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Pixel+2 - Which Models - (32PW9618 - What Version)

Discussion in 'Televisions' started by Free To Air, Mar 22, 2004.

  1. Free To Air

    Free To Air
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    Would anyone please be able to let me know which Philips 32" TV sets have Pixel Plus version 2 and are available for purchase now.

    Also if not Pixel Plus 2, what version of Pixel Plus does the Philips 32PW9618 TV set have. The April edition of What Video states that the 32PW9618 has the second generation version of Pixel Plus but that seems contradicted by some of the posts on the forum I have read.

    I have read quite a few threads on the forum that stretch back several months on the topic and am unsure if the latest models of the 32PW9618 have Pixel Plus 2 or not & if that is the same as Pixel Plus 1.5 with the addition of Movie Plus.

    Apart from that I am in the usual dilemma of trying to choose between the Panasonic TX-32PD30 and the Philips 32PW9618. - Any recommendations, my use is with a Sky Plus decoder & a Nokia 9600 digital satellite decoder

    Lastly, is the version of Pixel Plus fixed per model, ie do all the same models have the same version or can they be upgraded. For example could last years 32PW9618 with whatever version it shipped with can have it upgraded to the latest version in similar manner as digital satellite decoders can have firmware upgrades.

    Regards
    moonbase



    :)
     
  2. scrapbook

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    The 'second generation' of PIxel Plus as some refer is also referred to as Pixel Plus 1.5. My understanding in the differences between version 1.0 and 1.5 is the inclusion of Movie Plus.

    Pixel Plus 2.0 is out soon over here I believe, I dont think there are any sets out as yet with this version in....or are there??

    Sooooo 9618 will have vers 1.5
     
  3. Cynthia 7

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    Hi Moonbase,

    Nice to see you on the Forum.

    Scrapbook is right that last years "second generation" is now referred to as Pixel Plus 1.5 and is still going to be produced but is going to be cheaper, i.e. the PW9618. I don't think this range is upgradeable.

    Bazzae posted the new model numbers of the Pixel Plus 2 version (out sometime from April). These are 28PW9509 and 32PW9509.

    Blind Lemon gave me some useful information regarding Philips tubes. (What would we do without these knowledgeable members on this forum?) I will quote what he said:

    "You can tell a Panasonic tube by the presence of a single phosphor dot halfway down each side. The new HD Panasonic tubes (as used in the PD30) are better (smaller dot pitch, flatter internal surface etc. but these are expensive tubes and I doubt you will find them in Philips sets."

    I too have been dithering over my purchase of a 36" set. I have been waiting for the new Philips range but if a 36" model is not included I shall probably go for the Panasonic PD30 with fingers and toes crossed that I get a good one.

    Good luck with your new Philips television, it may be well worth waiting for.
     
  4. Free To Air

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    Thanks for the helpful replies scrapbook & Cynthia.

    Its a bit of a minefield but I am a lot clearer now as to the state of play thanks to the info on the forum.

    On reflection my waiting for a Philips 32PW9509 may be the best option or even changing my original choice of 32PW9618 and going for a Panasonic PD30? I am a bit put off by the debate about the tube quality in the 32PW9618.

    Has anyone any ideas when the new Philips range are to be released or is it "April" as quoted by Philips which could end up later?

    Once again thanks for the info & help

    Regards
    moonbase
     
  5. bazzae123

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    When I phoned Philips press office they confirmed that is would be released in April. I hope so as I'm renting a TV until the new Philips is out. The reason is. Because I thought the
    Philips "1.5" was quite stunning on picture quality apart from the occasional "Halo" effect. If this is cured on the new generation and the Processing is tamed a little then this set should be a real winner. Having said that, I might even win the lottery next week so who knows.

    Bazza:D
     
  6. SimonY

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    This link is to a press release from Cebit (in German) that includes some information about the Pixel Plus 2.

    While no expert in German the product release bits are pretty clear with LCD and Plasma displays in April 2004 and the 28PW9509 and 32PW9509 in "2 Quarter 2004". I don't know whether the German market is different to UK in release dates - there may be some extra tests or certification that they need to go to for that market.

