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Pioneer 435

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by Dune, Mar 7, 2005.

  1. Dune

    Dune
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    Having been attempting to soak up the knowledge contained within these forums since finding them recently I was wondering why people would, if they want a large plasma screen today, consider anything else other the current Pioneer 435 despite it not being the cheapest option from a recognised manufacturer.

    It seems the only one that is future proof as regards Sky HDTV unless some of the mega-expensive Leowe sets are also.

    I know there are cheaper quality plasmas out there around £1200 and up but I don't equate £1200 to £1500 "cheap". What I mean is I for one can't invest that sort of money in a new TV to write it off in a couple of years replacing the set with a HDTV capable unit.

    Any set I might buy for that sort of money or more has got to last quite some time so I would want it to be future proof. That being so I'd go as far as saving up the extra for one of the 435's.

    It seems crazy to be investing in the current Panny's and others when they won't be able to show high def TV.

    Is there something inherently wrong with the 435's or are people just not interested in HDTV?

    Dave
     
  2. Davidgilmour

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    the price is wrong...

    if they would sell this one for 1,300 quid there would be no competitor....
     
  3. BIGMAX

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    Nothing wrong with the XDE's, quite a bit more expensive than the Panasonics due to the advantages of being a bit more plug in and go and hi def ready without any hassle. More of a replacement tv thats all singing and all dancing. Ooooh and an extra inch is always nice !!

    To be fair from reading the experts' opinions the Panasonic PHD7 and PW7 seem to display the best picture quality but from seeing my XDE in action I am totally happy with the picture and I think many on these forums feel the same.

    The XDE is a good all rounder - great in some places, ordinary in others but it looks great and should still be going strong in the future.
     
  4. Pezerinno

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    Maybe everyone doesn't have sky?
     
  5. deanym

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    Big Max is spot on. An XDE is a bit more than the rest but for performance against hassle its perfect.
     
  6. deanym

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    Yes, there's that issue and also cost. HD isn't important to everyone.
     
  7. angelislington

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    A truer word hath never been spoken. I also wonder about the love shown towards other brands, when the only panel on the market currently that is properly high def ready is the Pioneer. I also believe that it offers by far the best picture, better than the Pannys et al. It is more expensive than most others but that's life. You get what you pay for. If you don't buy a Pioneer, you are effectively buying a dead product. If you can afford to buy a non HD ready panel then throw it away in 12 months time then please ignore this paragraph :)
     
  8. MAW

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    The digital picture on the XDE is outstanding, a bit underwhelming on scart though. It may be future ready, not quite so present perfect. SkyHD will be massively expensive and very limited when it happens, most people will wait for a few years before taking the plunge. So buying a screen for half the money that performs better on everyday analogue inputs makes a certain amount of sense.
     
  9. Family Guy

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    Hi Def TV...maybe it's time for people to take a step back and look at what that actually means - short term - before they commit to buying a HD capable screen that looks crap with standard def...

    Fact number 1 - Sky will be starting Hi Def transmissions next year. But what exactly will they be broadcasting...? Early indications show that it will be a selection of what is currently on. A lot of programmes currently broadcast on Sky is made in Hi Def (Star Trek & Las Vegas to name a couple...). However, as far as I know, there are no plans at the moment for a 24 hour Hi Def channel from Sky. So these programmes will be broadcast at the same time on the Hi Def transponder as they are on the SD one...this means that you'll need to still have a full Sky sub if you want to watch the programmes that are not made in HD...2 subscriptions anyone...? To watch maybe a dozen programmes a week in HD...? No thanks... :thumbsdow I've seen or heard nothing on Sky's plans for HD movies as yet...

    Fact number 2 - HD DVD is available now in the US and Japan. However, have you tried to get hold of a player yet...? Or have you seen any discs for sale yet? Visit DVDSoon, PlayUSA or Loaded 247 and you'll find nothing on HDDVD or Blu Ray...not even their intentions when masses of discs become available...which leads me nicely onto...

    Fact number 3 - The majority of dics released early will be back catalogue. Most of which you'll probably have on DVD already. Point being - more expense on replacing those DVD's...

