Public perception - assaulted at work

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Warriors2010, Jul 21, 2018.

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  1. Warriors2010

    Warriors2010
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    An incident at work on Thursday morning, has genuinely left me perplexed and wondering what the public perception is, when a Police officer is assaulted and subsequently injured on duty.

    Without going into the details of an ongoing investigation, the above happened to me and as a result I am now sat at home, in a leg brace, with badly damaged ACL, medial and lateral ligament damage to my knee, which will see me off work for a minimum of 8-12 weeks. I will probably also need surgery to correct the damage.

    Whilst in hospital yesterday, one of the nursing staff commented “ah well, it’s all part of the job isn’t it!” which, coming from an emergency services colleague, pissed me off to say the least! This got me thinking- is that what people genuinely think? That’s is acceptable for Police officers to be assaulted because “it’s part of the job” This isn’t the first time I’ve heard this sort of comment, when colleagues have been hurt previously and it really does annoy me to think that people (not all obviously) think it is acceptable. Would that same person have said the same had it been a paramedic/firefighter/school teacher?

    We all do the job knowing that there’s an element of risk and that, occasionally, people will get hurt/injured, however this incident was not an “accident”, it was viscous and deliberate assault. If anyone else was assaulted/injured at work, for example in a shop/office/factory etc, would the public perception be the same?
     
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  2. BB3Lions

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    I guess it is sorry to hear & say. Like all frontline services, you know the risks when you sign up.
     
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  3. DemonAV

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    Well I would have thought that being a police officer would put you more in risk of danger compared to say a paramedic. As being a fireman holds more risk to life than being a ambulance driver? I just hope that the total **** who assaulted you gets more than a slap on the wrist for assaulting a police officer than I susspect he will? Heres to a speedy recovery.
     
  4. nheather

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    You are not going to like this but you did ask for my perception.

    So I would say that it is a known risk because of the nature of the job. Police are issued with batons and restraints - why is that, because there is a risk that they are going to have to deal with violent and dangerous people.

    In the same way I perceive that soldiers have a calculated risk of being injured or killed in combat, or that firemen have a calculated risk of burn, smoke and fall injuries.

    So every job has calculated risks, some may be high some miniscule. Someone who drives for a living has an increased risk of a road accident.

    Nurses have a risk that some people that are brought into hospital are in an irrational state and may suffer physical or verbal abuse as a result.

    Teachers have a risk of verbal abuse from both students and their parents and they just have to suck it up.

    So not saying that it is right, just that if you looked at the risk assessment for the job you would see that there is a higher probability of that type of incident than with other professions.

    Cheers,

    Nigel
     
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  5. MrFraggle

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    Obviously it is totally unacceptable for anyone to encounter violence at work and I hope you make a full recovery.
    Being a police officer can mean you are going to be put in situations where violence is a real possibility and unfortunately you might well be hurt, but surely you knew this before embarking on this career?
     
  6. ufo550

    ufo550
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    As an ex police officer, I was assaulted on several occasions, but never as seemingly serious as your injuries.

    Whilst I agree with the views given by those that police officers should accept the possibility of injury, due to the nature of work, I cannot agree assault on police is anyway acceptable.

    An assault on a police officer, is not just an assault on an individual, but an assault on the law and our institution or way of life.

    There is an offence of assault on police, but carries a lessor penalty than ABH. Hence it is little used.
     
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  7. Desmo

    Desmo
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    Is it acceptable? Of course not. But surely it IS all part of the job?

    You're doing a job that is high risk so the chance of injury is going to be higher.

    Thank you for what you do. It must be hard to remember, but the large majority of the country appreciate what you do :)
     
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  8. Liquid101

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    I don’t think anybody would define it as ‘acceptable’ but as a police officer you must see it as an accepted risk.

    Don’t criminals get harsher sentences for assaulting police officers? Doesn’t this tell you that it’s less ‘acceptable’ than assaulting a civilian?

