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Region 1 Review: Friday The 13th: From Crystal Lake To Manhattan

Discussion in 'Movie Forum' started by Sigismund, Oct 30, 2004.

  1. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    [​IMG]

    I finally get through eight Friday The 13th movies in the recently released Friday The 13th: From Crystal Lake To Manhattan: Ultimate Edition DVD Collection. It took me a long time...

    Read my review here

    Review disc supplied by and shipping from [​IMG]
     
  2. Marc

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    wow he really gave that a kicking.. should have really let a friday 13th fan review that boxset, no one else is gonna want it anyway! Actually, i expect any friday 13th fan worth their salt already has all 10 movies AND freddy vs jason, so i'm not sure who this set would appeal to..
     
  3. FoxyMulder

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    Who no mention of the cuts, true fans ( myself included ) won't buy this because Paramount did it on the cheap and hasn't released uncut versions, even the first movie in the set is censored and available in a longer cut in the UK by Warner Bros, i think all of this should be mentioned and as a fan i won't buy this set it's been done on the cheap.
     
  4. docsmith2k1

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    I'm tired of hearing this nonsense that films should only be reviewed by "fans" of the movie. Why? Just so it gets a favourable review and you can feel justifed by the fact that you have excellent taste in movies? As you already point out "fans" of the movie will buy it whatever the reviewers thoughts. If films were given to lovers of that movie or genre to review all the time the reviews would be meaningless. Learn to live with the fact that just because someone doesn't like the same things as you, does not make you a bad person. Deal with your insucurities.
     
  5. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    Well I guess this depends on one's definition of the word "censored". Just because it's available in a different version doesn't mean this version is "censored"!

    And I think your notion that "true fans won't buy this" is way off base. I believe many true fans have indeed bought this set. You, and I, may not buy this "Ultimate Edition" - probably for different reasons - but I can understand why fans of the movies do indeed lay out their hard-earned... there's a fair amount of extras, and anyone interested in the original movie in as much an unadulterated form as is likely to be seen shouldn't be disappointed with what's on offer here.
     
  6. Phil Hinton

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    As the person responsible for ordering the review discs and deciding who reviews what, I think the balance in what people review is about right. Reviews are only one persons opinion on a film but a very valid opinion for the average joe on the street or message boards. It would be a dull world if we all liked the same thing, or if we gave "fans" of films the discs for review. We try to be unbiased where possible and give a genuine opinion on a disc. I will never subscribe to the arguement that "fans" should review their favourite films, but agree that valuable information concerning cuts etc should be included, and as much as possible this is done.
     
  7. Marc

    Marc
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    well you're missing the point. the reviewer gave the movies a 5 rating, which is fair enough, they aren't great movies, but they weren't made for him to watch. Part 1 and 2 sure, and how he managed to say the original Friday 13th isn't very good is a mystery to me, it's a classic. 3 and 4 perhaps were also made for mainstream, but beginning to lean towards cult, but every one after that were made for Jason fans, end of story. So while they may be poor by a general standard, Lord of the Rings they aint; as Friday 13th films there's nothing wrong with them. Part 6 is my favourite personally as it's the first incarnation of zombie Jason, and part 7 is widely regarded as the best Jason movie, as well as being the debut of cult hero Kane Hodder; so from the review you can plainly see the reviewer just didn't "get" it. Part 8 is awful though, even a Jason fan will admit that. The late 80's take the blame for that one, censorship at an all time high, not to mention the perms.. Another reason this boxset is pointless is that they miss out part 9 and 10. Sure this is because those parts are owned by different distributors, but it still another crappy UK box set. Yes i'm not saying this boxset is good, just saying the movie part of the review was harsh and unfair.

    And as for the comment on censorship, what on earth? The original uk release of friday 13th was cut up by the BBFC and only the recent release has the restored footage, so the old version was in fact censored, and this version is on the dvd here because the new version again is owned by a different distributor.
     
  8. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    Yes, but you only think Part 8 is "awful" because you don't "get it" :D
     
  9. Phil Hinton

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    Ok.

    Ok. I will just remind you of your first quote, and of course that's your opinion about being a classic.

    Do you have to be approved to watch them, so what you are saying is that these films were not for our reviewer to watch? That's just plain Sillyness!

    Right so these films are not for the mainstream, they make them just for fans do they? And Cult movies are better? Again what a silly comment to make!

    Your source is? Or is this just your opinion again?

