Projector upgrade: Sony VPL-VW790ES vs JVC DLNA-N7

tomdfrost

Active Member
I'm currently running a Sony VPL-VW260ES, had it for about 3 years and put 1200 hours into it, but I'm in the mood for an upgrade. I'm split between the Sony VPL-VW790ES and the JVC DLA-N7 and I'm hoping you guys can settle it for me.

My usage is pretty evenly split between films, tv, and gaming, with a bit of PC desktop use. All done on a PC or Playstation 5. My biggest reason for upgrading is that my current projector doesn't support [email protected] so I pretty much don't view HDR content at the moment. I know this is a minority opinion but I can't stand watching films at 24fps, my brain just focusses on the judder, and I have no problem with any soap opera effect, so I upsample everything to 60fps with SVP (since the current projector doesn't support motionplus at 4k).

My room is pretty good for light control, blacked out windows, grey walls and carpet, black ceiling. Screen is 3m wide and I sit just over 4m from screen when gaming or watching films, or around 1.5m from it when using it as a pc desktop

As I understand it here are the facts I have gathered:

VPL-VW790ES Pros
Laser produces a more stable image.
3D doesn't require any extra hardware.
I'm used to a Sony projector so there's probably less of a learning curve.
Appears to have slightly lower input lag than the JVC.

VPL-VW790ES Cons
More expensive.
DTM solution seems to have mixed reviews. This might not be relevant to me since I'll use MadVR on the PC to do tone mapping.

JVC DLA-N7 Pros
Cheaper.
Black levels sound really good.
Appears to have a proper PC mode, whereas I don't think the Sony does.
Gets firmware updates that actually add features.

JVC DLA-N7 Cons
This projector has been out for years and I feel like it's a bit late to be getting on board with something so old.
It sounds like it's pot luck how well the projector can focus individual pixels. Since I use the projector as a windows desktop from under 2 meters away this is a big concern.
Physical connectors are at the back instead of the side, which will make my life slightly more difficult.

Have I missed anything? And has anyone out there had any issues with either of these projectors that might effect me?
Thanks for your input!
 

jakimp

Distinguished Member
I'm not too sure your cons for the N7 are too accurate

the N7 has been out for about 2 years not "years" and is not old tech. the Sony is basically the exact same machine as a 760ES with a firmware tweak that will not really benefit you as a MadVR user. you may be as well with a pre owned 760?

not sure where you got the focus info from as my N5 seems next to perfect on all test patterns

concern about SXRD panel degradation? have sony cured that yet?

i know my calibrator is a big fan of the sony but you can buy several bulbs for the significant amount more that the sony costs and overall i think the JVC will cast the better image

however this is one with no bad option to be taken as i bet you will love whichever one you choose
 

tomdfrost

Active Member
I think I bought my last projector when it was a couple of years old and the next model came out a few months later with features I really wanted so I'm cautious of not doing it again. I can't see any news of a sequel to the N7 coming out soon, but knowing my luck it's bound to happen!

I did look at the 760ES, but that's more expensive than the 790ES so it wasn't really on my radar. I'll be buying through the a business so can get the VAT back, so second hand isn't really an option.

The focus issues I read about on the owners thread, it sounds like not everyone has the problem, but there was another PC user on there that had issues getting it pixel sharp on text in the desktop, they posted photos of it looking very blurry. Which is fine for movies at a distance, but not desktop use up close.

I haven't read anything about the SXRD panel degradation, what's that all about?

Have you had much experience of laser vs lamp? I'm seeing people saying the laser makes a big difference to image "solidness", but it's hard to know if people have only seen one or the other to compare.
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
lets just review the below, red edits and additions :)

VPL-VW790ES Pros
Laser produces a more stable image. Meh....
3D doesn't require any extra hardware. both need the glasses ? jvc emitter is small bucks
I'm used to a Sony projector so there's probably less of a learning curve. get used to it
Appears to have slightly lower input lag than the JVC. Meh..
No bulbs to replace


VPL-VW790ES Cons
More expensive. sure is, price difference buys a lot of bulbs
DTM solution seems to have mixed reviews. This might not be relevant to me since I'll use MadVR on the PC to do tone mapping. Lets be clear Sony has no DTM
No p3 filter

Plastic lens elements
the noise of these is really irritating - kind modulating noise of the laser


JVC DLA-N7 Pros
Cheaper.
Black levels sound really good.
Appears to have a proper PC mode, whereas I don't think the Sony does.
Gets firmware updates that actually add features.
Dynamic tone Mapping
Finer interpixel gap
more film like rather than digital processed look of sony
P3 colour filter for 100% of p3 colour space


