REL T5 is extremely quiet, what's going wrong?

Daniel989

Novice Member
In advance of shelling out on a sub, my friend has lend me his REL T5, rated as 120W.
It's very quiet. Using the LFE input, I've had to turn its volume up to the very maximum in order to get a result. Anything less than that, I can't tell it's there. The crossover is at max, and the amp's LFE crossover set to 120Hz. The sub is next to the front mains.
With the receiver set a a volume comfortable for listening (60/100), the sub is barely noticeable. If I turn the amp up a little (65 or 70 of 100), just above comfortable main listening, the sub suddenly becomes noticeable and actually too loud.
There's no happy medium.

This is listening to a true 5.1 source such as a Blue Ray.
The amp (Marantz NR1504, which is 5x50W) is set to a flat output (all speakers on zero dB), but this is room to lift the sub's feed. I can do that, but wanted to understand why on earth I would need to.

I am surprised to have to crank it to its maximum volume at all, but especially so considering it's supposed to but much more powerful than my mains.


Does this sound right to you? Does anything leap out as what I might be doing wrong?


Many thanks
 

sm1ggsy

Active Member
Hi, is this after running room correction .?
 

Daniel989

Novice Member
Hello

Thanks for input. I have executed the Audessey analysis but not since adding the sub; that's something to do again for sure.

However, I do see this problem even when using 'pure direct' which (I understand) would not apply any processing whatsoever.

I will analyse again and see if the problem exists when selecting an Audessey mode.

Cheers
 

sm1ggsy

Active Member
I’m sure pure direct will bypass bass management,
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
Hello

Thanks for input. I have executed the Audessey analysis but not since adding the sub; that's something to do again for sure.

However, I do see this problem even when using 'pure direct' which (I understand) would not apply any processing whatsoever.

I will analyse again and see if the problem exists when selecting an Audessey mode.

Cheers

Run Audussey with the LFE volume gain knob at 12clock (50%). Phase switch at 0. This is first step naturally and then check speaker sizes are all set Small and bump up the speaker crossovers if anything is set below 80hz after Audussey run! Another good thing to check is the "subwoofer level" from Marantz menu, it should stay below -12db. Usually between -8db and -4db is ideal.

Spend 9min watching the video below so you have some basic understanding what to do / what not to do with Audussey setup and the mic placement. Naturally run it when you are alone when the room is 100% silent. If you have tripod / boom arm mic stand or anything similar to put the mic in seated ear height then use that!

 

Derek S-H

Distinguished Member
@Gasp3621 - I watched the video you linked above and found it very useful, especially the point about having at least 30 cm of distance between the mic and the chair back in the MLP.

But I wanted to ask: he shows the eight mic positions for Audyssey calibration as three on the sofa, three 1 metre in front of the sofa, and the final two 1 metre in front of the sofa again, but located between positions 4, 5 and 6.

My Audyssey program (XT32), also has eight mic positions: three on the sofa, three in front of the sofa and the final two behind the sofa.

What's the difference, if any? Should I follow the positioning in the video or my Audyssey program?

Thanks!
 

Gasp3621

Distinguished Member
I`m not sure what is the most optimal as people have been playing lot with those and get different results. There has been some arguing in US forum. I believe @mb3195 has played quite a lot with those mic placements when he had Audussey, maybe he could give he`s thoughts. There is quite many more modern videos for Audussey at youtube, perhaps also for the mic spacing and where they should be. Important that they are at same height in each spot and away from walls at least 0,5meters as that can affect negatively what has been said.
 

Conrad

Moderator
Not Mark, but my take is that, with more measurements you're giving the software a wider range of data to work with. It should help to exclude or even out measurement error or anomalies that are specific to one measurement location. If you have a peak or a null just at one place and that's your only measurement, the software will overcompensate which could negatively affect locations where that anomaly isn't present.

Killing the 40Hz peak that one location will kill 40Hz in other places that don't have a peak, for example. If you measure those other places and let the software use all the measurements in it's calculation then it should be able to make better choices.

Eight locations around the listening area make sense, and I doubt which eight you use will make much of a difference. You probably don't stay in exactly one spot when you watch a movie, and you might have a partner or family spread out across multiple seats. Most software (Audyssey, Dirac) will try and get the best for each seat without causing issues in other seats.

Not measuring near a wall is because bass is reinforced as you approach boundaries. If you measure near a wall or corner you'll likely end up cutting too much bass out which will make the rest of the room sound thin and bass-light. Want to test this? Put on some bass heavy music that sounds ok at the MLP and then go and stand in a corner.

Lastly, measuring near a wall can cause phase issues that mean that the predicted response isn't the actual response when EQ is applied. I've had this when measuring multiple subs. The combined measurement of sub 1 and sub 2 weren't what they should have been, moving the mic away from the wall corrected this.
 

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