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Printing too dark...

FaxFan2002

Prominent Member
Had to think of a short title but here goes

The wifey is having problems printing out here pictures - basically they come out too dark. The basic setup is -

Canon 50d
PC with LCD panel printing mostly from Adobe LR3 and Photoshop CS5
Canon Pro 9000 MK2

I understand the LCD panel makes things look a lot lighter and increase the brightness of the photograph isn't the way forward.

I had a play round with color profiles and had no real joy but I think I need to do some calibration of the camera, monitor and printer so they "match".

The Pro 9000 MK2 does allow you to calibrate and create your own colour profile via "Color Management Pro Tool" using X-rite i1 series tools, these also can calibrate the monitor.

Is the way forward? Is there a simpler way?
 

dudeonline

Prominent Member
I would calibrate your Monitor first, Then produce a print and go from there. There are lots of calibration devices.

I use a Pantone Huey which monitors ambient light and adjusts dynamically, but there are plenty of others e.g. Spyder etc..

You could also take a look at the Color Munki which analyses prints too for perfect matching ColorMunki

Are you using one colour profile all the way through? e.g. sRGB in CS5 desktop and saving as an sRGB colour profiled image?
 

FaxFan2002

Prominent Member
Thanks for the feedback - I've setup the same color profiles all the way through but the wife has a habit of playing...

I think the colormunki looks spot on, what you get on the screen is what prints in one device. Early xmas present incoming!
 

dudeonline

Prominent Member
Good luck with that, the Color Munki is supposed to be a very good solution. Let us know if it solves your problems. (or your wife's :) )
 

Johnmcl7

Distinguished Member
What is the LCD panel she is using? I find it difficult to get good accuracy from most laptop monitors even after trying to tweak them to suit the printer due to the same brightness issues.

John
 

Johnmcl7

Distinguished Member
I realised it wasn't a laptop but was just wondering what level of monitor it was as obviously you've got a great setup there for software and printing which would make it a shame if the LCD panel was letting it down.

John
 

FaxFan2002

Prominent Member
Samsung B2230W 22" Widescreen LCD Monitor - not the best monitor in the world, worth a look at upgrading do you think? Also have HP 2510i 25" Widescreen LCD Monitor in the house as well.
 

dudeonline

Prominent Member
If you are serious about editing then you want an IPS (in plane switching) panel, this will mean that for the most part your head position doesnt affect how the image on screen looks. If you are using a larger monitor then a TN or non IPS panel could mean that outer edges of the image appear different unless you move your head over that section.

So for an upgrade look for IPS or S-IPS spec. There are others like MVA and PVA that offer a compromise between the two technologies.
 

shotokan101

Banned
If you are serious about editing then you want an IPS (in plane switching) panel, this will mean that for the most part your head position doesnt affect how the image on screen looks. If you are using a larger monitor then a TN or non IPS panel could mean that outer edges of the image appear different unless you move your head over that section.

So for an upgrade look for IPS or S-IPS spec. There are others like MVA and PVA that offer a compromise between the two technologies.

Out of curiosity - how much are we talking for a decent sized IPS Panel ?

Jim
 

dudeonline

Prominent Member
Out of curiosity - how much are we talking for a decent sized IPS Panel ?

Jim

Hi Jim, well, I'm using a HP2475w IPS wide gamut 24" panel (which may not be suitable for all), it cost £400. Decent IPS panels are still not cheap. Dell do a widescreen (1920x1080) 23" one for about £250. Their monitors do seem to have a generally good reputation. Of course you can go silly and some top end graphic/editing monitors move into 4 figures. Here's the Dell one.

Dell 23" IPS Panel

Some panels show sRGB colours only which may be useful if you only process in sRGB.
 

mucca_D

Prominent Member
Out of curiosity - how much are we talking for a decent sized IPS Panel ?

Jim

About £300 and upwards very quickly

Now some may remember a while ago I was looking at getting an A3 printer and was quickly put off by the forum reminding me of the nightmare I had many moon ago trying to get home prints correct.

I felt determined to understand this area, so set about learning.

Ok so the corect answer for home printing (other than don't) is to use a Good monitor, idealy an IPS as said above.
Then the next clear step is a calibration system like the ColorMunki

Oh and of course do not forget the printer, but more importantly the PAPER!

Then the next level is the room lighting and how this can really impact how you look at the print

Now, and this is the lights turned on for me, was yes to use all of the above and calibration is really a must, but more important then all of that is your WORKFLOW

For example, not setting the correct profile for the paper and printer is like entering a photo in a competition without looking at the photo. Make sure you set the profile up in CS5 before you send to the printer!

Do watch the videos in the link I provided, they provdie a good insight.

As for me, I ended up getting the R3880 A2+ :D printer and a colormunki
Monitor I have not upgraded and I doubt I will.

