Problem displaying Sky Q HDR HLG formats with Arcam AV850 without screen locking out showing Invalid format

Macra

Standard Member
I have recently updated to the latest Sky Q box version 32B206 (Software Q140.000.37.00L) a month ago to enable viewing of HDR content.
I am unable to select and play 4K HLD and Netflix HDR programs from Sky Q box via my Arcam AV850 without the screen locking up displaying the message “invalid format”.
The only solution I have found is by toggling between another HDMI input and returning to the Sky input button, the program eventually becomes available to view but this can take up to 6 attempts.
I also own an Apple 4K TV box that works ok with both video and audio via AV850 in HD10.
Going HDMI direct from Sky Q into LG OLED55E6V TV has no problem with recognising displaying any of the HDR formats.
I contacted Arcam and discussed the problem with them and following this: -
I have tried various versions of HDMI cables, normal cable I use is Audioquest cinnamon.
Updated AV850 software from V4.31 to V7.1.
Removed all other HDMI inputs other than Sky Q but this shows no improvement.
I have no zone 2 output used.
 
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D

Deleted member 39241

Guest
Are you using the STB input on the Arcam, if so try another one.

Have you tried premium certified HDMI cables from the sky box to the AVR and from the AVR to the TV?
 

CaptainJames

Well-known Member
HLG seems to be more problematical than HDR 10 or DV for some reason. I assume the Sky box is set to 2160p 10 bit?

My previous Pioneer amp would not pass through HLG, didn't want to know. Something to do with the HDMI inputs but I never got to the bottom of it. The fact that it works when connected directly to TV indicates that it an AVR issue, either set up or more seriously an HDMI capability problem.
 

CaptainJames

Well-known Member
HLG seems to be more problematical than HDR 10 or DV for some reason. I assume the Sky box is set to 2160p 10 bit?

My previous Pioneer amp would not pass through HLG, didn't want to know. Something to do with the HDMI inputs but I never got to the bottom of it. The fact that it works when connected directly to TV indicates that it an AVR issue, either set up or more seriously an HDMI capability problem.
 

Macra

Standard Member
Yes the sky box is set to 2160p 10 bit.
No not using the STB input.
Rambles what do you classify as premium certified HDMI cables.
 
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Steve356

Distinguished Member
There shouldn't be any issues with Audioquest Cinnamon cables. I use the same cables with my 850 and have never encountered a single problem with them. However, my set top box is a Virgin Media V6 and I've never tried them with a Sky box.
 

Macra

Standard Member
Steve does the virgin box use the HDR HLG protocol.
I have no problem with Apple 4K TV HDR HDR10 signals.
 

Steve356

Distinguished Member
Steve does the virgin box use the HDR HLG protocol.
I have no problem with Apple 4K TV HDR HDR10 signals.

I'm not sure on that one. The only live HDR program on Virgin that I recall from recent times was the French Tennis championships on Eurosport. Assuming that was indeed HLG protocol, I had zero issues with it. The only other HDR programs that I've watched since has been Perfect Planet and Dark Materials on iPlayer via the Virgin box. If that was HLG (I think it probably was), then they were also perfect. Everything else I watch in 4K is using my ATV 4K.

FWIW, my TV is a Samsung 65Q90R.
 

Macra

Standard Member
Having tried other cables and tested without success.
I checked that Sky 4K HLG signal can pass from my Sky Q box with (Software Q140.000.37.00L) direct to LG OLED55E6V TV via Arcam AV850 switched off and give HRD HLG picture to TV ok without invalid format error.
Cable length Sky Q Box to Arcam AV850 3 Metres, AV850 to LG OLED55E6V TV 5 Metres.
Have discussed problem with Arcam support and have yet to find a solution.
Does anyone have a latest Sky Q box with Arcam AV Receiver that is able to play Sky 4K HDR HLG signals or Netflix from Sky without screen locking up with Invalid format error.
If so can you please inform details of system.
Test programs used Sky Q Gang of Lemurs & The Crown Netflix
 

