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Pioneer MXE1 or 435

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by kwijibo, Sep 1, 2004.

  1. kwijibo

    kwijibo
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    What to do?

    I have been told that effectively, apart from cosmetics, the MXE1 is the same screen with the same new glass and filter etc and the forthcoming 435.

    Is this true? If not what are the differences, and bearing in mind I will use it with a HCPC, what is my best option? I have the cash burning a whole and waiting for the right plasma. Its driving me mad :mad:
     
  2. Mantorok

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    I thought the MXE1 uses the 4th gen panel. ie 1 billion colours instead of the 5th gen's 7 billion colours.

    I too am considering the MXE1 but want to know if the 435's are better in terms of picture quality.

    Someone out there must know for sure?
     
  3. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    kwijibo

    Not true - the New TV models have a new non glass front filter that's bonded directly to the Plasma structure to cut down on internal reflections.

    The MXE1 Display model is NEW and will be current for at least another twelve months.

    The Display and TV model's share the same underlying Pixel structure and all digital video processing but connectivity, signal compatibility and menu's are different.

    For a HTPC I'd say the MXE1 will be the better bet - if you want Digital (DVI) connectivity - as the TV models only have an Analogue HD15 (VGA) PC Input; though you can use the HDMI Input on the Media Box with a HTPC but cant input the Displays Native Rate.

    We wont get to see one of the NEW TV models for another few weeks so cant say how it compares side by side with an MXE1 Display.

    Best regards

    Joe
     
  4. SimonO

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    The 435 will have to be a big improvement over the 434 to better the MXE1 with Sky IMO...
     
  5. Mr. Wilby

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    Simon, before you purchased the mxe1 I guess you compared it against the 434?

    I've seen a 434 but I am wondering what sort of improvement I might expect to see on the mxe1... I don't think the 434 I saw was terribly well setup (an old NEC looked far more vibrant and had blacker blacks - a common pioneer observation)...

    Would you be willing to share your thoughts?

    Thanks!
     
  6. SimonO

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    Firstly, the relative lack of contrast compared to Panasonic is not an issue in daylight IMO... In a dark room it's not as good and blacks do look a bit grey, however there is much better detail in the 'greys' than the Panasonic IMO, so it's swings and roundabouts...

    I've always found the picture on the 434HDE a bit grainy from analogue sources and the MXE1 just doesn't suffer from the same problem... Obviously I get the usual blocky picture on the low bitrate channels but IMO it's by far the best picture I've seen from Sky on a plasma...

    If you need a digital tuner and HDMI go for the 435, otherwise the MXE1 is the way to go...
     
  7. Mr. Wilby

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    Simon, thanks for taking the time to write that. I don't need a tuner at the moment as I'll be using a Freeview box for that. However, I do miss the HDCP port on the MXE1 which is why I'm considering an Aurora expansion card...

    Thanks for setting my mind at rest WRT the mxe1 though. Its so hard to tell about these things when you can't see one. I'm pretty sure the 434 I saw just wasn't setup at its best.
     
  8. SimonO

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    I've got an SDI DVD player which I'll run with a scaler sometime soon so I wasn't worried about the lack of HDCP and I'm still not convinced that HDMI scaled to 768 will be any better than analogue at native resolution... My DVD player looks fantastic at 480p into the MXE1... :thumbsup:
     
  9. Rob

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    Well I can't recommend the MXE-1 enough. Having owned one for a few weeks now, it looks fantastic BUT like any other plasma it does need a good signal. DVDs & a decent freeview box will look great via the analogue inputs, but If youre planning to use a HCPC, as I do you'll be amazed at the difference an all digital path at native rate can make, both for TV & DVD.

    Rob.
     
  10. Mr. Wilby

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    Yep, I also have a HTPC which is what originally set me off on this route... I currently use that to drive a PJ at native rate and thought it might be worth exploring the same trick for the plasma.

    Rob - how do you handle the refresh rates with the HTPC and mxe-1? If you're watching a pal disc, do you use a pal refresh rate (likewise for NTSC) or do you let the MXE-1 perform frame rate conversion?
     
  11. Joe Fernand

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    Hello all

    The MXE1 has three 'Modes' of Frame Rate Conversion (FRC) -

    Mode 1 (default) like all other MXE's converts 50 and 60 Hz signals to 70/75Hz.

    Mode 2 (accessible through the Service menu) runs 60Hz at 60Hz and 50Hz at 100Hz; its the smoothest looking motion I've seen so far on any range of Displays.

    Mode 3 (accessible through the Service menu) is for use with 24Frame HD camera's in TV studio's.

    Best regards

    Joe

    Mr Wiliby you have a PM :)
     
  12. Loafer316

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    Hi Joe! i've set up my mxe1 now however have no idea how to set it to mode 2 to get smooth pans on playback i.e coverting 50Hz to 100Hz etc I have the 575 running prog scan. On PAL it runs at 625p 50Hz and on NTSC it gives you the option of running in normal or advanced purecinema....but it seems all a bit confusing. Is there a better way i can improve the smooth pans i've only had it running for about 24hrs in total.

    Otherwise picture quality is stunning! i still have to use a PC on it to play HDTV films in panel's native resolution...once i have that setup it should really improve the picture...but that is another kettle of fish as i will need to set the correct refresh rates and timings? :rolleyes:

    thxs
     
  13. Mr. Wilby

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    Joe, thanks for the PM.

