Pioneer DV-575 problem

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by Graham, Nov 10, 2004.

  1. Graham

    Graham
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    Hi

    Recently bought a Pioneer multi-region DV-575 from Richer Sounds. Really pleased with it in general, but have noticed tonight that its performance in PAL progressive scan is poor - jaggies are still there, and in fact are worse than when it's set to interlace signal. NTSC progressive scan works faultlessly.

    The strange thing is that even when i'm not using my projector, and just running the player through my Toshiba 28" widescreen (S-video connection), the jaggies are really bad on the TV also. Although the TV can only accept an interlaced signal, if I switch the 'component out' to interlaced from progressive the picture gets less digitally 'jaggy'. This is on the S-Video input, but it's the same through just composite video. Very strange.

    Has anyone else noticed this? My firmware for the player is version 2.05.

    Thanks for any help you can give.
     
  2. Ch3tan

    Ch3tan
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    Ok I have either got a problem with my component out from my 575 or the component in on my TV. Using composite signals the colours are fine. However as soon as I use component the colours are all very red, there is no brown or yellow, just reds. The gold warner bros logo shows up as terracotta. Help! As I said this is only using component out, progressive and interlaced both give this problem.
     
  3. Graham

    Graham
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    Any thoughts on this problem, guys?

    Cheers
     
  4. windfall

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    I would take it back - I dont see any such issue with my player.

    RS are quite good with returns, or just buy another player and see if that does the same thing and if it does not take the older one back and get your money back.

    Its a great player and I am sure no one else has a similar issue otherwise I am sure there would be a few more replies?

    Cheers

    Tone
     
  5. Graham

    Graham
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    Hi Tone

    Thanks for the reply. I will get them to check the player out - I don't think the PAL progressive is 'kicking in' properly. A great test is the start of Chapter 7 (or 8) of R2 Red Dragon - Will's car drives down a road & towards a house by the woods - the roof of the house is riddled with artefacts, as are the diagonal lines on his car. This is true whether interlace or progressive component (575i/575p) are selected going into my Sanyo Z2.

    Very odd.
     
  6. Barzo

    Barzo
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    I am also having an issue with prog scan from 575A. The issue arises, not with PAL prog scan, but NTSC prog scan. In PAL prog scan, I can see a difference - less 'jaggies', and colour registration, while not as brilliant, is more realistic. In NTSC prog scan, however, everything is fine for a few minutes, but then there is a stepping effect, which works its way down the screen - best way to describe it is that the effected part of the image moves sideways a little, so that someone's forehead, for example, might appear out of alignment with the rest of their body. It disappears after a few minutes, but reappears after a while. This happens with all NTSC discs - whether R1, R3 or R0. In interlace mode, NTSC pics are fine.

    I have a JVC 23p37 TV (CRT), which is PAL/NTSC prog scan compatible. I had suspected that the TV was at fault (having read a lot of material here and elsewhere about incompataibilities, and the exclusion clauses in the various manufacturers manuals), but having read this part of the forum, I now wonder. I purchased the 575 from RS a few months ago, so it is still under warranty. I've since updated the firmware with a disc from Pioneer, and this has not dealt with the NTSC issue (original firmware was 1.22). Anyone else having similar problems?
     
  7. Crocodile

    Crocodile
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    Barzo
    Did the MR capability of your 575 remain intact after the firmware upgrade?

    All
    Maybe worth restoring factory defaults (p45 of manual).
     
  8. Pug72

    Pug72
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    I use the player with a Thomson 32WB643 and it plays both PAL and NTSC progressive scan beautifully.
     
  9. Ch3tan

    Ch3tan
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    Just a thought, is your player in auto mode or is it manually set to PAL or NTSC modes?
     
  10. Barzo

    Barzo
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    Yes.
     
  11. Barzo

    Barzo
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    In Auto mode. Have checked. Movement when forced to do NTSC - PAL conversion (with player in PAL mode) is horrible, but, of course, the issue noted does not occur.
     
  12. Graham

    Graham
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    Hi

    I've tried Pal Prog in Auto, Pal & NTSC modes. NTSC makes the problems far worse, but even in PAL or AUTO the progressive scan is really poor. The player's OSD menus get clearer, and pictures maybe get a tiny bit sharper, but jagged edges are not smoothed out in the slightest. Maybe the player just doesn't smooth out PAL images very well? Watched Hannibal in Progressive on Region 1, and it was amazing. I thought there was a problem with PAL when I watched R2 Shaun Of The Dead the other night and even in progressive it looked really jagged when Shaun walks out of his house for the first time and sees the kid with the ball, etc. All brick walls, car grilles etc looked very 'aliasy' and jagged.
     
  13. Graham

    Graham
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    Hi

    Just as an update, apparently it's because the 575 doesn't output 'proper' PAL progressive scan - instead it plays it as a modified NTSC signal, converted into PAL. This is what causes artefacts on a projector trying to process the 575p signal.

    Cheers
     
  14. Mad Jack

    Mad Jack
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    I was considering buying one of these players, but PAL progressive scan was an important feature for me. Thanks for the heads-up! :thumbsup:
     
  15. rickardl

    rickardl
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    Where did you hear/read that? Do you mean that if I play a PAL DVD,
    it will modify it to NTSC and then convert it back to PAL?
     