CaptainJames

Well-known Member
Having tried other cables and tested without success.
I checked that Sky 4K HLG signal can pass from my Sky Q box with (Software Q140.000.37.00L) direct to LG OLED55E6V TV via Arcam AV850 switched off and give HRD HLG picture to TV ok without invalid format error.
Cable length Sky Q Box to Arcam AV850 3 Metres, AV850 to LG OLED55E6V TV 5 Metres.
Have discussed problem with Arcam support and have yet to find a solution.
Does anyone have a latest Sky Q box with Arcam AV Receiver that is able to play Sky 4K HDR HLG signals or Netflix from Sky without screen locking up with Invalid format error.
If so can you please inform details of system.
Test programs used Sky Q Gang of Lemurs & The Crown Netflix

Well there is obviously an issue with the Arcam not liking HLG. I would press Arcam for a definitive response on it's capabilities, but in the meantime you could try a workaround of connecting Sky box directly to TV and using ARC for audio.
 

Macra

Standard Member
After further investigation I purchased Antiference Premium certified cables to test if HDMI leads were the problem. Changing cables made the problem worse more invalid format errors. Also tried setting up ARC channel but unable to obtain Dolby Digital + Audio signal only Dolby Digital.
Cannot understand why Netflix on Apple TV will play 4K 2K HDR10 (Dolby Atmos) but when same AV850 Sat Input and HDMI leads are used from Sky Q box showing 4K 2K HD10 screen locks up with Invalid Format Signal.
Sky HLD HDR channels requires 1 or 2 input toggles via AV850 to display ok.
Netflix Via Sky channels requires 1 to 6 input toggles via AV850 to display ok.
Test programs used Sky Q Gang of Lemurs & The Crown Netflix.
From all the testing I think it is looking more like the fault of the Sky Q box version 32B206 and implication of its HDMI output.

 
D

Deleted member 39241

Guest
I don't have Sky, so can't help there.

I do have an AVR550 on firmware version 4.41 and do get Dolby Digital plus with Atmos via HDMI ARC from my Samsung 65Q90R.

I tested this using the Plex app on the TV. There is an issue at the moment that Amazon Prime and possibly Netflix, have removed some of the higher bitrate audio content, and are only offering Dolby Digital during lockdown to maximise bandwidth, not sure if this is relevant to your testing?

When you switch between using the Apple TV or the Sky box to play the same content, are you using the same cables and the same HDMI input on the AVR?
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Macra

Standard Member
Just done some more test.
Using same cable tested using Sat & PVR inputs.
Using ARC channel on Sky unable to achieve Dolby Digital Plus just Dolby Digital.
Using ARC channel on Apple TV unable to achieve Dolby Atmos just Dolby Digital.
Using Apple TV to either Sat or PRV input not using ARC output signal is 4K 2K HDR10 with Dolby Atmos.
Test programs used Sky Q Gang of Lemurs & The Crown Netflix.
 
D

Deleted member 39241

Guest
In terms of ARC, what options are there on your TV for sound output?

Am I right in summarising that the Apple TV works fine when going through the AVR but the Sky box doesn't, and that is using the same HDMI input on the AVR and the same cables?

If that is the case, what video output options do you have on the Sky box?
 

CaptainJames

Well-known Member
Have you enabled Atmos on the TV? DD+ (and therefore Atmos) passes over ARC.
 

Macra

Standard Member
The TV does not have Atmos the LG was set to Auto and highest output you can select is Dolby Digital Plus.
When changed from Auto to Dolby Digital Plus neither Sky or Apple Tv will output signals higher than Dolby Digital using ARC.
Rambles you are right in going through AV850 via Apple TV everything is ok all problems apply to The Sky Q box, and it has only one HDMI output.
 