    I think you will find it is the US Region 1 release. :rotfl:

    Again, your opinion. Just because the reviewer doesn't agree with you, doesn't mean his arguement is any less valid, infact he has explained himself far better than you have so far with your counter arguements. :lesson:

    Thanks for taking the time to read our reviews;)
     
  10. Marc

    Marc
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    ok, when i said they aren't great, i meant on the "godfather trilogy", "lord of the rings", "citizen kane" scale of things, which a slasher movie is never going to match up to, but the review started out saying that the original was poor to begin with, which is harsh to say the least.

    and where i said they weren't made for him to watch, i mean they were made for Jason fans. In stark contrast, episode 1 and 2 of star wars were made for the mainstream public, and a high proportion of Star wars fans/fanatics completely hated them for that. Jar Jar anyone? Lucas ****** on the star wars fans, but the various Jason directors catered for theirs. They all know we just want to see Jason kill people, and that he does..

    Part 7 (The new blood) is widely regarded (among Jason fans) as the best, because Kane Hodder is Jason, and Kane Hodder is the best Jason, and the bodycount is the highest i believe, up until JX. The 18" tall Jason figure made by Neca is modelled on the Jason from Part 7 as this was the one the fans wanted most (partially broken mask, chains wrapped around neck, exposed spinal column)

    and ok, it's a US boxset.. that just makes it worse, they could have definitely done more with it, in the UK we are used to shoddy incomplete boxsets (see nightmare on elm street - there are 4 boxsets now, all crap compared to the 1999 US one, and Hellraiser - 2 boxsets both with 3 out of 6 movies and the phantasm boxset with part IV missing which is usually down to budget dvd distributors buying up the "wes craven's new nightmare" or "jason goes to hell: the final friday" or "phantasm oblIVion" totally stitching up boxset releases) Also can't see why they released the cut version of Friday 13th, must have been laziness.

    I hope one day someone will do Jason justice with a 10 disc boxset, each movie lovingly restored with a 5.1 DD soundtrack, but i doubt it'll ever happen.
     
  11. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    As I suggested before - I thought this was as close to the the "original" theatrical release as is likely. Are you calling this "cut" because there is another version that has scenes added?
     
  12. Marc

    Marc
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    well there's an uncut version which was the original, and was seen in some european countries, but censorship was bad around the early 80's if you remember, and bits were removed. The UK release, which i originally thought this was, was butchered by the BBFC, but even the US had bits removed. They kinda became the home cut since the original vhs releases and no one ever bothered doing anything about it, until the R2 uncut version which was released either last or this year.
     
  13. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    OK, but I'm a bit confused as to what you mean by "cut" and "uncut" - I'm referring to the movie as it was originally released in cinemas in the the US. You seem to be comparing this release with a previous DVD release which was not in its original movie form. I thought this version of Friday The 13th was in essence the theatrical, and therefore original uncut movie.
     
  14. Marc

    Marc
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    if you want to look at it that way, but the movie had to be cut in order to get the R rating it has in the US, and had to be cut extensively to get the 18 rating in the UK. The original final cut was X in the UK and NC17 or X in the US. The difference being that cuts were not made by the film studio, but by boards of censors.
     
  15. Marc

    Marc
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    oh and to put things in a different context, if someone had to review the rugby world cup final, would a rugby fan or a non-rugby fan do the more appropriate review? I've never been interested in rugby, and i watched a brief bit of the match but it bored me so i turned it off, but by all accounts it was a great match.
     
  16. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    I prefer to look at it this way...

    Some people enjoy playing tiddlywinks, and I for one would be willing to find out if I would enjoy the pastime. But in order to find out I have to play tiddlywinks. Once I've given it a reasonable chance to see if I would enjoy it or not, I make my decision. Pretty much happens when reviewing DVDs... before I know whether I think the movie will create a certain resonance with me I have to watch it.

    Your analogy with rugby is interesting, if flawed. I mean how many Man. Utd. football fans will think that Arsenal played poorly, whilst Arsenal fans will consider their side to have had a stupendous game?! If a "fan" of Friday The 13th were to review their all time favorite movie I thiink you may then be a little more likely to end up with a biased review... which seems to be what you want ;)

    As I suggested in the review - I was neither a fan nor a "not fan" before I watched the movies... but I did sway towards one side afterwards :D

    I do find it interesting that fans have a favorite Jason actor... for me it was quite clear that the slightly chubby actor originally chosen for Part VII simply had the wrong physique - Part VI would be my choice as actor who played Jason best.
     