    Anyway, sorry to hear what’s happened. I assume that the police force has pretty good benefits for people who are injured in the line of duty, or need to retire early?
     
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  9. Ste7en

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    It IS part of the job I'm afraid. That goes for all emergency services.

    But I would NEVER say it is acceptable.
     
  10. DemonAV

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    Buy yourself a PS4 and some decent games and kick back (no pun intended) whilst you're recovering :)
     
  11. ufo550

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    Common assault, maximum penalty 6mths imprisonment.
    Assault on police, maximum penalty 6mths imprisonment.
     
  12. dannius

    dannius
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    It just sounds like someone making light of a bad situation to me. I doubt they believe it is in any way acceptable.
     
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  13. ufo550

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  14. Liquid101

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    Assaulting a police officer - InBrief.co.uk

     
  15. Tempest

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    I'm sorry, but I have to agree with the general mood here.

    Should it happen no, but is this type of thing to be expected if you are willing to take on such a role, yes.
    Or rather, you know, almost 100% as a police officer at some point you will get physically attached by another human being thru rage or alcohol or both etc, and that should be easy to understand.

    How that attach pans out, well, in the lap of the gods, and how well you defend yourself, but if you don't wish to be place in that position, you don't become a police officer.

    Or as has been said a fireman getting burned, or a soldier getting shot, or a bomb disposal person getting blown to 1000 pieces (which is a bit hard to claim for if it goes wrong!)

    So, yes, full sympathy, and I'm sure any attacker will get punished and you will get preferential treatment/money in your position as opposed to someone else with the same injury.

    However, as said, if you don't want to fall off and hurt yourself, you don't train as a trapeze artist.
     
  16. ufo550

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    You need to understand the definitions of both offences. If you tap someone on the shoulder or even they just think you are going to, is common assault.

    Assault on police, includes wilful obstruction etc. You'll see from the petition I posted and the MOD responce, the guidelines for sentencing for this offence, has a starting point of 12 weeks, so their argument is this offences is taken more seriously. But the maximum penalty, is still the same as common assault.

    Whenever I was assaulted (not tapped on the shoulder), offences of ABH or even GBH were often used, as they carry a higher maximum penalty. Most arrests invariably end up, with some form of resistance and assault on the arresting officer, but only the primary offences are only ever charged, in the most part.
    Causing an injury to a police, acting in the execution of his/her duty, warrants a higher maximum penalty than ABH or GBH IMO.

    Its all part of the job :D
     
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  17. hippo99

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    It’s a pity that ‘getting your arse kicked in’ can’t just be considered as ‘all part of the job’ for burglars/muggers etc :)
     
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  18. Derek S-H

    Derek S-H
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    Yes.

    Police officers routinely have to deal with aggressive and violent people who may carry weapons, at least you have batons and restraints to aid you, other emergency services' workers aren't afforded that luxury.

    Another possible factor is that people tend to see the uniform and what it represents, rather than the person wearing it. And no, of course it's not acceptable, but I take that nurse's comment as a sign of empathy: that nobody wants it but the risk comes with the role and it's a higher risk at that.

    Get well soon and I hope your assailant receives the maximum available sentence.
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2018
  19. Matt_C

    Matt_C
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    Obviously I wasn't there so can't comment on the context/tone of what was said, but purely going on what you've written it didn't sound like the nurse was saying it's acceptable, but more that it's understandable. There's a big difference between acceptable and understandable.
     
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  20. Bl4ckGryph0n

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    Assault is never acceptable for anyone, I agree. Ideally people should behave themselves but if they did then we wouldn't need the police ;)

    Perhaps you are in the wrong job if you thought you can do that by asking nicely and drinking a cup of tea together. Then again that might be the way if Corbyn ever gets into power, as that is what he'd suggests we do with terrorists as well.

    And no, to me the public perception isn't the same for a shop worker. Their job doesn't entail law enforcement. It would have been the same as me trying to argue that when I joined the army I shouldn't get shot.
     
