ps3 blu ray fuzziness

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by chris0101, Apr 24, 2007.

  1. chris0101

    chris0101
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    im not suer if this is the TV or the player, on the HD blu ray discs like casino royal etc, on faces sometimes i get this fuzziness, or soemtimes in tehbackgound,

    anyone know what tyhats about
     
  2. Naqv

    Naqv
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    What resolution have you got the PS3 setup as? and what resolution does your tv support? 720p (1366x768) or 1080p (1920x1080)

    If your tv supports 720p (most likely, in the UK anyway) then set your PS3 as 1080i, otherwise you will get a crap picture (may seem fuzziness).
     
  3. bishman

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    720p is 1280 X 720.

    But naqv is right when he says that you need to output 1080 from the PS3 to get the best out of blu-ray. The PS3 can't scale the image, so if you have your PS3 set to 720, then 1080 image from the blu-ray will actually be output at standard def!

    Setting to 1080i will mean you see a much better picture, if you aren't set to that already.
     
  4. chris0101

    chris0101
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    i have a 1080p TV, it looks fine sometimes, but say in jame bond at the begining when its in black and white, tehres a fuzznewss on threr faces
     
  5. jamieuk23

    jamieuk23
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    I wonder if its the player or actually blue ray my self :confused:
     
  6. chris0101

    chris0101
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    do you get this affect also?
     
  7. mattym

    mattym
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    it could be noise showing, like lots of little dots, i didnt notice much noise at all while watching CR, whereas something like SWAT has a bit of noise in the darker scenes
     
  8. chris0101

    chris0101
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    ye thats what it is , lots of little dots
     
  9. Huddo

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    Yep don't worry I get that also.



    Huddo
     
  10. chris0101

    chris0101
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    o right thats gd to hear lol

    is there no way to reduce this? or will it be settings to play with under my TV menu :)
     
  11. MAW

    MAW
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    What TV is it? If it's a Sony W or X, it's the display.
     
  12. hottstuff

    hottstuff
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    This is grain that can be artificially imposed on the master , by the director for eg.
    Goodfellas is one movie where you will see it as part of the recording process.
     
  13. chris0101

    chris0101
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    i have a Sharp LC-42XD1E
     
  14. MAW

    MAW
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    Not seen a 1080 source with one of those. The opening scenes of CR are grainy, later on it should be crisper though. You should probably tick the 576, 720 and 1080i boxes. If this is done, all you can do it try the settings on the TV. LCD is notorious for not being all it's cracked up to be, though with a clean source like the PS3, it should be OK. Just got in from playing with one on another 1080p panel, it was really good. TH65PF9 Panasonic, a bit big for most of us!
     
  15. chris0101

    chris0101
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    ye its grainy at the begining its fine through the rest of the movie tho
    :thumbsup:
     
  16. Stephen Wilde

    Stephen Wilde
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    Going by Sky HD there's a lot of deliberate graininess in many shows.

    There is some 'artistic' impression amongst Directors and Producers that it adds to atmosphere and makes drama more 'gritty'.

    I find it highly annoying and a waste of the potential of HD and the equipment required to display it.

    In Battlestar Galactica for instance one can go from a crystal clear scene to a grainy scene and back many times in quick succession.

    Also fuzziness in parts of a scene can arise where there is a shallow camera focus targeted on a specific dramatically important part of the scene. The fuzziness of the out of focus areas is much more noticeable in HD. You don't really notice it in SD.

    The whole process of producing HD material is still highly experimental and thus very variable.

    No point losing sleep over it.
     
  17. cheesegoduk

    cheesegoduk
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    ya its probally just film grain. What bugs me the most is that even films recorded digitality seem to get it added in post production because as the above poster says, it's more "gritty" apparently. One of the advantages of HD is crystal clear picture and then they go and ruin it by adding grain.

    It bugs me because just because it was always there on shows recorded on film doesn't mean they have to keep it now. Its like adding laugh tracks to sitcom's because its the done thing even tho it annoys a lot of people.

    ya that bugged me a lot, especially on the last esp of the second season. I know the show is shot in HD so why add it?
     
  18. CarlB

    CarlB
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    Why should a show only be 'hyper-real' just because it is shot in HD? Film itself is much higher resolution than our current HD standards, and yet directors have always chosen different film stock to achieve different 'looks' to meet their artistic needs in each given film. It's an artistic choice chosen to create a mood, and I'd prefer if the director was spending the time on making those choices, rather than thinking how best to present the image to really impress my friends six months down the line.

    If all HD programmes only exhibited one look then it would be extremely dull in my opinion.

