1. Join Now

    AVForums.com uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Pioneer DV59-AVi ... HELP!!!! S.O.S. HELP!!!!

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by MarcoBiscotti, Oct 14, 2005.

  1. MarcoBiscotti

    MarcoBiscotti
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    This machine is giving me so many problems I just don't know what to do!!!


    First, I'll start by giving a breakdown of my setup...


    The Pioneer is connected via component cable to an HD Leeza scaler and output to my DLP front projector at a native 1280x720 res (60Hz).


    The image I am getting from the Pionner is plain UGLY!

    Loads of digital noise and artifacts, and it does NOT handle motion sequences well at all!


    I have the Pure Cinema mode turned OFF, and the progressive scan is set to 'Auto 1' which is supposed to be the best de-interlacing function.


    Let me explain what I am seeing...


    First of all, the image appears extremely soft and in detailed shots (such as a forest of trees or a close-up of a brick wall) the ammount of digital noise disturbance and scattered pixels is terrible and very distracting!


    Another major issue I have is with compression artifacts, especially noticeable in motion sequences!

    Often, the result of such appears in the form of an interlacing error where a flicker is seen in solid lines and any hard straight edges of the image experience a slight jitter which is very quick and subtle but still quite apparent if one were to watch with a discerning eye.

    It's very distracting and downright ugly!

    It also happens to be most apparent in animated titles for some reason. I have some R2 PAL DVD's of The Charlie Brown & Snoopy Show and the effect renders them almost unwatchable!


    I've tried nearly every progressive mode too..


    For example, when Charlie Brown turns his head to speak to Schroeder, the solid lines around his mouth flicker and break up. Of course this all happens within a matter of single seconds, but it is consistent when watching DVD's.

    I've never noticed it to be as bad as these R2 German sets which I have, and I am certain that it cannot be an issue with the DVD's themselves as they have received all around rave reviews on Amazon.de and elsewhere that I have checked with excellent feedback in regards to the image quality. The restoration done to the video transfers are far superior to the Charlie Brown DVD's I've previously owned from Paramount in R1. So I can only guess that my setup is to blame!



    I'm just really unhappy overall with the performance of my Pioneer, and for the price I paid for it, I really would have expected better quality!

    I cannot believe that what I am seeing howver, is an accepted standard amongst these players. In fact, it's impossible!


    The 59-AVi is supposed to be a top-of-the line contender, voted "Player Of The Year" by Home Theater Secrets last Fall and has been fishing the highest reviews accross the board. For the $1,000 + price tag I paid for this unit, I am certainly NOT seeing equal quality!!



    Can anyone please help me out and offer feedback as to what the issues might be?




    MAJOR UPDATE:


    I now have an even bigger problem!!!

    I just went to turn on the Pioneer to see what I could do with the remote functions, perhaps to test out the "fast-slow" function of the progressive option in the top menu.

    As I fired up the DLP and switched the Arcam amp to the appropriate channel - when the Pioneer screen came into view, the entire image was distorted and appeared in split screen with the borders of the menu image being cut off at either end by the split sides of the screen frame!

    It almost appears as if someone placed a mirror down the center of my screen causing the image to double, and than lowered the brightness and contrast levels making it very difficult to see altogether!

    How on earth did this happen and what the hell do I do about this now?!

    PLEASE HELP ME OUT!!!
     
  2. PJTX100

    PJTX100
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2004
    Messages:
    8,129
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Ratings:
    +562
    If it were me I'd temporarily plug the DVD straight into the projector and go from there...PJ
     
  3. Kazman

    Kazman
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2004
    Messages:
    5,252
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    86
    Location:
    Luton, Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +136
    First thing to check is to make sure it is the DVD player at fault and not the Scaler or Projector.

    Have you tried the DVD player in another system, or connected directly to the Projector? Does the DVD player itself have any upscaling capability?

    If the DVD works in another system, the issue may very well lay elsewhere.
     
  4. MarcoBiscotti

    MarcoBiscotti
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Well I should add that I also have a $250 JVC SA-602 player connected to a seperate channel that looks A LOT better than the $1000+ Pioneer!


    The JVC is not perfect either, I still notice quite a bit of digital noise and the picture is still a little soft, but it looks MUCH better than the Pioneer which is in a completely different range!

    The reason I'm not complaining about the quality of the JVC so much, is because I can't really expect to see pristine image from a semi-budget range player. To be fair, the JVC is supposed to be a pretty sh*tty unit.


    Is it possible that I'm having these problems due to my cable connections?


    I've read everywhere that the Pioneer really excels when running HDMI and upconverting from 1080.

    Unfortunately my Arcam amps won't allow me to connect HDMI but my dealer has ordered me some adaptors so he should be coming in within the next few weeks to run new cables.

    Do you guys think that this might fix the problem, or does it sound more likely that I have a faulty player?


    Also... what the hell happened that all of a sudden the Pioneer is causing my screen to split and darken?!?


    This is all such a mess!!!
     
  5. MarcoBiscotti

    MarcoBiscotti
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    And as for the R2 PAL Charlie Brown DVD's that I've cited as example... I'm experiencing the same interlace-like effects in both players.