  21. Bl4ckGryph0n

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    I wouldn't say it is part of the job for all emergency services. I saw so many ambulance crews getting attacked, or fire crews getting pelted. I can't say that I would see it as an expecting risk when all you do is help save people. Slightly different than the police in my opinion.
     
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  22. Thug

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    Assault on police is an outright offence in itself and doesn't have any 'tiers' to it, so a tap on the shoulder is the same as a broken leg. The offence is 'assaulting a police officer in their lawful execution of their duty' (so they have to be doing a lawful act for police purposes). A court will sentence in accordance with their guidelines for 'that' offence (although they could use a gravity factor to influence their decision, like the person being provoked or the level of injuries).

    Where other assaults come in many levels like Sec 39 (common), sec 47 (ABH), sec 18 (intended GBH), sec 20 (unintended GBH) *, manslaughter, murder etc. The court has a lot more guidance when it comes to sentencing for these offences.
    That is why they will usually go with the assault in itself, rather than the assault police.

    I agree that there doesn't appear to be any back-up for police who are assaulted and the criminal knows this. If sentences were harsher then maybe they would not be as many assaults as there are now.
    Body warn video has reduced it significantly, but it still happens.

    Being a police officer is a unique job than any other, where if there is danger and everyone else is running away the police will run towards it.
    This obviously increases the risk of injury to the officer, and very much not acceptable.
    The problem is, its only going to get worse due to dangerously low numbers.

    In my local town it was deemed that the safe minimum limit of officers on at any one time was 35, they regularly turn out 23.

    * unintended GBH could be someone who has hit someone not intended much harm, but as a result that have received GBH injuries. For instance, someone pushes someone just to get them away from them. That person falls over and ruptures their spleen.
     
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  23. ufo550

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    A interesting way of describing Sec. 20, unintended?

    My last area policing was in a market town & surrounding areas, with a population of approx. 40,000. I've known it policed by two officers, but we are getting slightly off topic :)
     
  24. McVicar

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    8-12 consecutive weeks off work minimum? Damn, everyone will think you're a school teacher!

    Hope your recovery goes well OP.
     
  25. arenaman

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    I was the victim of a section 20 GBH once, broken leg when I got pushed over, the offender got 200hrs community service, it's a joke
     
  26. leamspaceman

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    @Warriors2010 I think you're struggling to differentiate 'small talk' from what somebody actually thinks.

    The comment from the member of nursing staff was just that... 'small talk.'

    It worries me that something as inconsequential as that pissed you off and led you to believe, or even consider, that people think it's okay to be assaulted.

    I've experienced police officers who take innocent comments the wrong way and get all heavy handed and inflame situations rather than diffuse them. It's like they take it personally and I would have thought it would be a requirement of the police that they could rise above such remarks?

    Of course it isn't right or acceptable to be assaulted and injured in the way you have been.

    However, you should really have the skills and emotional intelligence to be able to understand what are and are not throwaway comments and to not let such innocent remarks piss you off. Could that not cloud your judgement and influence your actions whilst carrying out your police duties?

    I'm not sure what social and behavioural training the police have in order to instill such knowledge though?

    And you could have challenged the member of nursing staff about their comment if it really upset you that much.

    Having said that, upsetting the person who controls your morphine dosage probably wouldn't be wise.

    Get well soon...
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2018
  27. Thug

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    It was in layman’s terms :smashin:

    Market towns are way different to cities or larger towns, especially those of deprivation and high unemployment and high in the toxic three (drugs. Alcohol and mental health).
    However I know what you mean, it only takes a few people to make a police officers job WAY more difficult.
     
  28. Tempest

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    Perhaps a few officers like this on the beat would deal with situations a little easier ;)

    Ronnie Coleman if you wish to Google him....

    [​IMG]
     
  29. IronGiant

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    I bet he can run fast :facepalm:
     
  30. ufo550

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    We had someone like that, didn't want to get into conflict, least it ruined his 'guns'. All muscle and no content.
     
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