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Real World Diff between 9700 pro and a 9800

Discussion in 'PC Gaming & Rigs' started by Dextur, Oct 21, 2004.

  1. Dextur

    Dextur
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    With HL2 just around the corner I want to enjoy every last inch of eye candy as well as performance (within my budget) so I'm thinking of upgrading my 9700 pro.

    I've seen some of the ATI X cards and they are crazy money and I'm being told that right now a Radeon 9800 Pro is really the best performing vaule for money card there is.

    However..

    I was wondering if anybody could tell me

    a) Whether I will see much performance (fps) and eye candy improvements moving from a 97000 pro to a 9800 pro?

    b) Whether the 128bit (not MB) cards are to be avoided and only go for a 256bit 9800 pro

    c) Whether it makes that much odds between a 9800 pro 256mb and a 128mb card.

    I don't hear much about people singing the praises of the 256mb card over the 128MB card so I'm tempted to get a 128MB card with a 256bit architecture.

    The 256bit cards are a bit more pricey but generally people seem to think it's worthwhile.

    Any hardcore gamers here can comment?

    My games played are

    COD - Multiplayer
    UO - Mulitplayer

    Soon - HL2 and PA
     
  2. AML

    AML
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    Hmmm interesting question. I had a 9800pro and recently replaced it with a 6800GT.

    To be honest I dont see the "massive" improvement these cards are supposed to bring.

    The only time ive ever seen a huge improvement was when i replaced my old GForce 3 with a GForce 4 when i was playing Unreal II. The difference was amazing and very easy to see. However, when i built the PC im using now I also bought the 9800pro and TBH I didnt feel it was all that different from my old PC. (which i still use)

    Im sure a top of the line rig will get amazing scores in benchmarks like 3D Mark, but visually i think there is not much difference.

    Im still waiting to be impressed by my 6800GT!!
     
  3. Sinzer

    Sinzer
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    I think the simple answer will likely be no.

    You are better off waiting until the X700 or 6600 comes out, which are the mid-range cards.

    But like AML says the gap in performance will most probably not be that pants wetting.

    I remember the day I upgraded my Riva TNT to a GForce2 GTS, now that day I did wet my pants!
     
  4. drummerjohn

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    No.

    I have a 9700pro and just purchased a 9800pro for a system I made for a firend and the difference was minimal.

    The 9700pro may have lower clock speeds but it has 8 pipelines whereas the 9800pro has 4 I beleive. So the difference is minimal.
     
  5. sunderland

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    i think going from a 9800pro to a 6800gt is a big difference. the 9800 is no were near as powerfull as the 6800gt. but like sinzer said you might be better of waiting for the x700 or 6600. they will be in your price range.
     
  6. Hawklord

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    I think there's only about a 10% difference between a 9700pro and a 9800pro iirc. I went from a 9700pro to a 6800gt and the difference is incredible:) Coupled to the fact I've now upgraded to an A64 3500+ too the GT now flies (no cpu bottleneck) and clocked to ultra speeds (400/1100) plays all games at ridiculess resolutions and graphics detail. I can run the HL2 stress test @1600x1200 on highest detail, AA & AF with vsync on and still get around 80fps:)
     
  7. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright
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    You know, I don't think ATI are doing themselves any favours by having such a confusing plethora of video cards on offer.
    Seems like they have to offer cards at every conceivable price point.
    Anyhow I upgraded from a 9600 to an X800 XT when I built myself a new machine last weekend. I can justify one new machine very couple of years and I'm dead happy having gone the Intel route.
    I use the card for UO multiplayer.
    Previously I was running at 1024x768 with medium graphics setting and getting from 45-60 fps.
    Now I am running at 1600x1200 with everything up full and getting 150 fps.
    Awesome.
     
  8. Dextur

    Dextur
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    Ok good feedback, So really the reality is that unless I move to a x800 XT or similar the difference will be neglible over the 9700 pro.

    Sinzer, your comment about the TNT made me laugh, I will never forget the day I installed my first 3dfx card , a banshee something or other it was.

    I had been using the onboard graphics on my 286, I restarted the PC and fired up the orignal quake 1 it was at the time..

    I literallly didn't leave the house for a week .."oh my god - so that's what games are meant to look like"

    You mean CGA isn't a good resolution!!!!!!!
     
  9. Dextur

    Dextur
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    ps Do people generally favour the radeon x800 xt or the geforce 6800gt ?

    I have not had gforce cards in a long while now, been a radeon man.

    So if was to spend another £100 and takem into the £260 or so range would i get sometyhat that will truly outperform the 9700 pro.

    My 9700 pro did struggle on the single player part of UO when your going into the storming at FOY, when all the guys follow you across the fields.

    My system is a p4 2.8, 1gb ram
     
  10. Hawklord

    Hawklord
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    TBH the GT is the best value for money card imo. Most clock to ultra speeds out of the box (save £100 over the ultra) and perform like a dream compared to the 9700 pro. You'll be able to have all the eye candy switched on even @high resolutions:) The x800 pro is not as good imo at this price point and you have to mod the card to open all the pipes (only 12 against the gt's 16 iirc). it is also more cpu dependant compared to the GT I have been led to beleive.If you've got money to burn though the x800 xt is the best card around but they're very hard to find.
    If you want to purchase a GT I'd either recomend the Leadtek (I have one and can report they're pretty quiet <30db and cool but take up a pci slot as they're HUGE) or the xfx. A GT is worth the extra if gaming is a serious hobby :smashin:
     
  11. Laurel&amp;Hardy

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    I was going to upgrade my graphics before crimbo, but now I've decided to wait for SLI and do a whole new system early next year. This one is going to cost a bit I fear!

