pioneer VSA-AX10is or denon AVC-1SE



Hi,ive got four amps to choose from.
pioneer vsa- ax10is,
denon avc-1se
yamaha rx-v4600 or the
denon 3805,
all i want is a good quality sounding amp that delivers,
i have just sold a yamaha dsp-ax1 i loved that amp but i want to update,
the pioneer has thx ultra 2, does this make a lot of difference to the sound quality, if anyone can help me on here i would like to hear your comments



Distinguished Member

You need to give more info for meaningful replies:

What's your budget?
What speakers?
How large is your listening room?
Listening level preferences?



Hi, my budget is £1200 but i was looking for second hand if i could get hold
of one, my set up is mission m74 front, mission 77ds, cyrus cls-50c, and a sony sub,
room size is 16 feet x 13 feet,


Active Member
how much did you sell it for eventually? I thought you might be keeping it after you took it off ebay. If i were you i'd go for the Denon or the Pioneer. The internal amplification of the pioneer and denon avc-a1se would be much better than the Yamaha 4600 or the 3805. I think you'll be dissapointed with either the Yamaha or the Denon 3805. You said before you wanted something with auto setup, all in all i think the Pioneer would be best. Though frankly to hear it properly you would need to upgrade your speakers. Those missions are good but an amp of the quality of the Pioneer needs something alot better. As far as i know THX Ultra 2 is a standard that an amp has to reach (very high) in order to get that certification. As its a THX amp it will have THX post processing, i've never used it myself but i don't think it makes a huge difference.



Well-known Member
Also consider the marantz 8500 or 9600

I think most of these amps would be more capable than the speakers though, i.e. to get the best you may want to upgrade that area too, maybe later though.

I have heard from people that had your amp and the a1 that also got yamaha 2500 that they could instantly hear a difference, so this might be soemthing to take onboard, with the 2500 generaly being on par with the 3805.


i took my dspax1 off ebay because somebody offered me £500,
thats the price i wanted so i was happy,
i went to sevenoaks hifi today and asked advice on the four amps,
he said the same, the pioneer is the older amp but its a damn good amp, thats the one he suggested, or the next one up would be the denon 4306 or the yamaha Z9 which is about £3,500 just a bit to much to splash out for me,
so i think i will try the AX10is and upgrade the speakers later.



Well-known Member
It's got to be down to the Denon or the Pioneer.
What interfaces do you want to use? DVI switching?
What disc players do you want to chose? I or P? HDMI? iLink? SACD? DVD-A?
What colour do you want it to be? gold, silver, black?
Will you use a video processor? Switching? Interlaced? HDMI? SDI?
Lots of questions, but it's not a toss of a coin.



Well-known Member
Z9 for £3,500? it wasnt that much when it first came out....£3,200 if i remember right, and that was a while ago now, should be under £3,000 far as im concerned....especially with the 7 channel version of the Denon behemoth at just over £2,000 brand new.....


Well-known Member
if you go with the Denon i can recommend Monitor Audio speakers, they match up well.....


Well-known Member
just checked sevenoaks website, £3,000 for the Z9....

thought so...heh


Well-known Member
The Denon A1 range is more powerful and up market than the A11 range.
So it might be that the older A1SE sounds better and more powerful than the new A11XV.... but without Ultra2 and other features you may never use.
For this reason I think a cheap Denon A1SE or A1SR would be a bargain.

Certainly my Denon K-A1SE sounded better than its rivals, including the Pioneer AX10, when I bought it. I havn't heard the Yamaha Z9 though.

I think each manufacturer has its own house sound. I think the Pioneer sound is 'bright', the Denon sound is 'warm' and the Yamaha sound is somewhere in between.


Active Member
the new quad speakers are supposedly very good and don't have metal dome tweeters.

DSP-Z9's usually go for around £1700 ish on ebay, one went for £1400 on the 31st, I'm sure this would be be better than the Pioneer or the Denon. There is a DSP-Z9 on ebay at the moment (currently at £800). The guy has no feedback so it may well go for less than usual but then it would mean cash on collection to be safe.

I'm determined an AX1 after trying out yours :D , can't even imagine how good a Z9 would sound.

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