  16. chukkychukky

    chukkychukky
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    I bought a DV-470 from Digital Depot this week, I have not exerienced any of the issues mentiond above as yet. I have a Infocus X1 PJ and I am feeding it a 576p signal via the VESA adapter.

    I am really pleased with it so far. Also I don't agree with the issue about poor build quality, seems pefectly sturdy and solid to me (and it was replacing my old Sony 725 D)

    PAL progressive scan is beautiful and I haven't even optimised my settings yet.

    I haven't had the chance to watch any NTSC sources yet. I will post something as soon as I do.

    Maybe the one you have is a rogue product - definitley go ack to RS.
     
  17. chukkychukky

    chukkychukky
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    NTSC playback with progressive scan kicks butt too!
     
  18. Graham

    Graham
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    Hi

    I would definitely agree that NTSC progressive is amazing, i've never seen such a good DVD image. I talked to my projector supplier, and he told me about the 575. It's quite common for cheaper players. It's not that it doesn't produce a 575p Pal progressive signal, it's just that that signal is 'transoded', rather than pure PAL progressive apparently - I'm not entirely clear on it! I read a review on the Denon 2200 recently and the reviewer also mentioned about transoded PAL Progressive signals, but pointed ut that the 2200 uses a proper PAL / NTSC decoder.
     
  19. rickardl

    rickardl
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    Hi,

    I suspect it should be 'transcoded', right?
    I am betting that they are talking about the ability to transcode
    NTSC video to PAL video and I could accept that that is not
    a pure PAL signal. I think that transcoded PAL is better known
    as PAL 60.

    But a native PAL source should be no problem, there must be a
    malfunction with your player unit or your display.
     
  20. Mike-M

    Mike-M
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    FWIW I had the same problem with a 575 playing through comp on a 36" Tosh. Took it straight back.
     
  21. Graham

    Graham
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    Hi rickardl

    Yes, sorry you're right - I meant 'transcoded'. At the weekend I tried a Panasonic DVD recorder with progressive scan, and I can confirm that it works very well in Pal Progressive through my projector, with none of the interlacing artefacts that the 575 produces - all the stair-stepping & aliasing from Red Dragon / Jaws vanished when set to pal progressive on the Panny. I would say that for NTSC Prog Scan the 575 is pretty much unbeatable (and a tiny bit sharper than the recorder's playback), but I also wanted Pal Progressive. It's frustrating, because in all other respects the Pioneer is absolutely superb.
     
  22. phil5743

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    This is bad news for me as I currently have a Pioneer 565 and was about to change it for the 575 in order to get the benefit of PAL prog scan and those extra lines of picture. Am I best to stick with the NTSC output of the 565? Any other player is out of the question as I need its ability to play SACD and DVD Audio.
     
  23. rickardl

    rickardl
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    I think there is no cause for alarm. Graham's unit must be
    a defect one and should be returned/replaced/repaired.
    I and many many others are watching progressive PAL with
    no problem whatsoever with the DV-575.
     
  24. CrispyXUK

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    Looks fine on my projector
     
  25. Graham

    Graham
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    Hi guys

    I returned it in the end as I didn't want to take a replacement home and find it had the same problems. As you say it must have been a defective one. Shame, as otherwise it was superb.
     
  26. Graham

    Graham
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    As another thought:

    My Sanyo Z2 definitely displayed the image produced by the 575 in progressive scan as 480p (NTSC) and 575p (PAL), so it must have been doing a progressive signal, it's just that in PAL the Pioneer's de-interlacer did not remove any of the moire / stepping / jagged line artifacts that the DMR-E85 managed to remove when in Pal Progressive. The picture did look a bit sharper, but with artifacts that were identical to those suffered by an interlaced signal.
     
  27. Graham

    Graham
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    Hi

    Just heard back from Pioneer and they said it must be a faulty unit, as it can produce a proper PAL Progressive signal, so that's a relief to people thinking of getting this player.
     
  28. kbgnat

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    hello all,

    well took the plunge today and ended up buying a multi region 575 player from richer sounds. But when i got home and set it up i have problems playing my Hong Kong - All region NTSC discs. It plays with no colour. I asked the salesman if the player would play these discs and he said yes. So is it a problem with my TV or is it a problem with the DVD player unit itself? The player incidently plays UK region 2 DVDs with no problems.

    But I have a huge NTSC asian movie collection.

    Thanks for any help you guys can offer.
     
  29. Ch3tan

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    If you press fast forward on the dvd player and then press the on button it will cycle between NTSC > AUTO and PAL modes. See if setting the mode to PAL or NTSC works. It sounds like your Tv is unable to take an NTSC signal so you may have to set your dvd player to output PAL.
     
  30. kbgnat

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    thanks for the prompt reply.

    so are you saying that the player is able to play Asian all region NTSC discs?
    I think i have tried setting it the way you suggest, but don't know if i am doing it correctly. is there any indication on the tv or on the player itself to say that it has been switched to NTSC/PAL/Auto?

    do you think i need to set it to give a PAL output? if so, then why does it work with my UK DVD's, but as soon as i put in a Hong Kong DVD, the colour dissappears? does it change the output signal depending on what disk is put in?

    sorry for all the questions. I am a real newb with this.

    thanks again.
     

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