    Cebit German Press Release
     
  7. neiljones

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    Beginning of March I received an e mail from Matthew Moran, Senior Marketing Manager, Philips UK, who stated taht a 28" and 32" Pixel Plus 2 will be launched this year. No 36" TV will be launched as the "36" category is being cannabilised by Plasma & LCD of which they hace Pixel Plus 2 versions of both".
    I see the first headline on today@s front cover announces two new 28"and 32" Philips IDTV- 50 hz.
    No mention of Pixel Plus in article by Jeffrey Archer.
    Are Philips going to release another version of 28" and 32" Pixel Plus very soon-it is all very confusing.
    I bought the original 36 9607 in July 2002, which I see is still widely available on Kelkoo sites and touch wood, up to now have never experienced any of the black lines faults that were so widely referred to when I first purchased the set.
    NJ
     
  8. Cynthia 7

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    Thank you for letting us know Neil. I had even posted a thread asking if there was a new 36" Philips television. I am very disappointed as I was keen to get the Philips, now I don't know which one to buy, like a lot of others on this forum!

    It seems that all the well known makes, Loewe, Panasonic, Philips, etc. are just concentrating on 28", 32" CRTs and plasma or LCD models, The 36" models obviously don't achieve volume sales and maybe cause a lot more technical problems. Glad to hear your 9607 has proved to be a good buy.
     
  9. Maxi_TK96

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    Don't know if technical problems with the 36 inch line are actually the reason here, from what I have heard the 32 inch line has had more problems while 36 inch owners are usually happy. It would be a pity if there were no 36 inch Pixel Plus v2 model since CRT as a technology can provide very good results.

    I am actually getting 36PW9618 in a few days (excited!) after trying out the 44 inch LG DLP telly and Sony KV-36HQ100. The LG had too much noise and really lousy motion compensation (suffers from motion dither). The Sony had a very natural picture but motion compensation was poor (lots of ghosting) compared to Philips DNM which I'm very used to. I actually activated the old motion compensation from the service menu which shows my level of disappointment to Sony's recent technical advances. I also reviewed some plasmas (Philips & Panny 42 inchers) but they didn't look too impressive; Panny had almost zero motion compensation (important for me) and Philips had some ugly pixelation which the CRT models are completely free of.
     
  10. Cynthia 7

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    Hi Maxi,

    Thank you for the response. It's such a shame that Philips didn't produce a 36" Pixel Plus 2 model this year and next year is too long to wait! I hadn't actually noticed if the 36" models were more reliable although I hope so since I have decided to get the 36PW9618 too. You are right about CRT technology, it may appear to be out of date but there is nothing to beat a top CRT picture in my opinion.

    I had researched the Sony HQ100 but having read so many adverse reports on this, particularly on a primarily US forum (a name something like Agoraquest) I went back to my first love, the 36PW9618. Like you, I checked out other televisions but found them wanting.

    Hem on the thread "Philips 9308 tube" has just bought the 36PW9618 and seems pleased with it. I am feeling excited at the prospect of viewing mine, I am so fed up with small screens,
    I hope to order next week.

    Let us know how your opinions of your new television, good luck that you receive a perfect Pixel Plus.
     
  11. Hem

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    OK guys, let me know how you get on with your 9618 - well Maxi anyway, Cynthia I know your still hovering on this. Have been living with mine for almost two weeks now and to be honest I still can't make up my mind if I'm absolutely happy or not. Whilst the shimmering effect is present, maybe 30-40% of the time, it really isn't that intrusive. The main thing is to play with all the settings endlessly until you finally find what works best for you.

    My main gripe now is with Sky. The big screen really shows up the limitations of the lower bandwidth channels, lots of blockiness - which i believe is down to Sky and not the TV, maybe someone could confirm if this is the case?

    What I must stress, and thanks to someone else who posted this comment originally, do not attach the wireless transmitter to the back of the tv. Just let it hang behind the stand, it will be completely out of view. This way you should have no interference on the rear surrounds - but move the transmitter to were it is supposed to be attached and you do get interference. Just glad I remembered reading that post.
     
