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Refresh rate - 60hz or 85hz?

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by tutu, Jul 13, 2005.

  1. tutu

    tutu
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    I've connected my PC upto the PV500 yesterday for some 42" gaming and the quality is just gob smacking gorgeous. My question however is that it can take either 60hz - 85hz at 1024x768. Which referesh rate is recommended?

    I'm not sure if the old CRT refresh rate (the higher the better) applies to plasma? Is their a monitor profile available for the PV500?

    I also discovered that I could not get 5.1 from Doom 3 unless I bought some analogue cables :( Coax only worked for DVD.

    Btw, I was playing Doom 3 (co-op mod) over the internet using a headset and xbox controller. It was amazing :)
     
  2. gizlaroc

    gizlaroc
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    I think the Panasonic is 60.00hz native, or maybe 60.04, so this is what you want to set it at.
     
  3. leeboy22001

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    i'm not actually sure the plasma has a native frame rate, because tests i've done on my pv500 suggests there is no frame rate conversion going on. also panasonic do not state in there spec (like LCD monitors) a native frame rate.
     
  4. -Hitman-

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    When using the PC connection, usually the higher the refresh rate supported the better!

    Use 85hz in your case, if any problems then drop back to the next lowest setting but i think you should be ok!

    Dr.
     
  5. gizlaroc

    gizlaroc
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    The panasonic will sync to any refresh rate you throw at it, but, it will give you its best results when sending it 60hz or thereabouts.
    You occasionally get like a rainbow effect when stuff moves at 50Hz and at higher than 60Hz, and also the plasma is doing less work so running at something other than 60hz reduces the number of colours/grey shades that can be shown, compared to when displaying 60hz I was told today, which thinking about it makes sense.
    Not sure if that is completely true but the whole point up upping refresh on a PC was to get rid of flicker than can easily be seen when sitting 1ft away from it, with a plasma that is not a problem, so why bother putting extra pressure on the graphics card and the panel when it's not needed?
     
  6. -Hitman-

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    I don't know where you have got this info from but it is incorrect,

    Graphic cards are designed to run upto 200HZ ( if the monitor supports it) and you loose absolutely nothing as far as PQ or colours are concerned, they are exactly the same no matter what refresh rate you use, so 85hz is not pushing anything!

    The best refresh rate is the maximum your display will accept with the given resolution.

    I have run mine at 60hz, 72hz, 75hz and 85hz with no judder, permanently i use 1280 x 768 @ 85hz at this is the recommended best resolution to use with plasma's on the PC input, the second being 1024 x 768 @85hz.

    Using the HDMI or Dvi connection is a different matter.

    Dr.
     
  7. gizlaroc

    gizlaroc
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    I am talking about the display regarding colours etc., but if a graphics card has to do 60 cycles a second or 85 cycles a second then one obviously puts more strain on your PC than the other.

    All I am saying is what benifit are you going to get running the screen at 85hz over 60Hz?

    Don't take that the wrong way, I am not saying there isn't a benifit, I am asking what it is with a progressive display that idealy likes to run at 60Hz.
     
  8. tutu

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    I've left it at 60hz for now at 1024x768 and the desktop quality is amazing. But their are bars on widescreen films (top and bottom). Should I use a different resolution or try on of the zoom modes on the TV?
     
  9. gizlaroc

    gizlaroc
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    There should be bars on most films, only the ones cropped or shot in 16:9 will have no bars.
     
  10. tutu

    tutu
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    16:9 films have larger than normal bars (on the PC). They are fine on Xbox and DVD Player.

    Their are no options to zoom on the TV when in PC mode. :(
     
  11. robo989

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    no offense but...

    Your all talking nonsense

    1. Graphics cards have things called "RAM DACS" basically convert the image in the memory of the graphics card into an analogue signal. Any card made in the last 3 years (4-5?) will do a fine job at any frequency, I'm not talking integrated motherboard stuff, basically any Geforce later than a Geforce2.

    2. Its the output devic thats the limiting factor, for example, I've got an old 15inch monitor thats "optimal" resolution is 800x600@85Hz. This gives a crisp (relative to its other supported modes) image. It will go all the way up to 1600x1200@60Hz, at this resolution the picture is extremely blurry and flickers because the refresh rate is so low, it can't go any higher so thats tough. It will go up to 110Hz@800x600 though, again its all blurry but the flicker reduction is obvious.

    3. Refresh rate on has absoluetly NO bearing whatsover on how much "work" your graphics card is doing, it will not affect your frame rate at all\any performance hit anywhere. Your frame rate is limited by the power of the components in your pc, and it cannot exceed the refresh rate you have set for the monitor\display device if you have "v-sync" turned on (V-sync stops the tearing effect in games by capping the frame rate) - You prolly didn't need to know that but hey...

