Reflecterol screen paint vs dream screen sample vs Grey steel 2

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
So I am about to sleep then I get a phone call midnight from a man from Romania saying my parcel will be delivered to my house in 30 mins of my projector paint with sample included.

Decided as I had to wait up and get delivery, I’d do a quick comparison between GS2 and the sample of dreamscreen I have at my house.

It’s very hard to picture dark scenes properly because the camera had to expose for it so lifts the blacks.

In credits, it’s obviously lighter than GS2, about the same as dreamscreen which is impressive imo. Have had GS2 for ages so wonder how it will be getting used to a different black floor.

gs2 maintains a really deep black level but at the massive expense of every other colour popping of the screen.

I’m also prettt impressed at how much brighter it is than the dream screen and the whites are whiter whilst having similar black levels.

Not sure how the retlefterol paint works scientifically.

Here are some photos and comparisons for anyone interested. The screen is GS2, the small piece is dream screen and the big piece is the reflecterol projector paint.

It’s going to be sad to have to higher the black floor slightly but I do feel it’s maybe time to say bye to GS2 . Will do a blind test tommorow with a few people to see their thoughts


Will get the entire screen done in the next fortnight of the ‘blind’ test goes well .
 

Attachments

  • 527F53E1-9553-4164-8118-42195A6E53AA.jpeg
    527F53E1-9553-4164-8118-42195A6E53AA.jpeg
    213.1 KB · Views: 127
  • 028B7397-9AAD-41DA-8432-B6A09BDFB5D3.jpeg
    028B7397-9AAD-41DA-8432-B6A09BDFB5D3.jpeg
    187.5 KB · Views: 119
  • 63607F20-1D0A-4366-A7B5-632565207089.jpeg
    63607F20-1D0A-4366-A7B5-632565207089.jpeg
    238.8 KB · Views: 111
  • FEBC8300-5805-42A2-9992-CE62CF6AD289.jpeg
    FEBC8300-5805-42A2-9992-CE62CF6AD289.jpeg
    220.2 KB · Views: 102
  • ED049785-0990-4744-869C-F09D06606464.jpeg
    ED049785-0990-4744-869C-F09D06606464.jpeg
    148.2 KB · Views: 100
  • 477E9CA2-96A5-4A8B-90C8-30B0986A8F79.jpeg
    477E9CA2-96A5-4A8B-90C8-30B0986A8F79.jpeg
    125.3 KB · Views: 96
  • 9F77C970-E63B-40C0-A17D-07372DE5FC12.jpeg
    9F77C970-E63B-40C0-A17D-07372DE5FC12.jpeg
    200.3 KB · Views: 96
  • 772DDE19-52C6-4D4B-A31B-4631B4AEEA57.jpeg
    772DDE19-52C6-4D4B-A31B-4631B4AEEA57.jpeg
    234.9 KB · Views: 95
  • 7B5803EB-56E1-42BD-8DA7-51224822638C.jpeg
    7B5803EB-56E1-42BD-8DA7-51224822638C.jpeg
    245.3 KB · Views: 93
  • CE3BB88D-9038-43A0-9D31-CDA932C668C2.jpeg
    CE3BB88D-9038-43A0-9D31-CDA932C668C2.jpeg
    101.8 KB · Views: 90
  • C6F2E916-4544-40DB-A61D-01AFEF824EC3.jpeg
    C6F2E916-4544-40DB-A61D-01AFEF824EC3.jpeg
    171.9 KB · Views: 88
  • 43D7F405-6E1D-46DB-B72A-A128DFA5FA81.jpeg
    43D7F405-6E1D-46DB-B72A-A128DFA5FA81.jpeg
    156.2 KB · Views: 85
  • F7FE03F7-1CBA-4006-8AD4-50E239098510.jpeg
    F7FE03F7-1CBA-4006-8AD4-50E239098510.jpeg
    315.3 KB · Views: 90
  • 250CDAAF-E119-4F71-887D-995B29D01BB1.jpeg
    250CDAAF-E119-4F71-887D-995B29D01BB1.jpeg
    224.5 KB · Views: 90
  • 546BC5BA-F514-4D21-8878-15AD0E1F2E8D.jpeg
    546BC5BA-F514-4D21-8878-15AD0E1F2E8D.jpeg
    203.8 KB · Views: 80
  • 4D32040C-38FB-4432-95E0-8563C189B287.jpeg
    4D32040C-38FB-4432-95E0-8563C189B287.jpeg
    205.2 KB · Views: 74
  • F125FC48-7172-4B38-BE92-464B523082B8.jpeg
    F125FC48-7172-4B38-BE92-464B523082B8.jpeg
    206.4 KB · Views: 78
Last edited:

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
FYI anyone using high gain/white screen options who can share opinions on higher black floor most welcome!
I'm very into black levels and the GS2 has always given me black levels more than I should probably have at the expensive of the brighter end.

I'm sure I probably have the best black level on this forum because a) I'm using GS2 which is 0.6 gain, b) I'm stretched for lumens half the time due to my screen size and this has come at the expense of every single other colour, overall brightness etc.