    If you own an XDE, it's probably worth investing in Sky HD, HDDVD and just about everything HD as well...because to be honest, it's the only way it's going to look as good as a panasonic in SD.... ;)
     
  10. Drd

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    "Crap with standard def!!!!"
    Well I can only say that mine looks stunning on 'standard' freeview,perhaps the £250 on a new top quality aerial helped.196 hours and counting.Go for it guys, Pio rules!! :D
     
  11. Family Guy

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    I am in fact a Pioneer owner...a 433 MXE1. I've installed and worked on the XDE and the picture was so bad on Sky through scart, I had to phone my boss because i thought it was broken!! Turned out it was fine and that "terrible picture" and "XDE" went hand in hand. Fine by me really - makes my job a lot easier... ;)
     
  12. Drd

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    Only 'stirring' Family Guy,don't take it personally :D .As I've said on another thread I think the panny is an excellent screen,but for me,like Dune said,the future proofing and easy connectivity was important,and not all of us have,or want,Sky.Probably that will change if they put out some decent programming on HD.Can you see those pigs flying by outside.
    Regards
    Ian
     
  13. Setch

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    Everybody says that the 435 is bad with Sky, but I have Sky via NTL digital and the quality is superb. But then I guess that the feed from NTL is of better quality than that you get from the satellite.

    Setch
     
  14. MAW

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    No, it's worse than sky, more compression. It's a matter of perception though, if you upgraded from a 12 yr old 4:3CRT doubtless it's a huge improvement. If it was a 3 yr old 32" sony Wega, you'd likely be whingeing if the previous was set up anything like right.
     
  15. Family Guy

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    So if everybody says it...why do people still buy them... :confused:
     
  16. RobbieTT

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    I cannot see Sky launching a HD service at such a high price that nobody touches it. The kit will cost at the start, the subscription will be a token amount. Sky knows what it is doing. It will slowly screw the nut on subscription charges in the years to come, as the uptake increases. Most of us can recall how cheep Sky was at the start.

    The only exception in recent years was Sky+. Something that, for once, got cheaper over time. However, you could look at the poor early uptake of Sky+ compared to now as Sky re-learning an old lesson.

    People will be pay for quality. In a couple of years a lot of plasmas will by HD ready and in normal homes. Some people did buy into the 'digital is better' crap that came with digital TV, even though the quality was different, not better. HD and Multichannel Audio is a huge leap forward, combined with the kind of screen sizes we see now and the AV amps common in todays homes, the march will be unstoppable.

    I wish people would not state 'facts' when no such facts exist yet. Only one truth exists. The speed of uptake will be controlled by cost. The broadcasters revenue is driven by uptake.
     
  17. Family Guy

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    So you're saying that:
    Fact number 1: Sky ARE NOT starting HD broadcast next year.
    Fact number 2:HD DVD IS NOT available in the US or Japan.
    Fact number 3: The majority of early HD DVD releases WILL NOT be re-issues...

    'cos the only FACTS I stated are the opposite of the above...everything else was of course my opinion and what I have read on these and other forums...but of course, it's my opinion that the XDE isn't very good unless you run HD through it...
     
  18. deanym

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    Surely there is a fish to match the chip on your shoulder ;) Just joking.

    The xde isn't terrible with sky. Just the pannies are better. Perhaps, by luck, I have mine set up rather well.

    HD and component inputs are awesome.
     
  19. RobbieTT

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    Family,

    You seem to have exploded a little. No insult was meant or inferred. I am more than happy for you to express you opinion; indeed I seek it, it's what this forum is for. I thought I wrote a balanced piece, from which you pulled one quote. But I will address your concerns:

    Fact 1 - What plans from Sky, who mentioned a dedicated HD channel, who says you need 2 subscriptions and who says there will only be a dozen programmes a week?

    Fact 2 - HD DVD in the States. Misses the point a little as it seems to suggest that this is the only source of HD media in the US. There is already an established HD Digital VHS market in the States.

    Fact 3 - This is true of any new media. Seem to remember this being quoted as people moved from vinal to CD, VHS to Laser Disc and DVD. Some of the stuff I want on HD DVD is from the cherished back catalogue. However, I do agree with you on the take-up of HD DVD over SD DVD. Not much time has elapsed since the major up-take of DVD and many will show inertia when moving to a new format. I think many will agree with you, HD DVD may take a while to catch on. This forum does tend to draw from enthusiast and many cannot wait.

    I think the market is ready for an update to our TV standard, which has been pretty much unchanged for decades. If Sky handle it right, it could be their biggest launch ever.
     
  20. Dune

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    I don't know how much Sky HD is going to cost but what I can't see the is sense in spending £1200-£1500 now on an SD set and then at least that much again in a few years.

    I don't think many will take the view that they should buy the best SD set today with a view to buying another HD set in a short space of time. I think most will view an expensive purchase as such as a current Panny as something to last a long time and will be very annoyed it is effectivley obsolete. Not everyone can write £1500 off easily.

    Justifying getting rid of a perfectly good set that cost that much in 2 or 3 would certianly not be an easy task in my household !!

    I suppose what I am really asking is why the bottom hasn't dropped out of the SD market for those in the know about HDTV.

