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Raiders of the Lost Ark on BBC HD

TonyA

Well-known Member
Don't know if anyone else caught Raiders of the Lost Ark on BBC HD tonight, but I was pretty shocked at how bad the print of the film was that was broadcast.

In several scenes towards the top of the screen (mainly in the desert daytime scenes) there was like a blue/grey patch in the sky which was deffo not a cloud!

There were also some scratch/type lines which were highly visible in some of the darker scenes.

Hardly a great showcase of HD!
 

brian s

Distinguished Member
Don't know if anyone else caught Raiders of the Lost Ark on BBC HD tonight, but I was pretty shocked at how bad the print of the film was that was broadcast.

In several scenes towards the top of the screen (mainly in the desert daytime scenes) there was like a blue/grey patch in the sky which was deffo not a cloud!

There were also some scratch/type lines which were highly visible in some of the darker scenes.

Hardly a great showcase of HD!

I don't have Broadcast HD but what you describe sounds pretty bad. I hope the Blu-Ray(we hope) will be much better.

Bri
 

nwgarratt

Distinguished Member
You're joking? In this day and age?

I'll stick with my DVD for now.

:(
Bri

Nope but not sure what it was now. It started of really wide during the titles (same height as non anamorphic widescreen) then went full screen afterwards. I kept going from 16:9 to 4:3 as the aspect ratio just looked weird. At one stage I was watching it on 4:3 letterbox zoom mode !!

edit.
It was 4:3 pan and scan !
 

PoochJD

Distinguished Member
HI,

The print the BBC used, was the same old print from many, many moons ago, that they've always used to show. :rolleyes:

It starts off in 2.35:1, and then by the end of the opening credits, as the plane flies off (with Indy and Jock in it), it pulls-out into 4:3 pan-and-scan, and this was what was aired on both BBC, Freeview and Sky Digital! :eek: :rolleyes: :mad:

Apart from the fact that it was in 4:3, (no excuse in 2008, BBC1), it wasn't a great print (as already mentioned by other posters), and I'm also sure it seemed to be cut in a few places to tone down some of the darker violence, especially when the Ark is opened at the end of the movie, and... Well, I won't spoil it for anyone who's not seen it. ;)

Still, the newly-remastered DVD's come out in June, both on R1 and R2 - all 3 movies, with new picture and full DD5.1 sound, plus 16:9 transfers and with new extras too. And, I hope, the uncut version of Indiana Jones And The Temple Of Doom, for UK viewers! :)

I suspect that "Temple Of Doom" on BBC1 next Sunday, will be cut as per the UK cinema release, and that too will be in 4:3 pan-and-scan, more than likely. :mad:

Hardly the best way to get people into shelling out for the BBC HD channel, if the BBC don't actually tell you which films will be in the proper aspect ratios! :suicide:


Pooch
 

Bill Hicks

Banned
I caught the final 20 minutes last night on SD and the PQ was terrible! And to make it worse it was pan&scan. Don't worry about the eventual bluray version. I can't imagine Spielberg would allow a poor version of one of his most popular & loved films to be released! And remember that the SD Indy box set that was released years ago is as good as any DVD I've seen so far. :smashin:
 

Bealzebub

Standard Member
Have to say, when I caught the beginning of this last night, I though I'd flicked my TV into 4:3 by accident. But the thing that was really stupid about it was that when BBC3 showed them all last month (?), they were full 2:35 widescreen. :rolleyes:
 

Razor

Distinguished Member
I enjoyed watching this movie last night, I didnt think the quality was that bad considering its age. Yes there was a few hairs/scratches visible now and again but the quality was far better than DVD and the aspect ratio was ok on Sky HD.

I thoroughly enjoyed it and it showed up National Treasure 2 which I saw the night before. Anyone know when the next one is on? :)
 
SD was 4:3, and had huge pixels all over the place. The colours were all blending together. Grain as big as tarantulas. Unwatchable.
 