But as an addict of black levels, I'm finding it hard to say goodbye to them.
 

3rdignis

Active Member
0.5 = low gain
1.0 = neutral gain
2.0 = high gain

Theoretically eg
1.0 gain screen
Mid iris
Projector output 1L
Room reflects 1LxR
Screen reflects 1L + 1LxR

0.5 gain screen
Open iris
Projector output 2L
Room reflects 2LxR
Screen reflects 1L + 1LxR

2.0 gain screen
Closed iris
Projector outputs 0.5L
Room reflects 0.5L xR
Screen reflects 1L + 1LxR

Black floor = peak white ÷ contrast

Closed iris gives max contrast and best Black floor


Also smaller smaller screen gives better contrast and black floor

Big 1.0 gain screen
Projector outputs 1L
Room reflects 1LxR
Screen reflects 1L + 1LxR

Smaller 1.0 gain screen
Projector outputs 0.5L
Room reflects 0.5LxR
Screen reflects 0.5L + 0.5LxR

Big screen 1L = 14ftL
Small screen 0.5L = 14ftL

Both screens reflect the desired peak white, but the smaller screen room reflect half the light to wash out Black level.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
0.5 = low gain
1.0 = neutral gain
2.0 = high gain

Theoretically eg
1.0 gain screen
Mid iris
Projector output 1L
Room reflects 1LxR
Screen reflects 1L + 1LxR

0.5 gain screen
Open iris
Projector output 2L
Room reflects 2LxR
Screen reflects 1L + 1LxR

2.0 gain screen
Closed iris
Projector outputs 0.5L
Room reflects 0.5L xR
Screen reflects 1L + 1LxR

Black floor = peak white ÷ contrast

Closed iris gives max contrast and best Black floor


Also smaller smaller screen gives better contrast and black floor

Big 1.0 gain screen
Projector outputs 1L
Room reflects 1LxR
Screen reflects 1L + 1LxR

Smaller 1.0 gain screen
Projector outputs 0.5L
Room reflects 0.5LxR
Screen reflects 0.5L + 0.5LxR

Big screen 1L = 14ftL
Small screen 0.5L = 14ftL

Both screens reflect the desired peak white, but the smaller screen room reflect half the light to wash out Black level.


thank u. so theoretically, a high gain screen with closed iris will give a better image than a low gain screen (0.5) at full open iris? once they are brightness matched.

black floor will get some getting used to but my entire image was ruined in some ways in brightness.
 

3rdignis

Active Member
Set the desired peak white for your room.
Raising screen gain to 1.0 improves.

A less reflective room
Requires a lower peak white = more contrast
Less diluted Black floor = more contrast

In a perfect Room, changing to a higher contrast Projector, a lower peak white is preferred = more contrast
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
Set the desired peak white for your room.
Raising screen gain to 1.0 improves.

A less reflective room
Requires a lower peak white = more contrast
Less diluted Black floor = more contrast

In a perfect Room, changing to a higher contrast Projector, a lower peak white is preferred = more contrast
Does it not depend on screen size?

I am going to have a 170'' 2:35:1 screen in a pretty much fully treated room and was under impression higher gain is definitely important and can clamp down iris on JVC (whether its X7900 or N5 for more contrast as I have more lumens to spare due to the higher gain).

I've seen very new N series JVC or X series with a low gain screen. Interesting.

Which PJ are you running? I see you have both Epson and JVC. My Epson definitely benefit from grey screen, I found JVC less so.
 

Doctor Smith

Well-known Member
Have you a link to the 3 paints please?
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
Last edited:

3rdignis

Active Member
If your at high lamp Closed iris on a large screen

Or low lamp Closed iris on smaller screen

If your projector outputs 2x light on larger screen your light control will be 1/2 as effective

How much difference this would make I couldn't say.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
If your at high lamp Closed iris on a large screen

Or low lamp Closed iris on smaller screen

If your projector outputs 2x light on larger screen your light control will be 1/2 as effective

How much difference this would make I couldn't say.
my room is going to be 90% MVEL22 by the end of this I think mate. so light bouncing around hopefully not an issue.
 

3rdignis

Active Member
My room is fully treated.
0.95gain screen.
On 100" 2.4:1 I'm at high lamp -13 iris
On 80" 16:9 I'm at high lamp -15 iris

I think I perceive an improvement in contrast.

I enjoy the 80" picture sporadically, but couldn't live with it full time.

The 9300 doesn't get a look in now.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
My room is fully treated.
On 100" 2.4:1 I'm at high lamp -13 iris
On 80" 16:9 I'm at high lamp -15 iris

I think I perceive an improvement in contrast.

I enjoy the 80" picture sporadically, but couldn't live with it full time.
Nice! Any photos mate?

I don't think I can do 80''. I'd just watch 77'' OLED instead.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
So I've confirmed with a few calibrators - higher gain screen = higher black floor. More light reflected in white and black and all colours.

