2000
    Messages:
    1,062
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    Ratings:
    +306
    Hi HC Dude, thought you'd drop by. [​IMG]

    ...."I don't doubt you can DIY a good sub. But I think it would be difficult to come that close to a unit built by professionals...."

    Sorry I disagree. If you still believe that you haven't investigated.
    With DIY you have the advantage over the manufacturer. All your money goes directly into the components- better drivers etc. You have no restrictions on the enclosure size required for maximum performance. Can you imagine a manufacturer trying to sell a 10 cubic foot enclosure? That's why they need EQ and other things to get more bottom end.
    With the advent of DD and DTS you don't have to worry about the crossover. Let the amp deal with it.
    A high pass filter (or rumble filter) will protect the sub.
    You can finish it all sorts of beautiful veneers.
    There's many examples of DIY subs on the net that look better (and perform better) than any manufactured sub.
    There are many extremely intelligent and talented people out there at other forums who have been designing speakers and subwoofers a lot longer than REL. They are always willing to help you or design it for you to meet your requirements.

    I not knocking REL or any other manufacturer but they can't compete with the price/performance of DIY.

    Cheers.

    [This message has been edited by Ramius (edited 07-02-2001).]
     

Share This Page

Loading...