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Rel Studio

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by Moviebuff, Aug 10, 2004.

  1. Moviebuff

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    Hi Guys/Gals - My first post,so please be gentle. :)

    I have just,in time honoured fashion,made a impulse bid on eBay,for a Rel Studio II,and won @ £1499.00.
    Although I have owned a Rel Stadium 1,since 1994,I have never demo'ed or even seen the Studio range "in the flesh",and obviously £1500.00 is alot of money to spend on something that has been bought blind (or deaf!).
    IYHO,did I give a fair price,and could I have done alot better elsewhere for the money? - although I was aware of the Studio,I haven't really studied their user rating or for that matter,2nd hand value.I realise that they were very expensive when new.
    I have always been impressed by my Stadium,but realise this is a ageing sub,and that things move on.So,although its a paid for/done deal,I was just curious to know of informed opinions,as I can't foresee me taking delivery for at least a week,maybe longer.My listening preferences are both film and music,through the same system - Pioneer 868 DVD,i-Linked to a AX5is,with Mission 735 floorstanders.

    Thanks in advance

    Jez
     
  2. Cmoth

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    I had the pleasure of hearing one in a home demo about 3 years ago and was blown away with the sound. I hope your room is big enough as its a beast alright. The newer version now costs around £4500 although i seem to recall that the original one was between 2500 and £3000. I would make sure its in full working order as there are two seperate downfiring drivers and the one i heard was only operating with one working properly! - I will be amazed if you find you dont like it, as the presence it offers is sublime and the quality of the bass is like nothing else. Make sure you spend about a month tweaking it so you get the best out of it. If your taste is music theres not much to tough it. It depends how you like your films bass as to what you will think from an AV point of view. A big M & K always offers more brute force and devistating bass. Good luck.
     
  3. Ian J

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    I think the REL Studio is what Spectre uses
     
  4. dealmaker

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    I have a Studio 2 and think it is an awesome piece of kit.

    It is extremley tight and controlled (I hate loose, woofly bass) and to be honest it shifts a hell of a lot of air - (2X10 Better than 1X18) - so be warned!

    Mine will pressurise the home cinema room to the point where I now have some real structural damage which needs to be repaired :eek:

    This made me realise that my plan to add a second Studio 2 was just plain stupid.

    However if you get it, and arent happy with it, I may be tempted to take it off your hands :smashin:

    what finish is it by the way??
     
  5. Cmoth

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    As it is a studio2 I could also be interested in you decide to move it on for whatever reason.

    Dealmaker - what size room do you use it in ?
     
  6. ShinObiWAN

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    Being a little pandantic here but:

    2 x 10" doesn't shift more air than 1 x 18"

    You must remember that as diameter increases, the surface area exponentially increase at a rate of pi with regards to radius squared.

    So in actually fact the 2 x 10" have around the same surface area as a single 15" sub.

    Further complications then arise when you take into account the XMAX or excursion of a driver since this dictates the total volume of air the surface area of the driver can shift - longer throw means more air shifted.
     
  7. dealmaker

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    My room is about 17 feet long by 13 feet wide by 8 feet high.

    If you sit in the room with the door closed you dont realise the extent to which the room is being pressurised. However one afternoon the wife and kids decided to watch Nemo - I was'nt bothered to watch that particular film so did some work in my study. It was the first time the kit had been fired up in anger without me being in the room with it.

    After a few of the louder scenes I was totally shocked by the pounding the house was taking - you could feel and hear the bass shaking the very foundations - it was a real wake up call for me - the double glazed units and french doors were bowing out under the pressure! It explains why most of the plasterboard around the sub in that room is working loose from the stud walls- the pressure waves art causing oscillations in the plasterboard sheets and in turn they push the plasterboard nails out of the timber! I now need to get some sections replaced and they will use dri-wall screws (extra-long) when they re-fit.
     
  8. Cmoth

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    Not particularly big room then! - What do you have the crossover and volume set at then ? - Did you set it up as per the REL recommendations which we dont need to go into now, or just be ear ? - Your neighbours must love you then or do you have detached house / Farm!! - Good to hear from someone who has the Studio as when i upgrade from my KEF AV1 I will probably go for that.
     
  9. dealmaker

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    Sorry - I'm just quoting something I'd heard from REL - their view was that two smaller long excursion (XMAX) drivers would shift more air than one larger diameter driver. The view is also that in accelerative terms the reduced inertial mass of the 10" drivers allows these to react more quickly than the larger single driver - maybe that explains why the REL Studio always sounds "Fast" to me in comparison to the 18" behemoths I have heard.