JVC DLA-N7 Cons
This projector has been out for years 2 years and I feel like it's a bit late to be getting on board with something so old. the sony has actually been out for years, many beleive current update was smoke and mirrors
It sounds like it's pot luck how well the projector can focus individual pixels. Since I use the projector as a windows desktop from under 2 meters away this is a big concern. Projectors are delicate things - buy from a good retailer who will back you up in case any issues
Physical connectors are at the back instead of the side, which will make my life slightly more difficult - It looks far neater - no ugly wires out the side
Bulbs to replace


id suggest reading the avforum reviews on this site, both are quite comprehensive. really in my opinion should be comparing sony 590es with jvc n7 and the n7 romps home. actually id take a jvc n5 over a 590es. the 790es sits at a higher price point really...
 

mb3195

Distinguished Member
If you weren’t using madVR I’d have probably suggested the N7, but as you do it makes the choice more difficult.

my personal preference using the DTM on my lumagen was the Sony, I had a JVC on how demo, but opted for the laser image - something that really needs to be seen to appreciate. This coming for a JVC owner of 3 out of my 4 previous projectors.

You’ll be more than happy with either though.
 
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tomdfrost

Active Member
Thanks for the feedback everyone. There's a few things there I wasn't aware of or hadn't considered.

I wasn't aware the N7 had a finer interpixel gap, since I often use it up close this could be a factor, is it significant?

I'm not considering bulb replacement as a factor, I probably put about 400 hours in a year to a projector so I don't think I'll be replacing anything regardless of which way I go.

Noise is important to me because the projector is just above my head, I thought they were both pretty quiet machines, but I haven't heard much about the type of noise, do laser projectors sound very different?

For 3d I already have plenty of pairs of glasses that I believe will just work with the Sony, with the JVC I think I'll need to replace them all. It doesn't make up the price difference, but it's one more thing to think about.

I do connect other bits of kit to the projector from time to time which is why I prefer cables at the side, it's easy to get to, whereas the back is not, it's also against a wall on a shelf so having cables out the back will mean it has to move forward and overhang the shelf.

The 590es isn't on my radar, the primary reason the 790es is a candidate is because of the laser. From what I've read it sounds like the image it produces is nicer, more like a tv and very stable. Unfortunately I can't get a demo of either at the moment so I'm relying on the opinions of people that have seen them. A digital look is fine for me, I've always done as much as I can to remove stuff like film grain, it's just not for me.

I'd be interested if anyone has any experience with the motion plus style features of both? I currently use SVP but I do find it produces a lot of halos, if I were to use the projector smoothing instead do you think this would provide a better result?

Thanks again everyone!
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
I wasn't aware the N7 had a finer interpixel gap, since I often use it up close this could be a factor, is it significant?
i do beleive its a great contributor to the look of the JVCs. read two reviews here of the 590es and 790es and will hear the same thing. only seeing both for self will help i think...

I'm not considering bulb replacement as a factor, I probably put about 400 hours in a year to a projector so I don't think I'll be replacing anything regardless of which way I go.
that sounds like my use and yep complete non issue.. :D

Noise is important to me because the projector is just above my head, I thought they were both pretty quiet machines, but I haven't heard much about the type of noise, do laser projectors sound very different?
yep .. it is very different. with the jvc its a fan and one sound on low and one sound on high.

on the laser you wind them up for power and it has a kind of modulating noise.. only you can decide i think by hearing both am sorry whether a factor for you or not. for many its a non issue too...

For 3d I already have plenty of pairs of glasses that I believe will just work with the Sony, with the JVC I think I'll need to replace them all. It doesn't make up the price difference, but it's one more thing to think about
you could just order jvc with a 3D pack. most retailers will pull bits together. if have RF glasses likely work with the jvc...

I do connect other bits of kit to the projector from time to time which is why I prefer cables at the side, it's easy to get to, whereas the back is not, it's also against a wall on a shelf so having cables out the back will mean it has to move forward and overhang the shelf.
sounds like rear is not for you. mine is up against back wall too. but all my connections are at my av processor ? my av processor even has front ports ...why are you plugging unplugging things straight in the projector ? i would have thought the processor would be the hub ?

The 590es isn't on my radar, the primary reason the 790es is a candidate is because of the laser. From what I've read it sounds like the image it produces is nicer, more like a tv and very stable. Unfortunately I can't get a demo of either at the moment so I'm relying on the opinions of people that have seen them. A digital look is fine for me, I've always done as much as I can to remove stuff like film grain, it's just not for me.
this is really unfortunate cant demo. i have about 3-4 retailers within 30min drive from me and this really helped in my decision...