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D

Deleted member 39241

Guest
As I don't have Sky, I am only guessing here, but you said earlier that you have the Sky box set to 2160p 10bit, as it does seem to be the Sky box that is the problem, it might be worth trying some other video output options and see if it magically springs into life (8 bit or 12 bit for example).
 

CaptainJames

Well-known Member
The TV does not have Atmos the LG was set to Auto and highest output you can select is Dolby Digital Plus.
When changed from Auto to Dolby Digital Plus neither Sky or Apple Tv will output signals higher than Dolby Digital using ARC.
Rambles you are right in going through AV850 via Apple TV everything is ok all problems apply to The Sky Q box, and it has only one HDMI output.
Well if your TV does not process Atmos, then why are you expecting it to pass Atmos over ARC?
 
D

Deleted member 39241

Guest
The TV doesn't need to process anything, it just needs to bitstream the Dolby Digital plus soundtrack with the Atmos metadata contained within it to the AVR via ARC for the AVR to decode it.

It is possible that the TV can do this via audio output from its internal apps but does not support doing it from any devices that are connected to it from its HDMI inputs.

It is also possible that the TVs internal apps are not carrying DD+ with Atmos at present due to pandemic related bandwidth limitations, but I'm not sure if the OP has tried the Netflix app on the TV.
 

Richardl57

Standard Member
I use a NAD T777v3 into an LG 55E6V and get the same thing. Turning the Sky Q box off and on sorts the problem, sometimes it takes 5-6 attempts before the picture appears. I use premium certified cables and have the latest Q box set to 2160p 10=bit. NAD reckoned the HDMI cables were the issue so I got premium ones. I have never been able to use the setup routine in the Q box to get 10 bit, it only ever finds the 8 bit version. Had to plug the box directly to the TV to save the 10 bit setting. i just don’t know which piece of equipment is causing the problem so will have to live with it , maybe a firmware update might fix it in the future.
 

CaptainJames

Well-known Member
I use a NAD T777v3 into an LG 55E6V and get the same thing. Turning the Sky Q box off and on sorts the problem, sometimes it takes 5-6 attempts before the picture appears. I use premium certified cables and have the latest Q box set to 2160p 10=bit. NAD reckoned the HDMI cables were the issue so I got premium ones. I have never been able to use the setup routine in the Q box to get 10 bit, it only ever finds the 8 bit version. Had to plug the box directly to the TV to save the 10 bit setting. i just don’t know which piece of equipment is causing the problem so will have to live with it , maybe a firmware update might fix it in the future.
As the Sky Box works when connected directly to the TV, your AVR is clearly the issue. i would strongly suspect that it is not capable of passing HLG which Sky uses for HDR, hence why it will not set to 10 bit.
 

Richardl57

Standard Member
As the Sky Box works when connected directly to the TV, your AVR is clearly the issue. i would strongly suspect that it is not capable of passing HLG which Sky uses for HDR, hence why it will not set to 10 bit.
Hi, I have the Q box plugged into the AVR and it does pass HLG at 10 bit but is not 100% reliable. Either at power up or at a change of channel the picture is lost and the invalid format message appears. NAD say they pass the signal as is, is it likely that both NAD and Arcam don’t actually deal with HLG correctly. Hopefully they will both update the software to fix the issue at some point unless it is the hardware at fault.
 

CaptainJames

Well-known Member
Hi, I have the Q box plugged into the AVR and it does pass HLG at 10 bit but is not 100% reliable. Either at power up or at a change of channel the picture is lost and the invalid format message appears. NAD say they pass the signal as is, is it likely that both NAD and Arcam don’t actually deal with HLG correctly. Hopefully they will both update the software to fix the issue at some point unless it is the hardware at fault.
Certainly seems to be the case - for some reason some AVRs just do not like HLG.
 
D

Deleted member 39241

Guest
If other devices connected to the AVR passthrough HLG reliably, but the Sky box doesn't, the problem is potentially with the Sky box. Other reports of the issue (with and without an AVR in the chain) here:

 

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