PS5

HMTB

Active Member
Twice the thickness of the PS4 Pro is not ideal for me. I was already slightly put off by the X Series' size but will wait and see what the final look and size of the thing is. I also don't really fancy a big white box if that's what colour the PS5 is going to be.

I'd expect to get the PS5 as soon as possible/as soon as I can get hold of one, though might wait and see what the X looks like and how powerful it is relative to the PS5 before committing to that. I like my Xbox One X and PS4 Pro so not against getting both, but I'm unlikely to get both at launch (never say never). However, if they're both massive, it may just have to be the PS5 until the X releases a slimmer version* especially if I can play the new Halo game on the Xbox One X (which I expect I will).

*I appreciate I'll be the first to whinge if the consoles are noisy! I'm certainly not one for making things as slim as possible though.

Regarding price, I'd expect they'll both be around £450-500.
 

Nemesis X2

Distinguished Member
That was one component, but that’s like the new SSD then in the PS5, it’s said to be prohibitively expensive to make especially the custom controller. I doubt we’ll know for several months though with the way Sony’s going,e
The Blu Ray drive in the PS3 and the SSD in the PS5 are miles apart when it comes to financial implications for the hardware. Blu Ray was brand new tech they'd spent insane amounts developing and had to win the HD format war for the long term gain so took huge hits on each console. As mentioned stanalone players were over £1000. The SSD although cutting edge re speeds etc is tech thats already widely available and produced by multiple companies and prices at levels highlighted which are nothing compared to Blu Ray at the time of PS3.
 

Desmo

Distinguished Member
I don't really care how big it is... I'll be looking at the TV and not staring at a mahoosive box.
 

apolloa

Distinguished Member
The Blu Ray drive in the PS3 and the SSD in the PS5 are miles apart when it comes to financial implications for the hardware. Blu Ray was brand new tech they'd spent insane amounts developing and had to win the HD format war for the long term gain so took huge hits on each console. As mentioned stanalone players were over £1000. The SSD although cutting edge re speeds etc is tech thats already widely available and produced by multiple companies and prices at levels highlighted which are nothing compared to Blu Ray at the time of PS3.
The SSD does not exist, thats the same as saying bluerays did because they used disks. The SSD is totally new and completely custom and you cannot buy anything like it on the market. It's been reported as expensive to make. It will have an impact on the console cost for sure.
 

apolloa

Distinguished Member
You can buy a 1 TB NVME that makes use of PCIE 4.0 for around £150 so dont think it will be as huge a price as some may think. These were the requirements i'm sure from that road to PS5 video. I'm sure its not just an off the shelf type component but they did say that they will let us know.
It's a totally new different device, you cannot buy anything like it on the market. It's totally custom to the console, is heavily integrated into its architecture, and faster then anything else on the market by a significant amount, its the number one component every developer has been raving about, because of it's speed. You cannot buy anything like it for £150.
 

Nemesis X2

Distinguished Member
It's a totally new different device, you cannot buy anything like it on the market. It's totally custom to the console, is heavily integrated into its architecture, and faster then anything else on the market by a significant amount, its the number one component every developer has been raving about, because of it's speed. You cannot buy anything like it for £150.
The SSD interacts with the system architecture, the architecture itself isn't part of the SSD. If it was you wouldn't be able to buy a range of independant drives as expandable storage once they are approved by Sony. The drives will use a bay slot and interact with the system architecture, just like the internal drive does.

The actual type of drives are available and although the PS5's is faster than most im sure i heard Linus Tech Tips pointed out on his channel there are already faster ones in the PC space.

Regardless, my point was regarding the comparable cost impact to the console and its still not even close to the Blu Ray in PS3. Thats just a fact.
 

Lancia34

Distinguished Member
The SSD interacts with the system architecture, the architecture itself isn't part of the SSD. If it was you wouldn't be able to buy a range of independant drives as expandable storage once they are approved by Sony. The drives will use a bay slot and interact with the system architecture, just like the internal drive does.

The actual type of drives are available and although the PS5's is faster than most im sure i heard Linus Tech Tips pointed out on his channel there are already faster ones in the PC space.