  12. Cynthia 7

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    Hem, thank you for giving us your experiences with your 9618. I almost wish I hadn't read it as I was getting really excited about having my 36PW9618 in the very near future. Now I am dithering over my choice of television once again. Should I go for the large Aventos, which has a curved screen and no Dolby Digital but sound is good nevertheless and is reliable? I feel this television is perhaps about three years out of date.

    I, too, could probably live with the shimmering but I am concerned about your comments on Sky viewing, as 99% viewing is through Sky. My husband is sport obsessed, mainly cricket and rugby, would the blockiness show up on Sky Sports? By blockiness do you mean pixel blocks? I had this with a bad Sky box. Now I have Sky+ and no problems. Do you get this on the main analogue channels ever? Have you tried your Sky with another television? Sorry to ask all these questions but on the big screen it could be very detrimental to happy viewing.

    Thank you for passing on the brilliant piece of information about the wireless transmitters. I have copied and pasted this.

    I hope someone else may comment on watching this television through Sky. I do appreciate you letting us know, and hope that your problems may improve.
     
  13. Cynthia 7

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    Sorry I meant to say I might now buy the Aconda 93102 not the Aventos! too many sleepless nights and forum viewing.
     
  14. Hem

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    Cynthia, the blockiness I'm refering to only affects some channels, obviously those allocated less bandwidth. A good example are some of the music channels when you can see definite "blockiness" across the screen at times (well I can, my wife however doesn't seem notice it?!). However all the premium channels are fine. I believe a lot of this could be down to my sky signal not being that great. We have a few problems with trees and buildings in the way(had tree surgeon out today). Sky signal is ok at 70% but quality is only 50%. Don't know much about these things but guess a better signal quality would improve matters. Terrestrial is fine, even the shimmering effect isn't apparent.

    To be honest I'm much happier with this set now, the sound is just fantastic for what can only be considered a "low end" AV system. DVD playback is phenomonal, as are many of the sky premium channels.

    As for watching football, if you're getting too much "shimmering" around players just switch to 100hz digital scan, or the double lines setting, which I guess is 50hz (visible flicker). All in all, so far so good.
     
  15. Cynthia 7

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    Hem,

    I do appreciate your reply; moreso now since I have taken the plunge and bought the 36" 9618! I am so excited about it I can hardly press the laptop keys and my mind is constantly dwelling on this television. It's almost like being in love with it!!!

    We also had to have the tree surgeon here. Our dish is in the garden on a pole and one 60 foot tree sadly had to be felled and branches removed from two others. Sky was unwatchable until that was done with constant severe pixelation. We also had trouble with lots of boxes until Sky gave us a brand new Sky + box. Our signal strength is Input 1 signal strength 40% but quality is 75%. Input 2 (not sure whether that's our Sky box upstairs or the downstairs one) is much higher at 60% strength and 90% quality.

    My husband is totally disinterested in AV products and happily watches programmes on a 14" portable with terrible sound. After I read your last post about the blocking I seriously thought of getting the Aconda which was £1779 from tvandvideodirect.com. A few weeks ago I asked should we get the Aconda and mentioned the price to my husband and he said mmm..., which I thought meant "Yes". When I asked again yesterday, he said it was the first he'd heard of it and when I mentioned the price of the television plus stand it was a definite "No"! I just wasn't happy with the curved screen anyway, causing bad reflections as our television is facing three bay windows and I think a flat screen would be better for that. I just knew the 9618 was for me.

    I am delighted to hear the sound is so good, very important to me. The old Sony we are watching now, although stereo, sounds so poor, dialogue is muffled. The music channels sound awful. Nice too that it sounds good without all the cables everywhere from a home cinema system. I shall get a DVD sometime.

    Fingers crossed for me, Hem, that I get a perfect television., and thank you again for your advice.