    I also think it might not be that long before your average non-techie consumer cottens on that there is something different about those sets like the Pioneer that have stickers on saying "HDTV ready" or whatver are something special compared to the others in the shop.

    I am sure that has not happened yet and I would say something like 95% of sets in Curry's, Dixons and Comet are not HDTV ready. No doubt they continue to sell but I wonder what the reaction will be of less knowledgeable consumers who buy a non-HDTV set and then find their pride and joy won't take Sky HD.

    I know the Sky announcement is recent about how HDTV will be supported but it does seem to have caught manufacters out with so few sets available.

    Will there be a quick response from the likes of Panasonic?

    Dave
     
  21. MAW

    MAW
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    HDCP is what has caught them out, as well as the actual sky format, and Panasonic's response is expected imminently. As to why the bottom has not dropped out of the sd market, it's partly we are a nation of luddites, and partly cos many people think 'my picture is pretty good now, why would I waste money on an HD channel, yes, just 1, with little content, and that pay per view on top of the subscription. Sky HD will be for well heeled early adopters only, whilst it may or may not be a fortune, it will be a gimmick, like euro1080, for the first year or 2. Try a lifespan of 5 years on your SD screen, and reckon on shifting it to the kids playroom, then it takes on another meaning.
     
  22. danny daniell

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    If you can afford the HDMI panel,then whats another £** a month to max it out? It`s a bit like buying a big fat Merc & then being too tight to put your foot down because you are worried about the petrol consumption!

    Dan :)
     
  23. wannabeav

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    I've still got this dilemma. In the market for a new TV - have financial sign off from the wife for a plasma but know that replacing in 5 years will not be an option. The plasma therefore needs to be as future proof as possible, look stylish hanging on the lounge wall, ideally have an external media box but also look good until HDTV arrives (no intention to get sky).

    The xde satisfies all but the last one for me. The Panasonic HD display and Pioneer MXE display all look good when watching but dont satsify the aesthetic needs of the lounge (or conveience). Any ideas if such a utopian plasma might exist - even in design stage?
     
  24. mike543

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    300hrs in with xde and pic is superb. digtal and SKY+ i have no problems with, pic looks great to me. HDMI dvd outstanding at 720p. Had LG42PX11 to start off with, that went straight back. that had a terrible pic with sky. use supra scart(no audio) with sky, could be the reason? Very minimal(have to watch carefully) or zero lip sync with sky, even on uk gold etc. My amp has no audio delay. LG was unwatchable with my amp.
    Pio 435 XDE 10/10....
     
  25. dino2020

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    My 435 is great with sky+ via s-video i hooked up scart to compare rgb to svideo, and svideo blows rgb away, so crisp and clear and way sharper, blacks are darker too.

    And will people stop bitching about how good there screens are and how rubbish other makes are, if your that happy with fine dont bad mouth others treat others with respect as per the forum rules.

    Dino
     
  26. MAW

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    Nuff said. I don't personally own a screen. For me, in any case, it's not a manufacturer issue, in the case of the big 2P's, but individual models that do not perform to expectations, well not my expectations. IIRC I don't have particularly kind words for Vieras, though not related to SD picture quality. Nor will you find be so sharply critical of MXE pioneers. It does depend on what you really want from a screen. If you want ultimate picture quality, the XDE is not where you start. For designer elegance, and ease of DIY setup it has few rivals. I get P**d off with the number of callouts to screens not bought from myself which are suffering from poor PQ. I now charge £50 to turn up if it's a hitachi any model, or an XDE. I'm happy with payment by results with any other screen. I just know there won't be any results with these ones without serious money spent on hardware.
     
  27. hillster

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    Will have to give that a try, what type of svideo cable are you using?
     
  28. BIGMAX

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    I love reading these posts with all the differences in opinions. You will always find +'s and -'s on every screen from everyone. It all boils down to what you want and what you can pay. I bought the XDE because I love the way it looks and it was always the one I wanted. I wasn't blown away with the picture when I demo'd but I didn't expect to be. That will be in a few years time when these things get better. But the picture was decent enough for me as I am not one for constantly trying to eek out that extra bit of PQ available. But some people are so the XDE is ovbiously not for them, thats why they would rather spend the cash on a monitor and scalers etc. We are all different and need different things otherwise life would be so boring.

    Keep up the disagreements !!
     
  29. MAW

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    The forum wouldn't exist without a decent argument. You all keep coming back to disagree, keeps the visitor numbers up, kepps the advertisers happy, it's all part of the circle of life, man.... Stuart loves a good controversy, but nice and bloodless. We are disagreeing in a civilised manner, no name calling or or abuse, apart from the chip remark, that's a bit close to the bone. Especially if you knew the guy!
     
  30. Deaves

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    Any hardware in particular you would recommend?
     

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