Colormunki is excellent it really is. don't get me wrong the spyder 3 I have, that I now need to sell, was good but the munki is in a league of its own, well worth it :smashin:
 

shotokan101

Banned
Hi Jim, well, I'm using a HP2475w IPS wide gamut 24" panel (which may not be suitable for all), it cost £400. Decent IPS panels are still not cheap. Dell do a widescreen (1920x1080) 23" one for about £250. Their monitors do seem to have a generally good reputation. Of course you can go silly and some top end graphic/editing monitors move into 4 figures. Here's the Dell one.

Dell 23" IPS Panel

Some panels show sRGB colours only which may be useful if you only process in sRGB.

Thanks for that - much appreciated - nice to know that you can get something "usefull" for not too much - I definitely had "four figure sum" in mind when I read that last post :)

Jim
 

mucca_D

Prominent Member
Hi Jim, well, I'm using a HP2475w IPS wide gamut 24" panel (which may not be suitable for all), it cost £400. Decent IPS panels are still not cheap. Dell do a widescreen (1920x1080) 23" one for about £250. Their monitors do seem to have a generally good reputation. Of course you can go silly and some top end graphic/editing monitors move into 4 figures. Here's the Dell one.

Dell 23" IPS Panel

Some panels show sRGB colours only which may be useful if you only process in sRGB.

Nice screen.

Dear santa, please may i have
Eizo ColorEdge CG303W - 999-765A - CG303W-BK-UK

Only £2,509.80 :smashin:
 

dudeonline

Prominent Member
Thanks for that - much appreciated - nice to know that you can get something "usefull" for not too much - I definitely had "four figure sum" in mind when I read that last post :)

Jim
yes, in the grand scheme of things, they aren't too bad, if you have an expensive camera and are serious (in an amateur or pro way) about your photography then its a relatively small cost.
 

Ian_S

Distinguished Member
To the OP....

You may want to look at your printer manuals before diving into the ColorMunki. (Not saying the ColorMuki is bad)

I think the pro Canon's have the ability to use the eye 1 devices for printer profiling without needing the expensive eye-one printer profiling software. This may be better integrated into the workflow for you.

Also, cheap LCDs are often WAY too bright, so guess what happens if you don't tone down the brightness? What looks good on screen after adjustment will be too dark elsewhere.

Monitor calibration is a must, if only to tone down the brightness sufficiently. Colour balance etc is still important but simply toning down your monitor brightness will help.

As mucca_d says though, how a print then looks on paper depends on ambient light too. Also, you must let the print dry completely. Do not try to judge a print the instant it comes off the printer. It will change until it dries.
 

Jammyb

Prominent Member
Indeed... very nice.... Wouldn't mind trying one to see what the fuss is about..

If you go to the focus on imaging show at the NEC there's a lot of stands with this type of stuff on, they do look incredible.

The great thing with this kind of tech though is that it does filter down eventually. Whereas an L series lens will never be £200
 

dudeonline

Prominent Member
If you go to the focus on imaging show at the NEC there's a lot of stands with this type of stuff on, they do look incredible.

The great thing with this kind of tech though is that it does filter down eventually. Whereas an L series lens will never be £200

I'll be going this year again, looking forward to it. Must remember to check out the Eizos...
 

FaxFan2002

Prominent Member
Wow! thanks for all the replies. I'm going to kick off with decent lighting and a colormunki. Does anyone know if the iMac screens are IPS panels?

The WORKFLOW is something we have been working hard on and have already seem a decent improvement.
 

Johnmcl7

Distinguished Member
Wow! thanks for all the replies. I'm going to kick off with decent lighting and a colormunki. Does anyone know if the iMac screens are IPS panels?

The WORKFLOW is something we have been working hard on and have already seem a decent improvement.

Both the 21.5 and 27in Imacs are IPS I believe although I don't think they're a great choice due to their all in one nature. To me a monitor is a good investment as it's something that will outlast my PCs and be with me for a while but with an all-in-one design you're stuck with builtin PC which is very limited in upgrade capability and in time likely to be replaced entirely. I believe the new Imacs are slightly better in that they do offer a single display input so at least it is possible to use with a different PC in future I think?

The Dell version of the 27in Imac's screen by comparison is a better display as it's not glossy, it uses a conventional backlight to give a better colour gamut and it supports pretty much every display input type there is.

John
 

mucca_D

Prominent Member
Wow! thanks for all the replies. I'm going to kick off with decent lighting and a colormunki. Does anyone know if the iMac screens are IPS panels?

The WORKFLOW is something we have been working hard on and have already seem a decent improvement.

The only issue I have heard on the iMac is the it can be to bright.

Someone has made some software that will drop it down further, google it if you get one
 

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