I'd be interested if anyone has any experience with the motion plus style features of both? I currently use SVP but I do find it produces a lot of halos, if I were to use the projector smoothing instead do you think this would provide a better result?
i dont think this is an issue these days with any brands... ie models we are talking about here.
 
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tomdfrost

Active Member
I have read both of the reviews, I find they don't always answer the questions I have, which is where it's great to ask actual owners. They always suggest turning off motion smoothing for films, which is the opposite of what I want to know about. I did read about the pitch being different on the Sony fan, I guess that's what you're referring to.

I don't have a separate AV processor, I run an HDMI cable straight from my PC in to the projector, speakers plug direct into the PC too, so I've never really understood the need for a separate AV processor, other than making cabling simpler I suppose.

I've phoned my local Richer Sounds to see if they'll be able to do a demo once lockdown is relaxed, but it doesn't sound like it will be possible then, at this end of the market I suppose they won't want to unbox stock worth that amount of money.

It feels like things like noise of fans and demos of motion interpolation would be easily shown in video reviews, but it doesn't seem to be a thing, don't know why.
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
lets just review the below, red edits and additions :)

VPL-VW790ES Pros
Laser produces a more stable image. Meh.... Absolutely. Hard to explain but easy to see with your own eyes.

VPL-VW790ES Cons

Plastic lens
elements Only one element (the exit element is polymer) and it is no bad thing.

the noise of these is really irritating I don't find it irritating in the slightest myself. Simply do not notice it any more than high bulb on any other projector.
Hi @tomdfrost
Just thought I would add my views on a coupe of points made above. ;):)
Sony does have Dynamic HDR it is just implemented in a different way to JVCs DTM.
Both are great machines. Neither will disappoint and you should get whichever you can get for less, which I would assume would be the N7.
 

tomdfrost

Active Member
Do you notice the noise when on Low? I'd rather sacrifice brightness for noise if there's the option.

It's the laser image that I'm most intrigued by, my concern is if I went with another lamp projector it's not going to feel like a big upgrade, which I really want to feel when spending this amount of money.
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
There is no high and low, it is a scale from 0-100.
For HDR, when set to 80% or lower it is essentially silent. Most set their lasers to around that level as the additional image brightness from 80 to 100 is not that much. I have mine on 85.

For SDR I have my (760) at 20 and you simply cannot hear it unless you really listen for it in a completely quiet room.
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
Hard to describe the laser lit image. It is like watching a much nicer TV picture is the best I can think of.
Both myself and the wife noticed it the moment it was switched on. No micro-flicker whatsoever.
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
I have read both of the reviews, I find they don't always answer the questions I have, which is where it's great to ask actual owners. They always suggest turning off motion smoothing for films, which is the opposite of what I want to know about. I did read about the pitch being different on the Sony fan, I guess that's what you're referring to.

I don't have a separate AV processor, I run an HDMI cable straight from my PC in to the projector, speakers plug direct into the PC too, so I've never really understood the need for a separate AV processor, other than making cabling simpler I suppose.

I've phoned my local Richer Sounds to see if they'll be able to do a demo once lockdown is relaxed, but it doesn't sound like it will be possible then, at this end of the market I suppose they won't want to unbox stock worth that amount of money.

It feels like things like noise of fans and demos of motion interpolation would be easily shown in video reviews, but it doesn't seem to be a thing, don't know why.
Bit short sighted of RS there I think. You would think they would hedge their bets by getting both units in, knowing one of them will go to you (score) and the other can be used as a demo to sell more of them to people who can actually view one before buying.
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
Do you notice the noise when on Low? I'd rather sacrifice brightness for noise if there's the option.
something will have to check out for self I think. likely need to raise it past the lowest setting given luminance needs for HDR :) and enough of a step up from SDR :)

It's the laser image that I'm most intrigued by, my concern is if I went with another lamp projector it's not going to feel like a big upgrade, which I really want to feel when spending this amount of money.
oh thee are both pretty awesome projectors, i would be very surprised if didnt see a decent enough step up with both vs the outlay :)

