Pioneer SCLX77 Buffer when streaming DNLA BUbble uPnP

McTrucky

Active Member
Hi folks,

I have been using Bubble uPnP to stream HiRes audio from Qobuz - and it has been working fine. However, I have just moved house and the internet speed I am now getting has dropped from a 35mb average over copper with Vodafone Broadband to a 14Mb average over a microwave link from BroadwayPartners.

If I use Bubble with the Pioneer SCLX77 as the renderer, and CD quality stream, it plays for maybe ten seconds or so, then the buffer drops from 100 down until the music stops for five or six seconds while the buffer recovers and then plays for a few seconds and buffer runs down and so on.

So my questions are - do I have enough bandwidth to stream HD music?
Is there a way to tweak the AVR or the Bubble controller to better manage the buffer?

(I recall having a similar buffer issue using ultra hi res stream to the amp at my old house - but thought that was down to a bottleneck in the amp; guess it could have been bandwidth - but 35mb stream seems plenty wide enough does it not?)

On Netflix on my Sony 55xf9005 with its embedded Netflix app, I am seeing difficulty playing HD and it tends to hop between 720 and 1080 - even the 4k stuff. But using Chromecast to play Qobuz audio works without drop outs, but I think the quality is throttling back.

It is not the wifi link. I thought it was - so you can imagine my disappointment when an all singing and dancing new router I installed today made no difference. I will put some flac files on the home PC and use that as the library and stream form there just to prove the home network is not the issue.
 

Rodders53

Distinguished Member
I'm no expert on this but your move from Fibre to the Cabinet over copper (or aluminium) to your home with Vodafone (measure 35Mbit/s download speed) to 14Mbit/s measure over a microwave link from BroadwayPartners Rural Broadband Provider | Broadway Broadband
would seem to be the issue...

Check with your ISP if they are happy that it is the best you can get (or if there's a contention or interference or mis-pointing issue with the microwave link and infrastucture in your location).

Qobuz - Discover and understand high-quality music with Qobuz streaming and downloads. states
With a theoretical maximum bitrate of 13 Mb/s, an ADSL is adequate for CD quality streaming (at 1.411 Mb/s). For Hi-Res sound streaming at a bitrate of 9.2 Mb/s, it is clear that you can quickly reach the ADSL limit.
especially with other devices using the interweb...

You ain't never going to do UHD TV streaming with a connection under 20Mbit/s.
Netflix suggest SD needs 3Mbit/s, HD 5 and 4K/UHD 25.

BBC iPlayer states
You'll need an internet connection of 24MBit/s for the full 3840 pixel Ultra HD experience or 12MBit/s for 2560 pixel Ultra HD.
and 3.5 to 5 Mbit/s for their 720p HD offering.

Speak to your new ISP.
 

McTrucky

Active Member
Yes, definitely a bandwidth issue. I had no idea that the streaming services needed so much girth.
Playing flac files home ripped on a PC, so not the finest quality, across the wifi is faultless.

The microwave link infrastructure is to be upgraded in the next couple of weeks to a nominal 50mb, with a 30mb guarantee - so I guess I just need to be patient. Gives me an excuse to start playing vinyl I guess.
 

Jamie

Distinguished Member
Playing flac files home ripped on a PC, so not the finest quality, across the wifi is faultless.
Nothing wrong with self ripped files from a CD.
 

Rodders53

Distinguished Member
FLAC files from a CD rip will be lower streamed bitrate than uncompressed WAV / PCM CD files over the network.
Audibly the same, of course - just less 'demanding'.

Uncompressed PAL analogue TV 576i used 270 Mbit/s links between studios and to the transmitters. Serial digital interface - Wikipedia has the uncompressed rates for HD and UHD... Thank goodness we have H264 and H265 codecs!

50Mbit/s with 30 Mbit/s guarantee should be OK as long as there's only one user of that UHD at any time (nor anything else with heavy data use at the same time in the home).
 

McTrucky

Active Member
Nothing wrong with self ripped files from a CD.
Yes sounds pretty good. But when we are talking about a cd player in a computer that costs roughly £20, hard to believe that it provides the same quality transport as a hifi separate cd player. So a flac ripped on the computer is going to be lower audio quality than a decent CD player reading the same source cd.
 

Jamie

Distinguished Member
Not the case, its digital data on a CD. In fact the CD player has to read the data in real time so theres possibilty of errors cropping up, A ripping program can take as long as it needs and verify the data against an online database to ensure accuracy
 

McTrucky

Active Member
When I ripped the cds, it was a lot quicker than real-time. And pretty sure there was no external error correction in place.

But very interested in how to do it 'properly ' in future. Will have a Google.
 

McTrucky

Active Member
I'm no expert on this but your move from Fibre to the Cabinet over copper (or aluminium) to your home with Vodafone (measure 35Mbit/s download speed) to 14Mbit/s measure over a microwave link from BroadwayPartners Rural Broadband Provider | Broadway Broadband
would seem to be the issue...

Check with your ISP if they are happy that it is the best you can get (or if there's a contention or interference or mis-pointing issue with the microwave link and infrastucture in your location).

Qobuz - Discover and understand high-quality music with Qobuz streaming and downloads. states

especially with other devices using the interweb...

You ain't never going to do UHD TV streaming with a connection under 20Mbit/s.
Netflix suggest SD needs 3Mbit/s, HD 5 and 4K/UHD 25.

BBC iPlayer states

and 3.5 to 5 Mbit/s for their 720p HD offering.

Speak to your new ISP.
So still struggling with this.

I am, getting a fairly constant 13 to 15mb broadband, but the amp media player buffer counts down and stops the music until it refreshes after 10 seconds or so and then carries on.
If I stream to a different renderer (Revo for instance) playback is uninterrupted.
This is with a 1411kbps stream.

However if I stream the same 1411kbps stream from a library on my LAN, there is no buffer issue, which clearly points to the broadband being to blame. But I am only streaming 1.5mb, about 10%of the available bandwidth - and why would other renderers have no issue.

The avr is cabled to the router/WiFi hub (100mb port on the amp into a gigabit port on the router).

Any bright ideas on Pioneer or Bubble settings to tweak?
 

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