pio 435 xde hdmi pics

BIGMAX

Novice Member
Hi all
I've got my 435 xde connected to a Samsung 945 dvd through HDMI (cable that came with dvd player). The picture is superb but I was expecting a huge
difference in picture quality to my Sony DAV800 which I have connected to the xde through Svideo to scart. The HDMI pics from the Samsung are definately better but I cant help feeling that I should be getting more. Could a new HDMI cable help, different settings on the tv or is this hdmi connection only supposed to bring subtle enhancements ?
 

Steve Zodiac

Active Member
I too use HDMI to DVI and even though this digital connection is better, it certainly wasn't the improvement that I expected and was lead to believe.

It would seem that some HDMI users would have others believe that the difference is like that between VHS and DVD.......if only!

I for one would like to believe that a new cable would improve things, but from what I understand, a more expensive cable won't make any difference at all.

I think that these digital connections are more about getting ready for the future (sky HD etc), rather than a great increase in PQ for SD material.

Steve.
 

hornydragon

Well-known Member
Steve Zodiac said:
I for one would like to believe that a new cable would improve things, but from what I understand, a more expensive won't make any difference at all.
More expensive wont.....better quality can..... you may wish to sonsider upgrading the DVi cable from media box> panel..........
 

Steve Zodiac

Active Member
hornydragon said:
More expensive wont.....better quality can..... you may wish to sonsider upgrading the DVi cable from media box> panel..........
I use a HDMI - DVI cable, from DVD player direct to a plasma panel.

How can a better quality cable improve a digital signal if it is arriving at the far end (panel) error free? If a 1 or 0 leaves the DVD player and a 1 or 0 arrives at the panel and in sychnronisation, then surely the jobs done as well as it can be?

Elsewhere on this forum there is a post stating that Meridian tested HDMI cables of various prices (qualities) and they couldn't see any difference between them in terms of PQ.

If you can explain how I will get an improvement in PQ by changing cables then I'll order a new cable tonight!

Steve.
 

hornydragon

Well-known Member
steve its odd but with a background in electronic engineering I can say that "1" and "0" of digital is never "1" or "0" its how close to each an analohue voltage is and where you put the cut off......... Digital is not all its cracked to be at this stage. In my "plasma Mega Test" a wireworld DVi cable did make very very small improvement to the 435....its hard to explain but teh image was a bit cleaer and had less pioneer Fuzz to it.
There is another forum member who has had a bunch of DVi cables on approval to try with a 505, the difference is supposed to be more visible on the 505 and a High quality mains lead is also supposed to make quite a difference to teh Pio Plasma (Display feed not media box) But we are well into diminishing returns here and the mains cable used was £850 RRP! I will see if the member concerned would be willing to post his findings...
 

brendan_dj

Novice Member
I saw a demo of the Pioneer 435XDE fed from a High-Definition source (from a non Sky satellite) via an HDMI cable.

WOW!

I walked right up close to the plasma and I could not see any distortion/pixelation in the picture when it was showing a natural programme.

I did notice a slight pixelation around text/graphic captions on the screen. Again, I was standing right up close.

I have asked for another demonstration of the Pioneer XDE with a specific AV amplifier and DVD player.
(The ones that i may end up buying as part of my Home Cinema Package)

I have specifically asked to see a DVD player connected via HDMI *AND" composite so that
I can switch back and forth between the two to see if I notice a difference.

I am not sure if I will be able to tell.

Brendan
 

hornydragon

Well-known Member
HDMI and component would be a better comparison (Pio 435 is notoriously bad at component).........but be interested to hear what you think.
 

Steve Zodiac

Active Member
hornydragon said:
steve its odd but with a background in electronic engineering I can say that "1" and "0" of digital is never "1" or "0" its how close to each an analohue voltage is and where you put the cut off
I would agree that at line level you are right, but when talking about a 1 leaving the source (DVD) and a 1 leaving the digital signal receiver after regeneration at the destination (panel), then they are identical.

If the resistance of the cable is too great or the cable is defective, then the incoming signal at the destinations receiver isn't good enough to accurately determine wether it should be a 1 or a 0, so errors occur. Digital telecomms line systems can send digital signals 100% error free over relatively low quality copper cable a couple of kilometres, so I can't see how a cable of a few metres in length can make any difference at all.
 

Joe Fernand

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
BIGMAX

Keep in mind HDMI is a connectivity standard - a pipeline if you like; not a guarantee of video quality.

Not all HDMI equipped sources are created equal - if they were the high end boys can shut up shop any day soon.

It might be an idea to try and compare a Pioneer DV-868AVi via HDMI with your Samsung player.

Its also worth double checking you have as few Digital filters as possible active in the PlasmaTV and also worth trying the up-converted and native setting on your DVD player - I believe it has the ability to up-convert to 720P.

Swapping cables may make some difference - though only if the cable your currently using is in some way degrading the video signal; a cable cant improve the signal it can only ensure it all gets through. If your keen to try cables ensure you get them on Sale or Return.

Best regards

Joe
 

BIGMAX

Novice Member
Cheers Joe, I was writing this as you posted.

Maybe the DVD player (Samsung 945) is just a basic starter model with the hdmi connection as the price would suggest and therefore I shouldn't expect far greater quality.

Things can only get better !!
 

BIGMAX

Novice Member
Joe Fernand said:
Its also worth double checking you have as few Digital filters as possible active in the PlasmaTV and also worth trying the up-converted and native setting on your DVD player - I believe it has the ability to up-convert to 720P.
Sorry Joe, excuse my ignorance but by the digital filters do you mean the pro adjustments ?

Also, I ploughed through the different native settings and the decent pictures were quite similar.
 

Joe Fernand

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Hello BIGMAX

HDMI will become the norm soon enough and we'll get past the hype that it guarantees visual Nirvana - what HDMI should offer you is less grain and noise than an analogue connection; though you'll still 'see' the quality (or lack of) of the video processing employed in your source device.

Best regards

Joe

PS Yes best to avoid MPEG reduction and the like in the TV - I find the Pro Adjustments tend to look best in the OFF position :)
 

deanym

Well-known Member
hornydragon said:
HDMI and component would be a better comparison (Pio 435 is notoriously bad at component).........but be interested to hear what you think.
My 435 component input is outstanding, better than the RGB connection my top of the range philips 32" tv used to produce with dvd (crt being the benchmark for clarity if not geometry).

However, I'm looking forward to getting HDMI kit to compare that connection, which would mean (in my set-up at least) the component connection will be redundant.
 

Ian Trotter

Standard Member
I've had experience of a slight difference in PQ due to 'quality' of cables as displayed on my 435XDE,
Meridain 598DP (prog. scan component output) through iScan HD+ (DVI output).
Whilst trying to fault find my setup problems I borrowed a cheap (US import at less than £10) DVI - HDMI cablefrom a colleague, this created the 'same' picture but at a noticable degredation in quality rather than the Chord DVI - HDMI convertor + HDMI - HDMI lead that I normally use.
Although I have acheived reasonable settings on the screen, I am still considering selling the 435 due to its absence of native res. digital input. Anybody interested?
 

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