    4. I know nothing about plasmas, and don't own one yet but I do know about computers n stuff. On the front of the plasma, 60hz\50hz is the optimum refresh rate for the pv500 isn't it? Why use any other refresh rate?

    Sorry if I appear arrogogant and ****ty, just making sure people and mislead by false information - no offense :suicide:
     
  12. robo989

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    Use the "pan&scan" mode in your dvd player software (PowerDVD\WinDVD)

    If your not happy that it chops of the sides a little, I'm pretty sure you can set it so it doesn't with some manual messing about with the zoom..
     
  13. gizlaroc

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    Or try setting it to 1280x720p for when you are watching films.
     
  14. gizlaroc

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    Haha :)

    Not at all mate, good to hear what people have to say.

    I think you are right with the display being the limiting factor, I was thinking back to the day of matrox cards that you could add extra memory to, taking it up to a frankly quite scary 4 meg! :eek:
    800x600/75 looked awesome, so did 1024x768/60, but taking that 1024x768 to 75 looked really bad. But it was probably the sh*tty monitors.

    The Panasonic has a native refresh of 60.04, if you keep it at that there will be virtually zero artifacts, coloured trails etc. the further you take it away from that the more problems you will get during movement, that is why I was saying why take it to 85Hz? unless you can see flicker on the plasma at 60hz (which you just can't!) it is pointless.
     
  15. robo989

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    totally agree, its the same for LCD monitors, they all look best at 60hz although some go up to 75Hz and sometimes slightly more (computer LCDs)...

    Occassionally on a computer lcd you can see flicker in circumstances where you have a fine grid, with a plasma screen though, they are no where near as sharp as an LCD, so you'd never notice it...

    I could be wrong but that my line of thinking, but I'm goin OT so ahhh yeah, see ya.

    soz for being so critical my post did sound mildly insulting, didn't mean it to :)
     
  16. Nick_UK

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    Sorry, but you are all talking out of your rear ends ! "Refresh rate" is only applicable to conventional CRT monitors. Plasmas and LCD screens display the picture in a totally different way (they are not scanned), so changing the refresh rate on a PC card won't make an iota of difference to the behaviour of the screen, other than the electronics conversion of the incoming signal.
     
  17. gizlaroc

    gizlaroc
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    Exactly, why give the screen something other than it likes, or something other than is pleasent to watch when viewing film?
     
  18. robo989

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    I think you'll find that you are wrong Nick, :)

    Do you have a computer display LCD yourself? A Good quality one?

    If you do you'll be able to prove yourself wrong right away, try and find a website with some extrememly fine lines in while using the LCD, then change the refresh rate up from 60Hz to something like 75Hz (mine supports this and looks different)...

    The flicker that IS there on ANY lcd is greatly reduced, also try looking at the pic from the corner of your eye, if you can't see any straight on. Some people swear they can't detect flicker anyway, but then some people say the human eye can't distinguish 30fps to 60fps and we all know they're talking plop...

    I promise you refresh rate DOES have relevence on an LCD and Plasma, I've read all that stuff as well about "LCD's displaying the image in a different way" In fact I was looking forward to owning an LCD before I got this on that basis, its not true though. I'm sure they do display the image "in a different way" just the different way still has nothing to do with refresh rate, well not nothing but I can certainly appreciate going to 75Hz on my ViewSonic VX912 19inch lcd. - I can't really "prove" it though, unless you can think of a way of proving it wrong...
     
  19. robo989

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    but hey its all academic really isn't it...

    There is no reason to need a higher refresh rate on a PV500...period?

    Just clearing up that "refresh rate has nothing to do with LCDs myth"
     
  20. efendi

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    Well IMO the main point is that the plasma does the output on 60Hz regardless of the frequency of the input signal, but the CRTs and LCDs are both triyng to follow the frequency of video card's RAM DAC. So, it's natural IMO that upping the output frequency here doesn't make anything good to the quality of picture...

    Petr
     
  21. gizlaroc

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    The panasonics can accept something other than their native 60.04 refresh, however, as you move further away from that refresh you start causing problems, so why bother?
     
  22. tutu

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    Sorry for the late reply but I have been busy enjoying my purchase :D

    The solution to my problem is to keep the display at 1024x768@60hz - as anything other than 1:1 pixel mapping just doesn't look very good (as the desktop).

    I've been using Media Player Classic as my default movie player - and when things don't look right - i've forced it to override the aspect ratio to 16:9.

    This gets rid of the black bars without losing anything left or right. Seems to work great for me ;)

    Another note however, is that the TV buzz's a lot more on the desktop (but then the buzz reduces when playing a film).
     

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