Regardless, my point was regarding the comparable cost impact to the console and its still not even close to the Blu Ray in PS3. Thats just a fact.
Was going to say the same. The SSD is nothing special or different it’s the way they’ve integrated it into the motherboard and the access speeds, eliminating several logical layers to make it more efficient (or something along those lines).
 

zt1903

Distinguished Member
It's a totally new different device, you cannot buy anything like it on the market. It's totally custom to the console, is heavily integrated into its architecture, and faster then anything else on the market by a significant amount, its the number one component every developer has been raving about, because of it's speed. You cannot buy anything like it for £150.
You or I can’t buy one for £150, at least not right now. But we will be able to eventually.

Of course Sony, who are buying tens of millions of them ......
 

Cha1ky

Member
It's a totally new different device, you cannot buy anything like it on the market. It's totally custom to the console, is heavily integrated into its architecture, and faster then anything else on the market by a significant amount, its the number one component every developer has been raving about, because of it's speed. You cannot buy anything like it for £150.
The drives that Sony talked about on the video are PCIE 4.0 M.2 NVME Drives. Which you CAN currently buy. But they have said to hold off until they compile a list of compatible ones, which he said would they would work on after launch.

Here's a load of them on Scan right now.


1tb drive for £170 on Amazon


These drives are hitting around the 5GB/s and the PS5 drive was said to hit around 5.5GB/s.

1591137516012.png


These prices will be dropping and the drives will improve. So I think at launch 1TB for around £150 should be doable.
 

silvercue

Distinguished Member
It's a totally new different device, you cannot buy anything like it on the market. …..You cannot buy anything like it for £150.
It has been posted many times that you can buy these drives and have been able to for many months. They are Gen 4.0 NVME drives. That is exactly what they are. SONY have said they will get faster R/W speeds from them, by 10%, due to how they are integrated. They will be able to get other advantages building a complete system around them. But they are not totally new and price is not far from £150. The one in my PC has a throughput of 5 GB/s

What will be totally new is game design starting from a point that these will be in all the machines and they can therefore design a game around the advantages this will bring. That is what people need to be excited about.
 

Phil1975

Distinguished Member
It's a totally new different device, you cannot buy anything like it on the market. It's totally custom to the console, is heavily integrated into its architecture, and faster then anything else on the market by a significant amount, its the number one component every developer has been raving about, because of it's speed. You cannot buy anything like it for £150.
Don’t agree with all of your posts but your 100% correct on this one.
There’s no off the shelf SSD that matches PS5’s spec available to buy yet.
Don’t think we will see one for a few months..maybe later due to COVID-19.


Edit ..however there are some posted above that get very close..!
 

zt1903

Distinguished Member
Mark Cerny himself said in the Road to PS5 presentation that there were currently no drives available that were fast enough but that he expected these to be available by launch or shortly after.

The relevant section starts around 20:45 and runs for about 3 mins.

 

Toasty

Distinguished Member
While we wait to see if this whole SSD thing bears fruit, its great that console generations still find innovations to make themselves relevant in the market place and genuinely push gaming forward each time.

I've seen that Cerny presentation twice now, first time felt like a lecture, but held some interest. Second time through the developers eyes and the philosophy of balancing evolution with revolution should see PS5 and gaming in a good place going forward..
 

Lancia34

Distinguished Member
Don’t agree with all of your posts but your 100% correct on this one.
There’s no off the shelf SSD that matches PS5’s spec available to buy yet.
Don’t think we will see one for a few months..maybe later due to COVID-19.