  17. Marc

    Marc
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    ..i'm a man utd fan unfortunately. at least arsenal played badly last week :D shame we're playing badly every other..

    I can see your side of the tiddlywinks debate, i just think with items like boxsets, it's usually the fans who are being catered for, so in terms of the movie aspect a fan would be better doing the review, like if it was a star trek box set, i'd never be able to give it more than a 3/10 cos i think every episode ever made of star trek is bloody awful! But on the flip side i can see if i watched an Alias boxset i'd probably give it 9/10 or something purely because Jennifer Garner dressed up in lingerie and a goth outfit..

    I had no problem with the rest of the review, i mean i'd never considered buying it because of the 8 movies on 4 discs crap, but i was interested in finding out if any effort had been put into the sound/video which clearly it hasn't. I read an article today in which i found out that a LOT of extra features were made for this boxset which paramount just didnt bother adding, including other commentaries and featurettes.

    Obviously we can battle on with our opinions all day, but neither of us will ever back down so we may as well just admit we both have our opinions, biased or otherwise and let that be that...

    (possibly) interesting facts:

    Kane Hodder (jason in parts 7,8,9 and 10) was axed from Freddy Vs Jason as he's about a foot taller than Robert Englund and it was thought the battle would not be believable (well as believable as a battle between a mutant mongoloid who can't die, and a dream demon with bad fashion sense can be), and it was also thought that Kane Hodder (a stuntman by trade) would not be able to pull off the "emotional" side of Jason's character (resist laughter) so he was replaced.

    At the Fangoria convention in January 2004, he was asked about how he felt about Jason's look in Freddy vs. Jason. Kane replied, 'I guess they wanted Jason to look like a skinny little bitch this time...'

    You can see Kane Hodder unmasked in Wishmaster. He's the guard who gets melted into the window by the Djinn.

    Kane has a contract with Newline for 1 more jason movie, so there WILL be another!
     
  18. Garrett

    Garrett
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    I though the VII the best of the batch since we have someone who actually goes head to head with Jason it was a shame they could not have made more of it.

    I think VIII was absolutely terrible I even wonder why Mark Richman the only known name to appear in it did and the ending was so lame and did not tie in at all with the next in the series Jason Goes To Hell.

    III (ch ch cha) was also not a good outing especially if you do not/or they do not provide the facilities for you to watch it in 3D. A lot of the scenes remind me of the old Lenny Henry sketch on 3D films. There is plenty of un-required shoot that say oohhh look a finger poking out of the screen, or oohhh this harpoon is going to hit you in the chest. Which is actually bad photograph in any mode but especially in 2D.

    Friday The 13th are really no brainer films, when you give the brain a night off, and to be watched with you mates with a few pints down you.

    As to the best of the bunch I think there was a poll on the forum or a thread on it and I think IV and VI were the favorites.

    Sigismund liked V because of Lana :smoke: but who’d blame him. :devil: :laugh:
     
  19. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    I actually thought V was the least worst of the bunch because of the actors that played Jason and Tommy :blush:
     
  20. Garrett

    Garrett
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    I do not know who ona is you miss quote me on but would just like to point out V had the largest body count, coming in at 22.
     
  21. Marc

    Marc
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    oh yeah! but it doesn't count,
    because it wasn't Jason!
    ;)

    [Edited by Sigismund to add spoiler tags]
     
  22. Garrett

    Garrett
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    I think you best alter you post as that is a spoiler. :lesson: like I have done in my quote.
     
  23. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    I'm so pleased I prefer V for all the right reasons :blush: :cool: :devil:
     
  24. FoxyMulder

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    The original Friday the 13th is missing a few extra seconds of the arrow going through a certain famous actors neck while he lies in bed and a bit near the end where one of the characters is decapitated, i believe the BBFC did actually allow this to be released uncut around the mid nineties on VHS but of course this is the MPAA american cinema version thus we're missing that footage here but since people in the UK are used to seeing the additional footage thanks to that VHS version i mention then shouldn't the reviewer state its missing footage for UK fans.