    If we track this opinion back through the ages then we would never have had Impressionism, because those images were hardly realistic. But with the same tools Vermeer could knock you up an amazingly photo-realistic portrait given half a chance. Not sure I'd say Monet was rubbish though, for not making his images clean and realistic.

    It's just choices, and I want choices. I certainly don't want every HD programme or film looking as clean as the latest Pixar movie. That's a big step backwards in my book.

    To me the advantage of HD was never 'crystal clear images', but a chance to get closer to the original representation of the movie or programme. If that presentation includes grain, then bring it on.
     
  19. mattym

    mattym
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    grain is part of an image with digital and film cameras also, digital cameras can have more grain than film, except with digital cameras its noise, clever processing lessons it. Im not sure that removing the grain is the right thing to do, as it detracts fromt he original intention in some cases
     
  20. Stephen Wilde

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    I don't accept that 'grain' is necessary for artistic reasons. You don't see grain through the eyes unless there is something wrong with them. The effects sought can be better created by intelligent use of lighting and colour.

    It's probably a fashionable hangover from pre HD filming techniques and may die away in due course.

    Also it seems to be used most in dark scenes which makes me wonder if there is a technical reason for it. However I've seen plenty of dark HD scenes without grain.
     
  21. CarlB

    CarlB
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    No, you don't see grain through your eyes but why must the image reflect what you see through your eyes? That was kinda my point. It's not *necessary* for artistic reasons, but it's an artistic *choice*, in the same way that B&W may be another artistic choice.
     
  22. hottstuff

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    Also some cameras would naturally introduce grain , especially in darker scenes , the viper camera system used on Collateral & Miami Vice for eg , although very fine , did introduce grain as an artefact.
    But it actually added to the directors "artistic" trait.
     
  23. mattym

    mattym
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    digital camera grain is noise caused by interfence between the receptors of of the sensor or something, the dark areas of a photo show it up more, and the same is true of digital video
     
  24. jj_glos

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    Could you clarify that? Is is just an issue with the PS3, to do with HDMI connection, BluRay etc? I've got a 40W2000 and it is pretty noisy with playback from the PS3. However it's much better with the 360\HD DVD connected via VGA, it doesn't exhibit anywhere near the amount of noise. Problem I have at the moment is that I only have a few BluRay discs and none of them are the same as anything I have on HD-DVD for comparison... I have picked up Poseidon and World Trade Centre, only had a quick look at Poseidon but the pic quality looked fine.

    I found the SD DVD playback on the PS3 very noisy as well but fine on my standalone and 360.

    I was under the impression HDMI cables were much of a muchness? The one i have was bundled with the system, is it worth paying out for a decent cable?
     
  25. Avi

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    I notices some weird stuff on Casion Royale BD that appear to be the source-

    http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=503074

    AVI
     
  26. Sasso Palmieri

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    Digitial (SD or HD) cameras have a lower resolution than film. Lenses introduce distortion into the image, too. With celluloid, it's grain, digital, it's noise. What several digital cameras do is emulate the look of film. Part of the peception of film - along with depth-of-field, motion, cadence and gamma response - is its grain. Footage shot in darker environments rely on faster (more sensitive) stock, which has larger grain, ergo; it's far more noticeable than scenes shot in, say, strong, direct sunlight.

    The eyes can exhibit similar effects (cones versus rods, as night falls). Have a look at a complex pattern in, say a carpet, and stare at it. You'll see it then. Use your eyes in near-darkness and you'll see it even more - the 'quality' will be poor but the brain compensates by introducing information that isn't there to fill the image out - it's the body's natural error-correction system.

    Overall, after a hundred years of film-making, many have come to accept something which is essentially a limitation of the medium (grain) as being part of the aesthetic. As a film-maker, I like grain but appreciate why viewers may not.
     
  27. Stephen Wilde

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    That explains the technical reason for the existence of grain especially in dark scenes.

    It also seems to confirm that it is part of the aesthetic as a hangover from the past limitations of the medium.

    Hopefully it will die out.

    Still, how is it that we often see dark HD scenes without grain ?
     
  28. rnicoll

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    Which is fairly crazy, IMHO. The PS3 should happily downscale 1080p to 720p, even if it just doesn't show on pixel in three on the final output. It would be better than the TV dropping one pixel in three horizontally, and having to guess one pixel in 6 vertically.
     
  29. Avi

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    Maybe the same reason Sony chose not to upscale SD DVD. :)

    AVI
     
  30. HugoFJH

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    I actually like the grain effect in Casino Royale (it worked in Black Hawk Down also even though I didnt like the film itself) , in the artistic sense it works for me even though it wasnt necessary to have it there

    I can see why people dont like it (especially on a hd source) - it was of course evident in the cinema release, but there are without doubt some BR releases which look fabulous (Open Season, The Wild)
     

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