pioneer 51fd jitter measurements.

lbstyling

Novice Member
does anyone have any info on jitter measurements on any bluray players?- preferably the 51fd.
im specifically looking for measurement over the hdmi pcm or bitstream- and not to another pioneer reciever-due to pqls.

any info on the subject of bluray jitter in general is welcome.:smashin:
 

Avi

Distinguished Member
does anyone have any info on jitter measurements on any bluray players?- preferably the 51fd.
im specifically looking for measurement over the hdmi pcm or bitstream- and not to another pioneer reciever-due to pqls.

any info on the subject of bluray jitter in general is welcome.:smashin:
I'm not sure if there are any specific HDMI audio clock jitter measurements that relate to just the player. The reason is the HDMI audio clock is regenerated by the sink. The HDMI spec isn't prescriptive in how the audio clock must be regenerated and the solution can vary in sophistication. This can result in different levels of clock jitter depending on the solution employed to regenerate in the sink. Currently Arcam and Classe appear to have low HDMI audio jitter clock regeneration solutions without the requirement for matching proprietary solution support in both player and sink.

AVI
 
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Avi

Distinguished Member
These are some of the HDMI measurement reported in HiFi News.

HDMI audio jitter (HiFi News):
<5ps Arcam AVR600
21ps Classe SSP-800
50ps Pio LX81
2200ps Den AVP-A1
3700ps Den 3808
3860ps Onk NR906
3920ps Onk SC886
7660ps Yam V3900
8000ps Sony XA5400
8490ps A/lab 8000

I've seen some other stuff but AFAIK the results are based on a specific "source/sink combination" rather than just source. It isn't always clear what player was used as the source.

AVI
 
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lbstyling

Novice Member
I'm not sure if there are any specific HDMI audio clock jitter measurements that relate to just the player. The reason is the HDMI audio clock is regenerated by the sink. The HDMI spec isn't prescriptive in how the audio clock must be regenerated and the solution can vary in sophistication. This can result in different levels of clock jitter depending on the solution employed to regenerate in the sink. Currently Arcam and Classe appear to have low HDMI audio jitter clock regeneration solutions without the requirement for matching proprietary solution support in both player and sink.

AVI
i was thinking mostly as lpcm which to my knowlege isnt re-clocked-though my knowlege of digital is admittedly limited. if this is true- the player jitter would be of importance.

and wow-that arcam measurement is LOW!!!! :eek:- very interesting!

:smashin:
 

Avi

Distinguished Member
i was thinking mostly as lpcm which to my knowlege isnt re-clocked-though my knowlege of digital is admittedly limited. if this is true- the player jitter would be of importance.

and wow-that arcam measurement is LOW!!!! :eek:- very interesting!

:smashin:
The HDMI interface doesn't carry the source audio clock hence the audio clock must be regenerated by the sink. :)

"7.2 Audio Sample Clock Capture and Regeneration

Audio data being carried across the HDMI link, which is driven by a TMDS clock running at a rate corresponding to the video pixel rate, does not retain the original audio sample clock. The task of recreating this clock at the Sink is called Audio Clock Regeneration.

There are a variety of clock regeneration methods that can be implemented in an HDMI Sink, each with a different set of performance characteristics. This specification does not attempt to define exactly how these mechanisms operate. It does however present a possible configuration and it does define the data items that the HDMI Source shall supply to the HDMI Sink in order to allow the HDMI Sink to adequately regenerate the audio clock. It also defines how that data shall be generated."

AVI
 

Welwynnick

Well-known Member
Maybe this is the time to update my jitter list. Paul Miller has opened up the test reports available on his milleraudioresearch.com website, so there are several new entires in bold. Interesting stuff, but there is still missing information, such as what sample rate was used for every test, and its not always clear which interface was used.

Jitter over analogue:
30ps Denon A1UD

Jitter over SPDIF:
10ps Classe SSP800
15ps DCS Scarlatti
19ps Chord Red Ref II 24-bit input
27ps Pioneer BDP-91LX: 96k
37ps Pioneer SC-LX81
40ps Cambridge DACMagic
50ps Arcam AVR600
65ps Yamaha DSP-Z7
71ps Pioneer BDP-91LX: 48k
119ps Pioneer BDP-91LX: 44.1k
121ps Sony SCD-XA5400ES
126ps Wadia 381i
132ps Marantz BD8002
183ps Yamaha RX-V3900
197ps Sony BDP-S5000
212ps Esoteric P-05/D-05: SACD
250ps Denon 2500/AVP-A1
273ps Esoteric P-05/D-05: CD
430ps Onkyo PR-SC886
470ps Onkyo TX-NR906
485ps Audiolab 8000AP
560ps Denon 3808A
711ps Rotel RSX-1560
1001ps Anthem D2V: 48k
2415ps Rotel RCD-1520

Jitter over HDMI:
5ps Arcam AVR600
21ps Classe SSP800
50ps Pioneer SC-LX81
125ps Denon A1UD over DL4
200ps Sony XA5400ES HATS on
808ps Anthem D2V: 48k
1360ps Denon A1UD over HDMI
2200ps Denon 2500/AVP-A1
2500ps Yamaha DSP-Z7
3700ps Denon 3808A
3770 Rotel RSX-1560
3860ps Onkyo TX-NR906
3920ps Onkyo PR-SC886
7660ps Yamaha RX-V3900
8000ps Sony XA5400ES HATS off
8490ps Audiolab 8000AP

Nick
 

lbstyling

Novice Member
The HDMI interface doesn't carry the source audio clock hence the audio clock must be regenerated by the sink. :)

"7.2 Audio Sample Clock Capture and Regeneration

Audio data being carried across the HDMI link, which is driven by a TMDS clock running at a rate corresponding to the video pixel rate, does not retain the original audio sample clock. The task of recreating this clock at the Sink is called Audio Clock Regeneration.

There are a variety of clock regeneration methods that can be implemented in an HDMI Sink, each with a different set of performance characteristics. This specification does not attempt to define exactly how these mechanisms operate. It does however present a possible configuration and it does define the data items that the HDMI Source shall supply to the HDMI Sink in order to allow the HDMI Sink to adequately regenerate the audio clock. It also defines how that data shall be generated."

AVI
so if i was using a audiolab 8000ap (lpcm over hdmi)-could i modify it to have low jitter-ie superclock ect?-would that realy reduce the jitter to a reasonable level ?

im realy liking the look of the 8000ap atm.
 

Avi

Distinguished Member
so if i was using a audiolab 8000ap (lpcm over hdmi)-could i modify it to have low jitter-ie superclock ect?-would that realy reduce the jitter to a reasonable level ?

im realy liking the look of the 8000ap atm.
I don't know enough about the subject to answer.

AVI
 
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