PoochJD

Distinguished Member
Razor,

"Indiana Jones And The Temple Of Doom" is on BBC1 on Sunday 11th May, with "Indiana Jones And The Last Crusade" on BBC1 on the 18th. All films should be on aaround 8pm, give-or-take. However, it would seem that the BBC HD transmissions are in their original aspect ratio (2.35:1 with Dolby 5.1 sound), whereas the terrestrial and regular digital transmissions are in poor old 4:3 pan-and-scan, with just stereo sound (with the exception of "Last Crusade", which should be in 1.85:1 if we're lucky).

Why the BBC doesn't transmit films in 2.35:1 like Channel 4 and Film4, I don't know. Titles like "Raiders..." cry out for full Cinemascope presentation.


Pooch
 

nwgarratt

Distinguished Member
Why the BBC doesn't transmit films in 2.35:1 like Channel 4 and Film4, I don't know. Titles like "Raiders..." cry out for full Cinemascope presentation.


Pooch

I assume to stop people who watch BBC1 complaining why the films don't use all the screen up. I know someone who watched Raiders and didn't even notice it was 4:3 let alone pan and scan.
 

IAN P

Distinguished Member
Have to say, when I caught the beginning of this last night, I though I'd flicked my TV into 4:3 by accident. But the thing that was really stupid about it was that when BBC3 showed them all last month (?), they were full 2:35 widescreen. :rolleyes:

That's because BBC3 is a pretty niche channel at the moment,any 2:35 films shown on BBC1 will generate more complaints than their switchboard could handle.I'm sure there was a similar problem several years ago,thousands of people complained that the black bars were too thick on their tv's,so now the BBC pander to the majority and either pan and scan or only show 1:85 films
 

mikegambit

Banned
I enjoyed watching this movie last night, I didnt think the quality was that bad considering its age. Yes there was a few hairs/scratches visible now and again but the quality was far better than DVD and the aspect ratio was ok on Sky HD.

I thoroughly enjoyed it and it showed up National Treasure 2 which I saw the night before. Anyone know when the next one is on? :)

What do you mean "considering its age"?

35mm film has the quality to enable pictures in excess of our current HD standards- there is no reason for any movie to be anything other than superb except of course cost cutting and simply using a tired old print.

I have films from the 40's and 50's that have been restored from the negatives and they are pristine.

However ,all the Paramount HD masters I've seen including Raiders aswell as The Italian Job and Star Trek movies on Sky all seem to be sourced from substandard prints that would be unacceptable on Bluray.

The scratched prints are likely what was available a few years ago when US tv started its own HD broadcasts and Paramount have not yet remastered these films.

Todays remastering technology is able to supply prints of flawless spotless perfection - hopefully Raiders will be redone before its BD release.

But hats off to BBC for maintaining 2.35:1 on their HD channel - they did it again today with National Treasure.

I wonder if the new dvd of Temple of Doom will be a pointless re-release of the cut version.

Its about time UK fans got to see the directors intended vision
 

allanp

Active Member
I wonder if the new dvd of Temple of Doom will be a pointless re-release of the cut version.

Its about time UK fans got to see the directors intended vision

Spielberg has gone on record to say he actually prefers the cut version we get in this country so it seems unlikely we'll ever see it uncut over here.
 

Razor

Distinguished Member
What do you mean "considering its age"?

35mm film has the quality to enable pictures in excess of our current HD standards- there is no reason for any movie to be anything other than superb except of course cost cutting and simply using a tired old print.

I know film has an infinite res and is allot better than 1080p. ;)

What I meant was surely technology has moved on with filming and older material (say 20 years ago) filmed on top end hardware doesnt look as good as on top end hardware of today. Or has technology stood still in this field for the last 20 years? :)

I find older movies look slightly grainer and seem to have a slightly different look especially in the colour department, to newer big budget movies. :) I never expect an older movie to look as good as a current one.