Bit short sighted of RS there I think. You would think they would hedge their bets by getting both units in, knowing one of them will go to you (score) and the other can be used as a demo to sell more of them to people who can actually view one before buying.
I agree its bizarre. especially given the tiny population city/country am at and there are retailers all around me that have to demo these things. maybe we are home theatre mad or something ! but we dont really have the specialist chain stores here though. all are independents. the chain stores we have are more box movers and they dont sell anything like what we are talking here :)
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
something will have to check out for self I think. likely need to raise it past the lowest setting given luminance needs for HDR :) and enough of a step up from SDR :)


oh thee are both pretty awesome projectors, i would be very surprised if didnt see a decent enough step up with both vs the outlay :)


I agree its bizarre. especially given the tiny population city/country am at and there are retailers all around me that have to demo these things. maybe we are home theatre mad or something ! but we dont really have the specialist chain stores here though. all are independents. the chain stores we have are more box movers and they dont sell anything like what we are talking here :)
RS has made its reputation on customer service and NOT being a box shifter too.
The manager of the RS in question needs to re-evaluate I think.
@tomdfrost maybe if you tell them that you will definitely be buying one or other of those two, they will change their minds?
 

tomdfrost

Active Member
I actually just had a phone call from them, they're trying to source a demo unit direct from Sony that they could let me use, and then swap for a new one if I like it. The JVC is only available on special order, they don't stock them themselves.
They've always been good to me in the past, I bought my last projector from them after demoing it, but that was only a £5k projector which they already had as a demo model.
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
I actually just had a phone call from them, they're trying to source a demo unit direct from Sony that they could let me use, and then swap for a new one if I like it. The JVC is only available on special order, they don't stock them themselves.
They've always been good to me in the past, I bought my last projector from them after demoing it, but that was only a £5k projector which they already had as a demo model.
That's great! I too have a good relationship with RS and their free 6 year warranties are a great addition.
Even though their will be no JVC to demo, you can view the Sony they get in and you can decide if you like it or not. If not then you can wait.
I recommend taking your current projector in with you (if possible) to see the difference first hand in the same environment.
After all the level of improvement over what you have is more important than against other devices isn't it?
If it doesn't knock your socks off after the 270, then JVC is your next stop. :)
 

tomdfrost

Active Member
Yeah, that sounds like a very sensible option. I'll either see the difference with the laser light or I won't. If I don't then the JVC seems much better value for money.
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
Yeah, that sounds like a very sensible option. I'll either see the difference with the laser light or I won't. If I don't then the JVC seems much better value for money.
I can't imagine for a minute you won't notice the difference. For me it was so stark. :cool:
Not just stability, but the extra brightness and colours (which really pop) etc.
The additional contrast from the dynamic dual contrast light engine should be immediately noticeable too.
I am interested to hear how it went regardless. Any timescales they have given you?
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
Also, lasers aren't just about being better than replacing bulbs. The laser units switch on and off instantly, like a TV, with no penalty. Big plus in my book.
I went from planning my viewing to make sure I used it enough in one sitting, to using it as and when I want.
 

tomdfrost

Active Member
No timescales yet, just waiting for another call back.

Start up time will be another bonus, although it's not a massive factor for me, I start the projector up first and by the time I've shut any curtains and got settled the screen is up and ready to go.
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
Yeah, that sounds like a very sensible option. I'll either see the difference with the laser light or I won't. If I don't then the JVC seems much better value for money.
sounds like a good plan, re video comparisons, ive found below by the russians might help


12:49 Sony VPL-VW760 vs JVC - DLA-N7

there was a good text version with a lot more detail @shartm might be able to point to it as its dead linked on the youtube ...
 

alebonau

Well-known Member
although it's not a massive factor for me, I start the projector up first and by the time I've shut any curtains and got settled the screen is up and ready to go.
thats me to, tend to fire up the PJ and then go gets things sorted to settle in for the movie :D
 

DB9S

Well-known Member
No timescales yet, just waiting for another call back.

Start up time will be another bonus, although it's not a massive factor for me, I start the projector up first and by the time I've shut any curtains and got settled the screen is up and ready to go.
It is like the stability of image though. It doesn't sound like anything much, until you have it in your life.
When you switch on a bulb projector it is wise to let everything thermally equalise before powering down. Bulb strikes are a thing too. They heat up to extremely high temperatures very quickly and take an age to cool down. If you power cycle them too much. they will end up fracturing.
With a laser, if you suddenly have to leave and switch off, you can do it without a moments thought as to decreased longevity, or anything else.
Only once you have it do you really notice the rigmarole you used to have to go through, even if it was only in the back of your mind. :)
 

tomdfrost

Active Member
Maybe I don't look after mine as much as I should. I'll just turn mine on and off as I need it, never paid any attention to letting anything equalize.
 

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