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Pio 503HDE and prog scan

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by midlander, Jun 1, 2003.

  1. midlander

    midlander
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    I understand from searching previous posts that the HDE range only do NTSC progressive scan and not PAL. Is this a limitation of the media box or the display? I have a Pio 737 DVD which only does NTSC prog scan, so rather than buy a new DVD, I always had the intention of buying a scaler (iScan Ultra?) to convert R2 DVDs and as a bonus, Sky digital and analogue TV. Would fitting a scaler between the media box and the display work?
    Any help very much appreciated.

    Regards

    Martyn
     
  2. RAMiAM

    RAMiAM
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    I think with the HDE range it's the limitation of the tuner box, not 100% sure as I own an MXE.

    A few points to note:
    • the iScan Ultra is not a scaler but a deinterlacer - i.e., it will not change the resolution of the input but purely join separate fields into frames, something it does extremely well.
    • the Iscan also has the added bonus of CUE fix, very handly if using with Sky Digital or a DVD player that is plagued.
    • the iScan, as far as I am aware, will not convert from PAL to NTSC or visa-versa, i.e., from 50Hz to 60Hz - I could be wrong though.

    RAMiAM
     
  3. cjdshaw

    cjdshaw
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    From demo's I've seen, I must say I think PAL progressive input it overrated. I have a 433HDE and it has a built-in deinterlacer (PureCinema) that works very well.
    NTSC DVD's have 3:2 pulldown added on output that has to be removed by the TV, so I can see the benefit of going progressive from the DVD player. But all a PAL progressive DVD player is doing is reshuffling the scanlines.
     
  4. StooMonster

    StooMonster
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    If you are happy with your built in deinterlacer then fine, and think PAL progressive is over-rated then good for you.

    Others may consider that there is deinterlacing, and there is deinterlacing. What do I mean?

    Check out this excellent guide DVD Benchmark - Progressive Scan DVD -- there are plenty of pictures to explain points.

    This article, amoungst other things, discusses the five types of deinterlacing:
    • Single-Field Interpolation (or “Bob”)
    • Field Combining (or “Weave”)
    • Vertical Filtering
    • Motion-Adaptive Deinterlacing
    • Motion-Compensated (Motion Vector Steered) Deinterlacing
    This is a list from simpliest (cheap) to best (expensive).

    The inbuilt deinterlacers in screens tend to be cheaper components (with some exceptions), whereas prog-scan DVD players tend to use the more expensive (better) components.

    Furthermore, it's better to do the deinterlacing nearer the source rather than at the target -- not only for picture quality, but so you can have an audio delay to remove lip sync.

    Most people tend to think progressive scan has more benefits than 3:2 pull down of NTSC material alone; these would include higher picture quality, jaggies removed, audio delay, etc.

    StooMonster
     
  5. midlander

    midlander
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    Thanks for the replies. I think I'm going to stick with the HDE for the ease of connection, teletext and lack of cooling fans. Most of my DVDs are R1 so I can use NTSC progressive most of the time. Besides it should be here in a few days, if I reorder a silver 503MXE it could take weeks (that's if they have any).

    I have contacted Pioneer and they say - 'There are no plans to upgrade the media box to accept the new Pal progessive standard and when the media box was updated recently it was primarily a cosmetic change to remote control'. Also - 'Because of the special connections between the media receiver and the screen then we believe that the video scaler cannot be connected this way. If there is any plasma model change then the likelyhood is that the media receivers will not be interchangeable' :( Are they right in saying there's no possible way of connecting a video processor?

    One thing people don't seem to mention is the electromagnetic wave standards. The HDE is class B and designed for home use, the MXE is class A for commercial use and has higher emissions. Any thoughts?

    cjdshaw am I right in thinking the system cable is just a computer 15pin D connector and a DVI cable? If this is the case and I can find a video processor with DVI in and DVI out, I could connect it between the media box and display.

    Martyn
     
  6. cjdshaw

    cjdshaw
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    The system cable consists of a DVI cable and another cable which looks like a proprietary connector carrying audio and remote signals. I doubt putting a deinterlacer between the boxes would work since the media box outputs a 1024x768 signal. An alternative would be to remove the media box entirely. A scaler with DVI out like this
    http://www.ivojo.co.uk/focus-enhancements-centerstage-cs-1.htm
    should work. You get a brief error message when you turn on the screen without the control cable and the only remote button that will do anything is power, but other than that it works fine.
     

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