So a higher gain screen does = a higher black floor.
however more light = more means of closing iris
more closed iris on high contrast projector = higher contrast in image and hopefully lower black floor.

so a 1.1 gain screen close iris to brightness match a 0.8 gains screen will give u a better contrast and similar brightness.



I've read some user reports on previous posts people going to higher gain screens and not seeing a difference with having heavily treated rooms. Not sure if its due to perception or vision but scientifcally, there WILL be a difference. Whether people perceive it is up to them but if they got a measurement tool out, the facts are facts.

room treatment is not going to massively change this. actually more MVEL should mean easier to perceive a change.. so basically u either see it.. or u dont.. but its there. like most things home AV we all seem to have different levels of tolerance and OCD.

Argh.. that as a long morning of research.
 
Last edited:

3rdignis

Active Member
20211222_032321.jpg


I think I'm around 100,000:1 contrast, my phone cannot capture this.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member

Doctor Smith

Well-known Member
One is Dulux GS2 (Grey Steel 2 | Dulux)
One is Dreamscreen V7 (not a paint) (DREAMSCREEN ULTRAWEAVE V7 SCREEN FABRIC 2,3X4M / 2,3X5,3M FIT-ALL SYSTEM – DreamScreen)

The brighter one (the big piece) - I'll just ask permission from the person I bought it off if I can share contact -

Edit: Reflectrol Studio Master, gain masurat on-axis 1.12 confera brilianta imaginii
Thanks. A bit too expensive for me.
Any idea how much white I will need to add to a 1 ltr tin of GS2 to get me a 0.8 gain? Thanks
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
Thanks. A bit too expensive for me.
Any idea how much white I will need to add to a 1 ltr tin of GS2 to get me a 0.8 gain? Thanks
just buy GS4. I think its 0.8 or 0.9 gain.
I think paint from Reflecterol including black paint for the ceiling cost me £170ish. did u speak to calin? He's very helpful. also the paint comes with all the painting stuff surprisingly. shipping was rapid.



I was getting INSANE quotes for a 2cm depth 2M (height) by 4M (width) screen so hopefully this works out well.
 

3rdignis

Active Member
20220220_104619.jpg

20220220_104646.jpg

20220220_104713.jpg


Screenshot_20211022-210130.jpg

Jvc x700
From my calibrator
-5 iris low lamp as requested
Now have new lamp -13 and -15 iris

Does your jvc for CIH on -13 iris 2.4:1 land squarely on -15 for 16:9

Is this designed in or am I lucky

There is a massive drop from -13 to -14/-15
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
How bigs your sample piece of DS??
I have two of them. I can't remember exactly. can measure it later. I think it must about 50cmx50cm? The screen is 170inches 2:35:1 if u wanna try and guestimate mate
 
Ahhh that’s a good size piece…I was gonna say I’ve got a piece here about the size of A3 but it’s probably the same size as what you already have.
 

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
Ahhh that’s a good size piece…I was gonna say I’ve got a piece here about the size of A3 but it’s probably the same size as what you already have.

Thanks mate. I have a few piece so although I didn't post photos, I did do an indepth comparison. This screen paint easily beats it for brightness... but then again its all irrelavant as the dreamscreen is an AT material so obviously is made for a different task.

I just thought I'd post it as a point of comparison if that makes sense? as we all know Dream Screen is a lovely material so it'll be easier to see valid comparisons.

Very very impressed with the paint sample. the guy is calin, knows what he's talking about from JVC forum. posted me videos of calibration of it and colour accuracy too, all of which good.

I was stuck otherwise screen wise having to lay out a big chunk of money and stressing if it'd fit in my space. Now I can move forward with electronic masking vertical top bar once this is painted.

my main worry he said i have to get off the GS2 paint by scrubbing it or something. My wall is perfect at the moment so I am concerned I will reintroduce imperfections by getting the GS2 paint off it.
 

Doctor Smith

Well-known Member

Attachments

  • IMG_20211020_164843.jpg
    IMG_20211020_164843.jpg
    124.7 KB · Views: 72
  • IMG_20211020_165047.jpg
    IMG_20211020_165047.jpg
    127.9 KB · Views: 74
  • IMG_20211020_164609.jpg
    IMG_20211020_164609.jpg
    169.6 KB · Views: 95

kenshingintoki

Distinguished Member
Similar to my room


u have a killer room doc!! def stretch the cash and get the paint mate IMO. massive improvement, u can clamp down iris maximise contrast
 

The latest video from AVForums

Samsung S95B QD-OLED Review - A Quantum Leap for OLED!
Subscribe to our YouTube channel

Latest News

PSB Speakers unveils Passif 50 loudspeaker
  • By Ian Collen
  • Published
Samsung Gaming Hub goes live
  • By Ian Collen
  • Published
Huawei unveils FreeBuds Pro 2 true wireless earbuds
  • By Ian Collen
  • Published
Sony unveils Inzone gaming brand
  • By Ian Collen
  • Published

Full fat HDMI teeshirts

Support AVForums with Patreon

Top Bottom