    I have copied and pasted your post (on an email to myself) I don't understand files and folders, but this way I can keep the information. I was particularly interested to see your information of switching to 100hz digital scan. or the double lines setting. I would be grateful if some time you could let me know your settings of colour, contrast, etc. I know each set is
     
  16. Cynthia 7

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    Can't think what happened to this paragrah. continuing....
    I know each set is individual regarding optimum settings but I would be grateful to hear your preferred settings to give me something to aim for. I am appalled at the number of my friends who have had their televisions from new with glaringly obvious colour, contrast and brightness. I have plucked up courage to ask if I can meddle with a few of them and their owners have been delighted at the result.

    Happy viewing for the Pixel Plus fraternity!
     
  17. Maxi_TK96

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    I'd be happy to give you some review concerning this television but this will have to wait because I'm only getting this tv on 16.4. Somehow the area head chief of Philips Finland managed to mess up my order so I'll be getting this telly later than I anticipated - I'm a bit furious since I would have liked to enjoy the coming Easter by watching movies using the new telly but now I have to settle for the Sony in the mean time... well, I guess it's better than not having a telly at all and the Sony is definitely not a bad choice.

    To be honest I was a bit surprised that there wouldn't be any more new Philips 36 inch models but I guess there's a need to push > 32 inch wannagets to buying plasmas (maybe because plasma sales haven't really picked up?). One could say that this telly is the "last of it's kind" concerning Philips CRTs anyway. For me it means that the next telly (most likely Philips since I'm addicted to Pixel Plus and Digital Natural Motion) will be plasma. Better start saving those salaries because I doubt that plasmas will suddenly get cheap.
     
  18. Maxi_TK96

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    As far as settings are concerned my experiences maincly consist of the 36PW9527 which should not be too different from the 36PW9618. I do not remember the tv image (brightness, contrast,...) setting but here's some which I could remember right away:

    As far as concerning settings the first thing you have to decided is if you want to keep using Pixel Plus or Movie Plus -mode all the time (Movie Plus of those two is recommended since it is supposed to cure the halo problem which the Pixel Plus -mode has).

    If you have decided to use Pixel/Movie Plus then leave the sharpess value to 0 or 1 since the picture gets too sharp really quickly when using this mode.

    If you have decided to use some other mode (most likely 100 digital scan since double lines is useless due to flickering) then you can raise the sharpness to somewhere around 5 or 6 to get a good picture.

    Digital noise reduction is good to leave off or to min since it is mainly useful when using analog sources (with noise).

    Active control is best to leave off since it can mess up your brightness / contrast settings because it tries to adjust these values itself.

    Smart Sound is good to set to Music since this seems to be giving the internal subwoofer a bit more kick.

    That's it. I'll post some more accurate setting values once I get the monster (weighs more than it's owner by the way).
     
  19. Hem

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    Thanks for that Maxi, I think you're right with regard to the sharpness settings as I have been experimenting with leaving this off, although I think I prefer it set to 1 or 2. Will try turning off the active control - although I do have a problem with switching something "off" which is meant to be a feature - and hence an improvement - of the tv.

    Just done the sums, and yep, this tv does weigh in at more than me as well. Here's a tip if you have a wood, laminate or other smooth floor surface - use felt pads on the bottom of the tv stand and you can easily slide the tv across the floor. Very handy I can tell you! Your gonna have fun getting that behemoth out of the box though!!
     
  20. Maxi_TK96

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    Actually the reason why I advice to leave the active control off is that active control can easily "over contrast" the picture during those very sunny days so it is definitely not handy there. On the other hand the feature to automatically (lightly) adjust brightness and contrast according to the lighting conditions can be very handy most of the time. This being said best to leave this matter to the real expert (meaning end user) to be decided :)

    Heheheh...that's why the poor transportation fellows will carry the monster all the way to my living room (I live on the 3rd floor) and I even arranged them to put together the custom made tv stand so I don't have to fiddle with that. The stand is really useful since you can cram in a serious amount of hardware. I can easily imagine that it could hold VCR, a digital tv receiver and a slim DVD player.

    Yes, slideable padding has already been arranged :)
     
  21. Cynthia 7

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    That is so disappointing Maxi to have delivery delayed;
    particularly when there's a special holiday and time to enjoy your new television.