I actually thought ROTLA looked fairly good, the best I have ever seen it look. :)


I have films from the 40's and 50's that have been restored from the negatives and they are pristine.

I am sure you do.


However ,all the Paramount HD masters I've seen including Raiders aswell as The Italian Job and Star Trek movies on Sky all seem to be sourced from substandard prints that would be unacceptable on Bluray.

I too have seen some of the star trek movies on Sky and they were bad. Very disappointing.
 

Razor

Distinguished Member
Razor,

"Indiana Jones And The Temple Of Doom" is on BBC1 on Sunday 11th May, with "Indiana Jones And The Last Crusade" on BBC1 on the 18th. All films should be on aaround 8pm, give-or-take. However, it would seem that the BBC HD transmissions are in their original aspect ratio (2.35:1 with Dolby 5.1 sound), whereas the terrestrial and regular digital transmissions are in poor old 4:3 pan-and-scan, with just stereo sound (with the exception of "Last Crusade", which should be in 1.85:1 if we're lucky).

Why the BBC doesn't transmit films in 2.35:1 like Channel 4 and Film4, I don't know. Titles like "Raiders..." cry out for full Cinemascope presentation.


Pooch


Cheers Pooch. Thanks for the heads up. :smashin:
 

Bill Hicks

Banned
Spielberg has gone on record to say he actually prefers the cut version we get in this country so it seems unlikely we'll ever see it uncut over here.

What's the difference with the uncut version. Are we talking about the original 1984 US theatrical version that had to be recut due to some excessively gory scenes. Most notably where you see Molan Raam's? hand enter the chest cavity of the guy being sacrificed, and you see him actually pull the victims still beating heart out.
 

allanp

Active Member
What's the difference with the uncut version. Are we talking about the original 1984 US theatrical version that had to be recut due to some excessively gory scenes. Most notably where you see Molan Raam's? hand enter the chest cavity of the guy being sacrificed, and you see him actually pull the victims still beating heart out.

Yes, that's all that is cut in this country as far as I'm aware. A look up on imdb will probably confirm that.
 

mikegambit

Banned
Spielberg has gone on record to say he actually prefers the cut version we get in this country so it seems unlikely we'll ever see it uncut over here.

Unless Spielberg is telling Paramount not to get the film re-certificated I doubt that Paramount will want UK fans to continue to buy the film from any other country except the UK which is what will happen if they persist with the cut version.

Spielberg also prefers the censored and altered version of E.T. - but that didnt stop him from allowing a dvd release of the original version - likewise Close Encounters.
 

mikegambit

Banned
What's the difference with the uncut version. Are we talking about the original 1984 US theatrical version that had to be recut due to some excessively gory scenes. Most notably where you see Molan Raam's? hand enter the chest cavity of the guy being sacrificed, and you see him actually pull the victims still beating heart out.

No - its got quite a few cuts.

The original theatrical version thats available worldwide had to be cut in the UK for a PG.

Apart from the main cut being where you see the hand going into the body to rip the heart out ,and then pulling it out , there are many other cuts with reductions of screaming and gore in other scenes including where the man is lowered into the pit -another scene where Short Round is whipped and Indie uses the word "bastard" and little snips here and there.

I dont believe the uncut version has ever been aired in the UK.

The video/dvd has always been cut and AFAIK when it has been aired its always been on at 8pm or earlier so even the PG version would be cut on ITV as they do with other PG films.

Its only in the last couple of years that ITV and the BBC have grown up regarding showing films uncut .

For decades ITV have censored the Bond films but they now often show uncut versions in the afternoon of movies they used to edit for 8pm screenings - although that by no means covers all the Bond films - Diamonds Are Forever for a start.
 

mikegambit

Banned
It has been shown uncut on TV. I have a recorded version from years ago with that scene intact.

But are the other cut bits intact?

Does your recording come from Filmnet?
 

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