    But..I don't really know my onions...just know what I like and i like it FAST :clap:
     
  10. dealmaker

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    One of my techie guys set it up with a fancy hoodamamthingy (lap top and microphone thing) - and then I tweaked it a little by ear after that - don't know what the exact settings are off hand.

    I'm lucky in that I have several acres of land around the house so that the neighbours are'nt (too) troubled by it.

    (Except when I have barbecues when I put my music through the whole house through my media system - including the REL - and the 6 other sub's in the house - and throw open all the french windows/balconies - THEN it get's interesting - bit like being at Glastonbury :rotfl: )
     
  11. Cmoth

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    What Speakers and amp do you use then?
     
  12. ShinObiWAN

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    To be honest, we had some spirited arguments over on diyforum a few months ago regarding mass, force factor (BL) and musicality. Most of the acknowledged 'experts' argued for the fact that added mass was negligible in the effects of slow bass. Rather more that room placement and driver loading within the cabinet was far far more important and that at such low frequencies any driver can move fast enough to remain poised providing the mass was within the realms of sensibility, rather than it being the case if an 18" was used for midrange.

    Its kinda like the argument for against the magnetostat ribbons and domes, some say that the ribbons are quicker because of the virtually non existant mass whilst others fervantly argue against any such difference.
     
  13. dealmaker

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    I have a 7.1 setup comprising an Arcam AV8/ P7 combo and the speakers are an American type not common here in the UK.

    They are Acoustic Research Phantoms - a flat(ish) speaker designed for wall mounting:

    Front Left, Right and Centre are Phantom 8.3's (3 way - 8" driver)

    Surround L, R and Back L, R are all Phantom 6.2's (2 way - 6" driver)

    A lot of technology went into these speakers - I like them - but have to concede they will never be as good as some larger floor-standing models (which is a moot point as this room aslo doubles up as the kids' play room)
     
  14. Cmoth

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    I would imagine that the filter must be set up pretty high, if not on maximum which i believe is 90hz on the studio which would explain why you are having structural problems as the sub is handling everything below 90hz and i would guess you have the wick up a bit! - I cant believe you were contemplating 2 studios in such a smallish room, as this would just be overkill!

    Cheers for the info,will leave you in peace now!!
     
  15. Moviebuff

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    Cheers for your replies - I wrote this in the morning,just after finishing a nightshift,came downstairs to check my mail & look on here & WOW - 13 replies.

    This must be one of the most active forums I've subscribed to,and I belong to a few!!!!

    The Studio II is finished in the standard Henry Ford black ash.I've yet to work out how to get it from Newcastle down to here in Southampton,and thats a bit of a stumbling block at the moment.So near to ownage of a Studio II,but yet so far!! :rolleyes:

    I'll keep you posted on how I get on,as it sure is exciting times.I live in a detached house,but within close proximity to my neighbours.I can usually get away with cranking my current set up to a satisfying level of volume,as all the walls within the house are brick(the house is circa 1929 - when houses were houses!).

    Sounds like the Studio II may well be the straw that broke the camels back with regards to neighbourly relations!
     
  16. Moviebuff

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    If I could trouble to ask another question -

    Is there a great deal of difference between the -

    Studio

    Studio II - the one I have just won on eBay.

    and the Studio III?

    Also,was £1500 about the right price 2nd hand,or is there no real rule of thumb.I always like to know whether I've got a bargain,and equally,for future reference,whether I've paid to much.

    I purchased it from a Hifi shop - Lintone
     
  17. dealmaker

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    Moviebuff,

    I can't remember the exact specifications but I do recall that the jump from a Studio 1 to a Studio 2 was a much bigger jump than that from a 2 to 3. I think the 2 to 3 jump was more "fine tuning" so a 2 remains an attractive proposition.

    As for price - well I think that whilst you have not got a "bargain" it is still value for money at that price. Most used Studio 2's tend to be advertised at around the £1999 mark (retail) so your price represents a good discount for cash!

    If you are going to collect the unit bear in mind that it will take three people to lift it - it one big mutha!
     
  18. Cmoth

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    I would endorse everything you have said too. There was certainly a massive step from the Studio One to Two, all to do with very much improved internals rather than increase in amp sizes or the actual drive units. I would say £1500 is a fair price and I would be prepared to pay that for one if I saw one advertised that was in sound ( no pun meant ) working order. Think I would prefer a different finish to the rather plain Black though. let us know how you do finally transport it back!
     