    I've actually read the manual a few times now (even though I don't own a set yet)... but Rob, you were the first person I've seen that said they're using this display with HTPC. Most people seem to be using it in conjunction with SDI-modded DVD players.

    Am just curious how you have Windows (assumption) configured WRT refresh rates etc.
     
  14. philipb

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    I have my MXE1 set to mode 2, and feed it a 60Hz signal from a HTPC at native resolution. Smooth pans, no tearing. Heaps better than the 433MXE which preceded it. So far, using the PC as the source, 1024x768 at 60Hz has been best for Sky via a Sweetspot card and DVDs via SDI.

    I have a SDI modded Denon 2900 hooked to the HTPC and outputting via DVI, and also component analogue direct to the plasma. Switching between the two inputs, PQ is almost identical. A bit more detail using the digital route. This just shows what a good analogue component signal the Denon players can produce.

    My SDI modded Sky+ box should have been delivered today and I will be using the SDI route for that. The 2900 will for the time being output via component. Mind you DVDs played on the PC using theatertek are even better again, but I prefer the user friendliness of the 2900 and its much better audio performance.

    The MXE1 is in my view the best all round performer. Some other plasmas can do certain things a bit better, but nothing does everything as well as the MXE1 does.
     
  15. Loafer316

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    any pointer on how to get into the service menu? and change to mode 2? infact complete guide would be great!! :D :zonked:
     
  16. Mr. Wilby

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    I've had a surf around on AVF regarding the aurora cards. Whilst reading, I was reminded again that unless you have an expansion board in place, input 1 (dsub IIRC) is very restricted.

    According to the manual it won't accept 720p (PC signal) nor any video signals unless a board is present. Fine - in all honesty I will need one anyway.

    However, the interesting thing I spotted is that with a video board present, input 1 (dsub) will accept 720p @ 50 and 60hz (video), but panel native res (1280 x 768) only at 56, 60 and 70hz.

    Would this cause judder for PAL-based (25fps) material fed into input 1?

    Furthermore, assuming I am using the DVI port to connect HTPC -> MXE1. The manual (page 9) indicates that only 56 and 60hz are supported via DVI @ native resolution (1280 x 768).

    Again, isn't that going to be a problem for PAL DVDs?

    Or... do we get out of jail by virtue of PAL60 somehow?

    This are probably stupid/basic questions, but I am now somewhat confused!
     
  17. SimonO

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    No I don't think you're confused... The specs for both PC inputs exclude 50Hz (although the 43" looks like it might accept 75Hz via analogue RGB), but has anyone actually tried it??? What the specs say and what the panel does may be very different, unfortunately I've no way of testing it, so you'll have to rely on someone else...

    Don't forget these inputs were never intended for video...

    It was my understanding that the previous MXE wouldn't allow native resolution via the card slot, where as the new MXE1 will, but you're still relying on a third party to provide a solution...

    What effect the FRC modes have on the PC inputs is anyones guess (my guess is not a lot)...
     
  18. Rob

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    Mr Wilby,

    I'm running 1024 x 768@50 hz from the PC, directly to the DVI port. Most of my stuff (around 200 movies + music etc) is stored on hard disc. Using Xlobby as an interface & Theatertek as a player, I find this gives me fantastic results both in terms of quality and ease of use. I'm also using the Nebula TV card, which again looks great, the best I've seen TV look.

    I'd be interested in trying an SDI modded freeview box. Is there such a thing? I dont have $ky, but have a PMS SDI card on the PC, I'd be interested to know if such a thing exists.

    Rob
     
  19. SimonO

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    Thanks Rob... There you go Mr. Wilby, don't trust the specs!!! I'd be interested to know what effect FRC Mode 1 and 2 have on 50Hz via DVI, Rob are you able to confirm the vertical refresh rate???
     
  20. Mr. Wilby

    Mr. Wilby
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    Indeed.

    Rob, sounds like we have similar setups (htpc, nebula card) so its really good to read your comments.

    Thanks to you both :) you've set my mind at rest.
     
  21. Rob

    Rob
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    Not sure if the FRC modes affect the PC inputs or not. The PC is set through powerstrip to run 1024/768@50, so the panel will accept this. Motion seems fine, although I too would like to try mode 2 to see if there is any improvement.

    Does anybody know how to access the secret menu ?
     
  22. SimonO

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    Rob, you've got at PM... Let us know how you get on...
     
  23. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    Simon - Nice work; the Sam Sensible approach to Service menu's.

    Rob - for Service Menu access I'd always advise you to contact your dealer.

    I know folk on the AV Forums like this info to always be public knowledge but please be aware with devices that have the option for RS232 control you can inadvertently switch off all Front Panel and IR control in the Service Menu - bit tricky that one; unless your set-up to use RS232.

    Best regards

    Joe
     
  24. SimonO

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    I got into the service menu by accident!!! It's not that cryptic... :D
     
  25. Rob

    Rob
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    Thanks guys :smashin:
     
  26. SimonO

    SimonO
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  27. Rob

    Rob
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    Cheers,

    I'll give it a go and see what happens.

    Having checked the 'secret' menu, it seems the panel was set on mode 2 anyway.

    Sorry Joe, should have asked you first! :blush:
     
  28. Loafer316

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    Trust me Rob i know how you feel! :blush:
     
  29. SimonO

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    Hello Rob... Did you try the software..?
     
  30. Rob

    Rob
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    Hi Simon,

    No I haven't had a chance. I'll give it a go hopefully this week.

    Cheers Rob.
     

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