Edit ..however there are some posted above that get very close..!
Yes nothing that matches the speed but that's due to how it is architectured into the motherboard itself. The actual SSD side of this is not revolutionary or "brand new" it's how they are using it that is completely unique and the key to their whole next gen plan.
Unless PC manufacturers start creating motherboards with integrated SSDs, which is highly unlikely as PCs are meant for building with separate parts, then we won't see anything like that on PC and those speeds won't be achievable for some time to come.
 

zt1903

Distinguished Member
The SSD is going to be the biggest most obvious benefit for the quality of our gaming experience, even just the instant respawn after death, the lack of loading screens in RPGs, fast travel that's actually fast, being able to instantly slip between worlds. And even though that's just the stuff that's easy to imagine, we'll have improvements in so many other ways too. I can't wait.
 

zt1903

Distinguished Member
What Cerny said in the link above was that:
- at the time of the Wired article there were only PCIE 3.0 consumer drives out there and that they saturate at 3 GB/s
- PS5 drive achieves 5.5 GB/s
- because of differences in flash controller (e.g. for prioritisation) and that PS5 will have to compensate for that then the SSDs used for expansion need to be a bit faster than the PS5 drive
- PCIE 4.0 drives are now becoming available and by the end of the year they would expect to see drives that saturate PCIE 4.0 i.e. 7 GB/s
- they will tell us which drives are compatible based on speed and physical size.
 

steviedr

Distinguished Member
PS5 will basically have less bottlenecks, the custom hardware is the key (or at least that's what I've taken from it). I cant say I fully understand the custom I/O unit but it sounds pretty cool.
 

Toasty

Distinguished Member
On the flipside, loading screens are the only way I learn the controls, I'll just end up constantly dying as I won't know what I did wrong :blush:
 

steviedr

Distinguished Member
On the flipside, loading screens are the only way I learn the controls, I'll just end up constantly dying as I won't know what I did wrong :blush:
And when you get to a certain age....quick toilet breaks !
 

iwb100

Distinguished Member
PS5 will basically have less bottlenecks, the custom hardware is the key (or at least that's what I've taken from it). I cant say I fully understand the custom I/O unit but it sounds pretty cool.
Bottlenecks in terms of loading data sure. But they will have more bottlenecks in terms of GPU processing. So - ray tracing - the newest graphical innovation - is heavily tied to CU count. So whilst Sony may have reduced some bottlenecks in some areas - they still have the issue of GPU being the biggest overhead!
 

FadgewackeR

Distinguished Member
Bottlenecks in terms of loading data sure. But they will have more bottlenecks in terms of GPU processing. So - ray tracing - the newest graphical innovation - is heavily tied to CU count. So whilst Sony may have reduced some bottlenecks in some areas - they still have the issue of GPU being the biggest overhead!
Yup, somewhere... there is always a bottle neck. Last gen was the CPU. It'll be interesting to see how the 10.2tf GPU capability stands up, and how many other processes could be done by other parts of the system (tempest for example) allowing the GPU to be loaded as heavily as possible.

Full ray tracing, it'll always be a step behind the SeX, but as UE5 demo showed, there are other ways of achieving similarly striking results. Exciting times to see how both units play out.
 

apolloa

Distinguished Member
The SSD chips are not available yet, they are incredibly fast. But it’s the controller and how that integrates that’s not on any other system, the compression system it uses, the 12 if I remember paths it uses double any other SSD. It’s all about bandwidth and it has a massive amount available directly to the CPU, also I believe cache memory has been placed very close to the CPU to further reduce bottleneck and increase performance.
So no you can’t buy an off the shelf SSD and expect it to perform the same UNLESS the machine your plugging it into is exactly the same as the PS5, that includes any PCIE 4 drive, none of which you can buy that are as fast fact, not till an estimated end of this year, it Sony said I think they don’t expect the performance to match then, if I remember they said the SSD plug in drive needs to be faster then the built in one? To be able to match the same overall performance otherwise the performance will suffer. I’m going from memory here,

But if you still believe the SSD drive is the same as any other off the shelf one, just a little faster, I suggest you watch Cerneys explanation again closely and pay attention to what he’s saying, then go and read what all those devs have said about it.

FYI it’s the new totally custom SSD controller chip Sony has made that is going to expensive, because it is a first and next gen, the only way to beat its performance really is to spend thousands on storage arrays like what google or amazon use, or Facebook, proper high end enterprise kit using multiple drives.

But I doubt a PC will be able to be as quick for some time, because they may offer fast drives but will lack the new controller and it’s full integration into the system.
 

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