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Receivers with Phantom Centre.

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by JIT, Mar 4, 2002.

  1. JIT

    JIT
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    I am looking for some receivers which have a front centre mode as I do not have a centre speaker. I currently have a 9 year old Pioneer Pro-Logic amp and am looking to go digital. Receivers I am interested in include the Denon 2802, Marantz 6200 and the Sony 1070. Has anybody got any information?
     
  2. bob007

    bob007
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    With the Denon you can select centre speaker to Large Small or None.
    If you are looking to set a D/D system up i would advise you to purchase a centre speaker as soon as your funds allow, you don't have to pay a fortune to get a decent centre.
    The centre is very important, and will make all the difference in the overall sound.
     
  3. gz5ztg

    gz5ztg
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    Surely if you are positioned in front of the stereo speakers then the imaging will provide the same sound as if you had a centre speaker?

    You can also set the centre speaker to Large medium or none on the Marantz amps, setting to none redirects the signal to the stereo speakers.
     
  4. Ian J

    Ian J
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    And Sony, so it seems that you can switch off the centre speaker on all three amps.

    It is correct that if you sit in the centre with left and rights equidistantly placed the sound will still be locked to the screen but if you are married it is unfortunate for the wife unless she is sitting on your lap whilst watching.
     
  5. bob007

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    May have worked with DPL, but with D/D the front sound stage comprises of three disrete channels were F/X can be directed to any one channel, without the centre the effect will be lost. Thats why it's called 5.1 and not 4.1....!

    Also helps lock dialogue on to the screen so seating position is more flexible.
     
  6. Spencem

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    I always sit with my wife on my lap, but perhapse this is why I never get all the way to the end of a film.:devil: ;) :blush:
     
  7. Guest

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    Centre speakers are for Home Cinema Sheep. They dominate the sound entirely and all this locking to screen nonsense is illogical. Engage free thought and work out why. Most people seem to be using them with something like a 28" 16:9 telly *** ! And with the front pair often immediately either side of the screen !

    Always best to get your main pair 8-9 feet apart to create a sense of a 'soundstage' and have a phantom centre set up.

    Mike.

    P.S. Not intentionally trying to annoy people but hey...
     
  8. bob007

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    I'll set up two demo rooms, one with a centre channel with main fronts 8/9ft apart, the other with no centre and main fronts 8/9ft apart.
    Then sit in various seating positions up to 160degs off centre then tell us who's the ball of wool then.

    PS....... Not intentionally trying to retaliate ;)
     
  9. Guest

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    Although irrelevant anyway, how many people sit 160 degrees off centre ? The main fronts are (or should be) more important than a centre. Soundstaging *works* if your speakers can image nicely. I'd take proper soundstaging against centre speaker dominance anyday.

    Mike.
     
  10. Guest

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    Sorry forgot to add: Wakeyboy.

    ;-)
     
  11. mjn

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    well i'm going to butt in here!!

    I think a centre speaker is fairly vital!! Although you can have a phantom centre, you can also have phantom rears.

    If you sit in the right location, (there is only one), this virtual surrounds does sort of work.....but you need deadicated rears for the full effect.... And this is the same of the centre speaker; it allows more "freedom" on viewing/listening angle, whilst still offering the correct soundstage.
     
  12. Matt F

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    I'd say that it is surprising how good DD/DTS can sound with a phantom centre (I've tried it) as long as you sit centrally between the left and right speakers.

    However, when you switch the centre back in there is a definite improvement. Anyone who thinks the centre speaker overwhelms the left and right speakers has probably got their centre set at too high a volume - mine certainly was until I got an SPL meter and set it up properly.

    If I had no room for a centre speaker I reckon I could cope on the phantom centre option but, then again, you can get some pretty classy centres (e.g. M&K S85C) that take up next to no room but sound wonderful.
     
  13. bob007

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    Flimber.....or is it sean the sheep....!!

    Iv'e got it now........you've got surround sound not dolby digital :D

    I bet you stretch 2.35:1 ratio movies to fit the TV aswell.

    I myself, listen and watch the way it was intended, 5.1 (thats with a centre) and correct ratio(not stretched)

    Sorry not a wakeyboy...............!!
     
  14. philmate

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    Jit,

    I agree with both Matt and Flimber. I lived without a centre for over a year because I was convinced/ignorant to the fact that a centre was not required. My mains are about 7ft apart D/D does sound good if you have quality mains as you have a very good soundstage and its very alive as Flimber says.The sound is very open and speech is locked to the screen and also is at ear height. Also if listening/watching music via TV it sounds more natural if in stereo than Pro-logic, but I found you have to turn the bass down on your sub if you have one.I normally watch most TV in phantom mode unless its a film. For my birthday my girlie purchased a centre for me (good girl) and so I set it all up and suddenly I thought I was right, I was'nt impressed at all, all the sound suddenly came from the centre as it should but it was lifeless, mono, all soundstage had gone, I was gutted. As a guide I was watching JP III and when they were running (which they did a lot) through bushes I turned the cenrte off and hey presto it sounded so much better, not just in mono from the front. So I backed of the voliume on the centre a few db's and it all came back but sounded more complete, as Matt suggests. The mains were obviously working but were drowned out by the centre. I have now tilted and angled the centre to stop unwanted reflections off my back wall so the the speech is more ear height as sitting on the TV the speech was above the action so to speak. Sorry to waffle but if you do not want a centre speaker on your TV in the lounge where most people probably have one then don't and you'll still enjoy watching your film, if you don't it all seems an awfully waste of money, untill you put one on you like.

    Philmate.
     

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