    Admittedly, the Pioneer (prior to it going completely screwy and causing my screen to divide and split the image) did look a hell of a lot worse.


    But the JVC also showed significant signs of these interlace-like effects on my animated PAL DVD's... perhaps it's just a sh*tty player as I've mentioned?


    I don't understand how the Pioneer could look so bad though.

    Do you guys honestly think that Pioneer would allow their top Elite-line players to offer such bad resolution when connecting component cables?


    I really want to know if this could simply be an issue of running the wrong connections... but I just can't imagine that even a $1,000+ DVD player could offer such bad pq with any cables, it doesn't seem right!!!


    PS - I also notice about a 0.5 - 1 second freeze up on layer changes. Is that normal?

    My cheapie JVC doesn't register layer changes at all... :x
     
  6. MarcoBiscotti

    MarcoBiscotti
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Any other opinions/suggestions?
     
  7. MarcoBiscotti

    MarcoBiscotti
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    I just received the new limited edition R2 PAL German box set of "A Fistfull Of Dollars" and "A Few Dollars More" and tested them out on the setup...


    Once again, the entire image appears wavy for lack of a better description. It almost looks like a camera-heat effect, you know when you're driving down the highway on a scorching hot afternoon in the summer and you look down the horizon and the road appears to flutter in the heat in a wave-like motion?

    Well that's the effect I'm seeing with these PAL discs, only not as extreme. Anywhere where there is written text, such a sign post, etc, it becomes blatantly obvious as you can see the letters sort of bounce and flutter. The image just looks very unstable.

    Can anyone else PLEASE help me out with this?

    Is it all possible that it's just a combination of me running component cables through to a not-so-great DVD player and that when I've got HDMI wired and connected to the Pioneer Elite, my problems will be resolved?

    Please help me out, this is really killing me!!!
     
  8. MarcoBiscotti

    MarcoBiscotti
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Anyone at all?

    :lease:
     
  9. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    17,133
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Ratings:
    +1,277
    turn deinterlacing OFF on the Pioneer

    Output interlaced in SD connectors of HDL (Not HD)

    Do a hard reset of the HDL

    Change output resolution of the HDL to 1280 x 720@50 / 60Hz according to DVD

    report back
     
  10. MarcoBiscotti

    MarcoBiscotti
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    Nic, I feel silly asking this question but I'm having difficulty deslecting the inerlacing function on the player.

    Do I simply do this by turning "on" progressive scan mode?


    If so, that's a bit of a problem because it causes my screen to split down the center, doubling the image as though there were a mirror placed in the middle of the screen...

    I don't know how to get around this but I assume it's the result of outputting a progressive signal to a device which is expecting an interlaced input signal?
     
  11. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    17,133
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Ratings:
    +1,277
    PS should toggle between on an off

    However the BNC inputs on the HDL are a little unusual. The SD ones will only take interlaced inputs. The HD take progessive and high definition (720p / 1080i), I suspect that is where the issue is.

    Make sure the software is upto date on the HDL.

    Let the HDL do the deinterlacing, it is better at it.

    Is your display HDCP aware?
     
  12. Mike_pt

    Mike_pt
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    I have a pioneer 868, which is the european equivalent of the 59avi, I think.

    I am using the hdmi output scaled to 1280x720 with progressive in auto2 (at the native projector resolution), connected to a sim2 ht300 link and the results are quite good
    I sometimes also connect it to a plasma tv via hdmi-dvi cable at 576p and the results are again quite good, though not as good as with the projector.
    I woudn't really use component outputs for a projector that has dvi or hdmi input, and you'll probably prefer to use the pioneer internal scaling to using an external one.
     
  13. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    17,133
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Ratings:
    +1,277
    But Mike there is a HDL in the middle here, it does have outputs (analogue and digital) to drive the projector in the best way possible. It also has better deinterlacing and the ability to accept either an analogue or digital and interlaced input from the 59. we don't even know if the projector can take a digital input, let alone a HDCP one yet....or whether it can actually be drive at native rate.

    The component outputs are actually very good and is the recommended method of connection for the HDL, a device about 4x the price of the 59 alone.
     
  14. Mike_pt

    Mike_pt
    Guest

    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0
    the best way to drige a digital display like one using a dlp panel is never to have an analogue conversion of the signal in the middle, ie, component, but to keep it digital all the way, avoiding a conversion to analogue and then a reconversion to digital again in the projector or scaler.
    my projector also has a separate processor with deinterlacing/scaling and it costed about 12x the pioneer, but results are better if the signal is outputed via digital(HDMI) already deinterlaced and scaled to the projector.
    I do suspect the scaler might be doing something wrong. I'm not questioning its quality, but it might be misadjusted or have some incompatibility with say, the pioneer deinterlacer (which can be put off with the front panel button). Btw, I use auto2, but I'm in a pal area.
    is it that difficult to try to connect the dvd directly to the projector just for some minutes?
     
  15. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    17,133
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Ratings:
    +1,277
    over to you Mike to solve Marco problem, I'm off on my holidays :)
     

Share This Page

Loading...