    I have always been happy with Philips AV products. I had a 27" Philips Hi-Fi set, as it was called at the time, built in Scandinavia, top of the range model. Sound and picture were superb and the bass (adjustable) was as good as a subwoofer. It eventually ended up in the bedroom, and aged 15 years we gave it away as the colours had a blue bias although the picture was clear. I also bought a 21" Philips matchline with two speakers secondhand, for the breakfast room come study. That is still fine. Shame if Philips give up their CRTs altogether. I don't know anyone who has yet bought a plasma; maybe they are waiting for teething problems with logos to be resolved.

    Thank you for the settings information, I have made note of these. Between you and Hem I have some good guidelines, otherwise it is a bit of a minefield. I envy you having your television delivered and set up, including the stand. Mine is only meant to be to the door but I shall bribe them to at least bring it inside. Apparently most refuse to take it out of the box for you as they are not covered by insurance in those surroundings. I know my husband can't do it on his own and his friends always have bad backs for anything like that!!!

    You will be counting the days to happiness in the shape of a tv!!!
     
  22. Maxi_TK96

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    Heheh...thanx for the warm words Cynthia. Waiting will not be so bad since the Sony is a ok telly. If one likes traditional motion compensation without oversampling then this telly is fine for them. Unfortunately I don't fall to that group but then again the picture which the Sony gives is not too far off from my preferences. The only real problem with this television (concerning the end user) is that activation of the the less aggressive (and bug free) motion compensation happens via service menu where regular users normally shouldn't have to go. The Philips telly has all of these digital modes nicely inside the menu where as Sony hides these for no apparent reason. Generally it seems that the Philips telly has more options to fiddle with meaning you can customize the telly pretty far according to your own preferences.

    I seriously hope that you have a firm tv-stand ready for this monster. Remember that it weighs more than a (large) grown man ! :)
     
  23. Cynthia 7

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    Thanks Maxi for your reply. It doesn't sound as if you are suffering too much waiting for your PW9618. You obviously have a good Sony set there. A bit of a pain having to access the service menu, however, to alter motion compensation.

    Only four more days to go for your big delivery, and wow, it is a big box! Your delivery men will probably require a flat bed to rest for a while after carrying that up three flights of stairs!
     
  24. Cynthia 7

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    My Philips PW9618 was so worth waiting for!!!

    I finally took delivery of this television on Thursday afternoon although it sat in its box until Friday when my husband bribed two friends with whisky to help him put it on the Philips stand! They pretended to stagger around after bent double so they needed a second whisky to straighten up!

    Its appearance is almost Germanic or Scandinavian, substantial, well built, clean lines of matt silver, attractive to my eyes.

    The sound, as Hem said, is outstanding, even without the wireless speakers. On the old Sony, the sound was so muffled the volume had to be high and even then it was sometimes unintelligible. On this television you can hear every word clearly even at low volume. I leave it on Speech setting but change it to Music for the music channels, as recommended by Maxi, and the integrated subwoofer can really be heard. I cannot get the wireless speakers to work, maybe because of a cordless phone there and disconnected Polk speakers? I did all the menu settings correctly, placed the wireless receiver box more than 2 metres away, on a table, changed channel on it, etc.Left the wireless transmitter module hanging loose, and clipped to the tv. Now I shall get a cable to hard wire it in as they suggest, only a minor glitch.

    The picture is so clear and natural (after considerable tweaking on my part) and with the help of all those who gave me their settings. The factory settings weren't too bad although brightness was too much at 70. I am still dithering over Active Control. I had it off as Maxi recommended then Hem mentioned it was part of their features so I put it back on. It does alter the personal settings tremendously. I am sitting on the fence over it at present. I like the tint on cool as it gives a more natural picture not to see everyone with suntans. I cannot find any fault at all with this model, no smearing, nasty lines etc. It is perfect on Sky channels, even the ones with less bandwith. Analogue has some shimmering as our signal is not good. Hem, I think it must be your Sky signal quality that is letting you down.