    I'll be putting 2 6800 GT's under the hood with an AMD 64 processor and at least a gig of RAM sitting in an NForce4 mobo. I've yet to decide on the sound but it's looking like Creative Audigy 2 series after I found out that all NVidia will ofer on the NF4 is a basic 7.1 codec. Oops there goes a grand already :eek:
     
  12. Dextur

    Dextur
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    Ok so realisticly this is down to

    X800 XT £305.00 ish
    6800 GT around £280.00

    Anyone know any better prices?
     
  13. Hawklord

    Hawklord
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    Are those prices including VAT?
    I thought the cheapest XT's were around £360 :confused:
     
  14. Sniper

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    "http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/GeForce_6800_GT.html"

    They are selling the ASUS 6800GT 128mb (not 256) @ £230 (inc vat).

    The only catch is the ram, but at that price it should be worth the loss of ram anyway!
     
  15. Dextur

    Dextur
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    Hawklord, I can get the gigabyte 256mb PCI x800xt from dabs at £324 inc vat full retail package inc shipping. Have not looked around to much yet.
     
  16. Dextur

    Dextur
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    Hmm, that's a good question is everything going PCI or AGP?
     
  17. Sniper

    Sniper
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    well... new motherboards are going the PCI direction!

    buy why do you ask?
     
  18. Dextur

    Dextur
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    Well really cos I presume PCI E is faster than AGP
     
  19. Sniper

    Sniper
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    as a simple comparison: yes the new PCI is faster than AGP, the issues are does the memory transfer fill that bandwith - does any of the software use that feature (i.e. store textures in ram cos' vid-ram finished!) - the anwers are NO and ALMOST NONE.

    if you're happy with your current CPU don't bother changing mobo just to get PCI express - get the AGP version. if on the other hand you need to upgrade the cpu might as well get the mobo and new pci vid-card (at least of upgradability's sake!)
     
  20. Dextur

    Dextur
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    I am happy with my P4 2.8, it's perfectly ok, at least I have not played on faster so don't know what I may be missing, but essentially it seems to offer the performance I need for all apps.

    I take it the PCI express slots are actually different to the PCI slots that all motherboards have and I can't buy a PCI express X800XT (for future proofing) then put it in the PCI slot and simply only get PCI performance as opposed to PCI express performance?
     
  21. Sniper

    Sniper
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    you said it - PCI express slots are totally different in shape (& technology) to the 'old' PCI slots.
     
  22. Dextur

    Dextur
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    ok thanks
    I've made up my mind to go with a X800XT , onlly problem now is finding one.. Jeez you can't spend money.
     
  23. AML

    AML
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    These newer cards are harder to find. I had a lot of trouble finding one. I bought mine while I was on holls in the US. I got it from "best buy" for $400 (6800GT 256MB) Thats only about 200quid. If you are willing you should try to get it thru an American company that does international shipping.

    I still dont understand why you guys still pay british prices for the xact same product.

    With a PC card there are no "region" issues so it dont matter where u get it from.

    Why pay 300 or more quid when 200 is enough?
     
  24. Hawklord

    Hawklord
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    You'd still have to pay VAT and import duty on that as well as the postie for paying up front. You will also have more problems returning the card if it's faulty too. I did look at importing a card but thought it worth the extra for peice of mind dealing with a UK company:)
     
  25. Dextur

    Dextur
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    Basically same comment as Hawkwind. We get stung on import taxes BIG time if the package gets sent by international post, I got stung badly once in that area, I won't go back again.

    Not to mention as Hawkwind commented, if it goes wrong, then what do you do? 2 lots of courier fees and no graphics card while it goes back etc?

    Also isn't the 800GT cheaper than the XT anyway? I doubt the price difference is really that much in it after import taxes.
     
  26. Dextur

    Dextur
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    Well I just ordered a Gigabyte (same as my current 9700pro) X800XT , £350 bloody quid, but should allow me to play games for the next 12-18 months as the developers intended.

    So much for a quick £100 upgrade yeah right.
     
  27. AML

    AML
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    I think you got the cards mixed up. I was talking about the NVidia 6800 GT (BFG) 256.
    Above that is the 6800 Ultra 256.

    The ATi cards are X800XT and below that is the X800 Pro.

    What a lot of people have been doing is buying the lower end ones then over clocking them to the same speeds and specs as the higher end cards.

    ie, an X800 pro can be over clocked, and the extra pipes can be unlocked to be on par with the X800 XT.

    The 6800 GT is much easyer to OC to be on parr with the Ultra. (using "coolbits" with the Nvidia driver)

    As for import taxation, there are ways arround it. Ask a friend or relative in the US if you have one. If they send it as a prezzy they shouldnt tax you!
    There must be somone you know that knows someone in the US!
     
  28. Dextur

    Dextur
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    AML, yes I have gone down the pressie route before, and it did work fine, but we are creatures of impatience us gamers, and I'm afraid I fall into the ' I want it know' catagory of gamers. I saw it, I bought it , it's here before 10 am on saturday morning.

    But aside from anything else if the card goes wrong and it's from the states, that is a nightmare, and could be without a graphics cards for weeks.

    I do understand you can clock these things, but not my cup of tea, I'm a simpering coward when it comes to messing with stuff of this nature, I prefer zero risk with my hardware, I just take it out the box and plug it in.

    Expecting delivery of my nice X800XT tommorow morning..
     
  29. AML

    AML
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    Fair enough!
    Enjoy your card!
     

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