    I wasn't meaning to actually say only fans should review certain movies what i was trying to imply was DVD has been around for many years now and we're all used to seeing directors cuts and special editions with additional extra scenes, unrated etc etc, i just feel Paramount could have done more especially as there have been online petitions for the last four years or more asking for uncut versions of all these movies and by uncut i mean adding all the gore the MPAA in America originally cut out in the eighties, you have to remember horror films in the mid eighties were cut to shreds for the R rating in America due to political pressures and indeed the same thing happened in the UK but many scenes were filmed and could have been re-instated as they are into many other movies now being released on DVD, i would have just liked to have seen them put more effort into releasing versions with more gore and sprucing up the soundtracks into a 5.1mix, this effort is made for other films but the reviewer doesn't seem to care or even mention this little fact and i think its a valid point for me to bring up and while i can understand you want to defend the review i do believe that even if you are not a fan of the movies there is certain information that could have been included with the review that wasn't.

    I don't mean to cause offence to the reviewer by saying this and i hope they understand where i'm coming from as they do a lot of great reviews i just think Paramount did a lousy job considering all the footage they had which the MPAA forced the directors to cut and considering the fact DVD is a medium which could have allowed 2 different cuts on one disc ( theatrical and perhaps an unrated cut )

    I think everyone not just fans would have benefitted from unrated versions being made available and the fact they took so long to reach DVD and all they give us is the same old R rated prints is what's disappointing to me but thats just my personal opinion and is based on how much work is done on other films to restore footage and give them a real collectors feel which i don't think happened with these movies.
     
  25. Sigismund

    Sigismund
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    Your post is a little long and rambling, but I think I understand it.

    What amuses me is the notion that in this instance "fans" of the movies want 5.1 soundtracks and more gore. In many cases fans complain when their beloved movies are "tampered with" in this manner. I guess the answer is to offer both to the viewer, which I imagine is where you're coming from.

    You write "i would have just liked to have seen them put more effort into releasing versions with more gore and sprucing up the soundtracks into a 5.1mix, this effort is made for other films but the reviewer doesn't seem to care or even mention this little fact"

    I presume you have indeed read my review and have merely forgotten that I have written,

    "Parts 1, 2 , 3, 4 and 5 have mono soundtracks, and although they cope admirably they simply cannot draw you into a movie in the same way even an average Dolby Digital 5.1 track can. Having said that, the first Friday The 13th, and to a lesser extent its immediate sequel, benefits by the raw edginess of the simplistic nature exhibited by the mono sound."

    and

    "All in all audio quality really lets the side down here – so much more could be achieved, after all a good soundtrack goes a long way in enhancing the horror movie experience."

    So the reviewer certainly does mention this little fact, and obviously cares.

    As for more gore - again, if you read throught the rather lengthy review, you will see that there are a reasonable amount of supplemental features... and at this point I must apologise for an error on my part. I've not included a chunk of the extras part of the review :blush: This is now sorted, and if you read through the supplemental features you will see that there is a fair amount of extra gore included for fans. :)

    Finally, I did a fair amount of research for this review and was of the opinion that Paramount have released the original Friday in its "original" US theatrical state. You seem to have info which suggests that Paramount own the rights to an extended version of this movie - I am all too willing to bow to a Friday fan's greater knowledge about such things, but I was unsure who owned the rights to this version of the movie (Warner?). Like I said, I did some research, but finding "the answer" to this little can of worms proved elusive - there seem to be many conflicting opinions from many "true fans". I do appreciate that movie fans, as with the rest of society, often want something they haven't got... but in this reviewer's opinion a couple of extra seconds of gore would in no way improve the quality of the movie :D

    No offense is taken by this reviewer - I'm sure you appreciate only too well what goes into writing a review for a single DVD movie, never mind eight, and constructive critisism is always welcomed :thumbsup:
     
  26. Marv

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    Ooh as a General review i can see why you handed out those scores you were a little harsh on the sound though it needed more than a "3", a 5 or 6 would have been better. I thought the sound mix on part 6 was pretty good for a pro logic track but part 7 5.1 track was a waste of time and was really flat.

    I could'nt believe that you liked part 5 thats regarded as the worst in the series by fan cause theres no Jason and the story sucks pretty bad. I was hoppping You would give Part 6 a better score that is definatly the best in the series with the Alice Cooper soundtrack and all the horror cliches.

    BTW Marc Angelus part 1 was always uncut in the uk, Warner released teh R rated cut version in the uk in the 90's but went back to the european cut for the dvd.
     
  27. meatloaf_fan

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    Is 'From Crystal Lake to Manhattan' coming out as a region 2 release aswell?
     
  28. Marv

    Marv
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    No.
     
  29. Smurfin

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    Hmm, must put this one on the "do not watch" list:D
     

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