    I thought at first I had geometry problems, having read that Moonbase had trouble, sorry to hear that Moonbase and hope it is now fixed. Everyone's head seemed enlarged, very long. I then discovered I had inadvertently switched the Sky box to 4:3 when i checked I definitely had RGB in my Picture Settings. The auto aspect is so good with this set, you are not really aware it is changing at all, it's done so smoothly. The menu is easily accessible and easy to alter. The remote control is a joy to use. Clearly laid out, quite heavy, user friends, it reeks of quality and looks so smart.

    My husband was meant to be watching cricket at Lords on Saturday but it was cold and wet so he didn't go, much to my disappointment! I have had to suffer rugby and cricket ad nauseam (and some football, watched on 100Hz digital scan). When I've had it to myself I lie out on the sofa, plenty of cushions, big ginger cat keeping me warm, and I'm in heaven.
     
  25. Hem

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    Excellent news, really glad you're happy with this purchase - I was worried if things hadn't been good you would be hunting me down for recommending it!! Bad news with the surrounds, when you say not working do you mean no signal at all? Have you tried the speaker test in the menu, if so and still no dice I would get on to to either Philips or the supplier, maybe you have a duff transmitter box. I'm sure you've already checked, but the tv menu settings do have to correlate with whichever of the 4 bands you have selected on the reciever box. i very much doubt either your telephone or speakers are the source of the problem.
     
  26. scrapbook

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    Cynthia,

    Good to hear you are enjoying your TV.

    I am currently considering a Philips TV myself...I have been playing around with settings and the like in the shops and these are my intial impressions....(my main concern being the halo effect)..

    With Pixel Plus there seems to be a fail amount of the Halo effect. With Movie Plus on the effect seems to reduce considerably, but still present.

    With 100HZ Dynamic Scan option the Halo effect is reduced to nil.

    ...would you say they are about right?
     
  27. Maxi_TK96

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    As far as Pixel Plus TVs go I would not recommend bying them unless you are fond with Pixel Plus (oversampling and motion compensation) because the other digital modes (not including Movie Plus since it is a corrected version of Pixel Plus) are pretty much the same stuff which you can find on many other televisions.

    As far as the halo problem goes I'll be getting my own set on Friday (anxious, anxious,...) and this will be one of the first things which I will be testing. I remember the start of Daredevil being one of those movies where the halo effect was apparent on my old 9527. This being said even back then I didn't think that the halo issue was not that annoying but this being said if Philips manage to correct or atleat improve concerning this issue (9618 has Pixel Plus v1.5 which is the Movie Plus mode) then this set will become close to perfect in my opinion.
     
  28. scrapbook

    scrapbook
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    (How do you do that 'quote box' thing? - I must read the FAQ's!)

    The problem with most other TV's they all seem to have some issues, be it not enough scarts, geometry problems, moire problems so on and so forth.

    None of this seems to effect the 9618 range, so if i can turn off the 'Halo' then it sounds like the perfect TV, even it means that you are not utilising the full Pixel/Movie Plus of the TV.

    However would be interested in your feedback of the effectiveness of Movie Plus!
     
  29. Maxi_TK96

    Maxi_TK96
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    It's very easy actually. After the actual post on the right side of the screen there are two links labelled edit and quote :)

    I just realized the I don't actually remember whether the halo effect was only the bane of Pixel Plus -mode or whether it was also apparent when using other digital modes too ? As said I'll get the set on Friday but maybe Cynthia can give us an answer sooner ? Basically the question is as follows: does the halo effect concern only Pixel Plus and does Movie Plus cure the problem ?
     
  30. Maxi_TK96

    Maxi_TK96
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    I just had the 36PW9618 delivered and had the chance to briefly review the television: absolutely brilliant! Compared to the Sony (HQ100) the motion compensation when using Movie Plus mode is dead on the way I like it - smooth. Also the amount of details is staggering. The only "problem" with this tv is the geometry which is a bit off but then again after having 9525 and 9527 this set still has the best geometry I have seen. No dark patches anywhere.

    I just watched Matrix Revolutions (the part where the machines invade the city) and was immensely impressed - this is like it should be. As far as comprehensive review goes this will have to wait until Monday - I have some serious watching to do. For weeks this is the first time when I get excited about the prospect of devoting the entire weekend to movies :)
     

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