  19. Moviebuff

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    Cheers again for all those that showed a interest and replied.

    I am having it transported,down from Gateshead to Southampton for 70 quid - a bargain! & should be here Friday :) .I was asked that someone would be available when it was delivered,to give the driver a lift.I guess the delivery driver they are sending must be a bit of a wimp. :D

    I will let you know how I get on with it,once it's in place and I have had time to get a fair sound out of it.

    Rgds

    Jerry
     
  20. Moviebuff

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    Just one other thing,do you think my Stadium Mk1 will supplement the Studio II,or would I be better off selling it on.I know that it is more likely the proof will be in the eating,but any initial thoughts might be useful.

    I can see my wife & kids going through hell as I start changing the living room around to find the best set up/sound.

    Suitcases & leaving spring to mind!
     
  21. Moviebuff

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    Just another snippit,when I contacted the seller today,I turned nosey and asked him how much it cost him - 4 GRAND :eek:

    It's being packed in a Studio III box ......
     
  22. Cmoth

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    Trust me, once you have the studio set up Correctly there will be absolutely no need for the Stadium as the Studio is in a different league as you are shortly to find out ! - If you dont have a 2nd system, then you better off selling it on. Dont think they will be much demand though as its been updated a fair few times now.
     
  23. Cmoth

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    What was the sellers reason for selling incidently ?
     
  24. Moviebuff

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    He upgraded to a Studio III ??????
     
  25. Cmoth

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    lucky bast*rd! - Nice to have that sort of money to invest in,arguably the best sub you can buy !
     
  26. Moviebuff

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    If the Stadium isn't worth that much,I will probably stick it on the rear speaker channel,and move it to the back of the room - i guess I better give it a go. ;)
     
  27. dealmaker

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    The guy certainly has got more money than sense if he is upgrading from a 2 to a 3 - the differences will be miniscule.

    There arent that many Studio's around - few people can accomodate them so in retrospect i fell you've done a good deal.

    Stadium's are good little subs in their own right - people get too hung up about the vintage/version - again the evolution from 1 to 3 was gradual and there is little to choose (I've got 4 Stadium's - 3 X Stadium 3's - two on my two channel system in the lounge and one on my plasma in the family room, and a Stadium 1 which is on the office system - there is very little to choose between them)

    If you do decide to keep the Stadium in the loop, make sure you get the phases matched - you don't want the Stadium cancelling out 50% of the Studio!
     
  28. Moviebuff

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    The Studio was delivered yesterday @ 9.30 in the morning.The crate it came in was huge,and my wife's face was a picture of horror! :eek:

    I've owned garden sheds that were smaller than this !!!!!!

    Anway,delivery dude helped me in with the box,and 1/2 hour later and a fiver lighter,the driver leaves,and I set about connecting up.I connected as per my Stadium,with the high level signal leads,and played some base heavy material to allow me to get the phase of the Stadium and Studio in keeping with my main fronts and one another.The Stadium stayed to the right front of my room,and the Studio to the front left

    After resetting both subs to come in where my left/rights dropped off (around 35hz),I set the levels to a quarter on the gain for both subs,and slowly turned the volume up.

    To say I was overwhelmed would be a understatement.Whether I was just plain lucky in getting a setting that sounded great from the off (with minor tweaking of levels),but I can safely say that I have never ever heard such deep bottomless controled bass in my entire life.I mentioned previous,I have owned my Stadium since 1994,and so therefore have had a sub in my system for longer than most.But nothing prepared me for the sheer controlled brute force of the Studio_On careful listening,it has made the whole soundstage spring to life,right through the frequency range.Having finished a nightshift that morning,I didn't get to bed til 3.00pm that afternoon,as I was totally captivated by how my system was transformed.Initially,I spent most of my time listening to music,but then went through my film collection,listening to my fave key movie sound moments.Gobsmacked & blownaway simply don't describe how I felt.With more experimentation in postition and settings,I will try and see if I can wring some sonic improvement,but if I don't,I'll still die happy.

    Sorry guys,but I definatley won't be selling it on.Even if it does now look like I've just moved a "tank stop"into my front room :D
     
  29. Moviebuff

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    I will say one thing - the size of it still takes some getting used to!
     
  30. Nimby

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