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Pio 434...radical settings

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by drago.d, Dec 1, 2003.

  1. drago.d

    drago.d
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    I've had my 434 for 9 days now, and last night, for the first time, I was able to watch a DVD (Gump) all the way through without constantly fiddling with picture settings.

    I've held off from jumping into plasma land 'till now. I've been waiting for the technology to mature to the point that from both a price AND a pq standpoint it was a viable alternative to traditional CRT.

    I have always been a fan of panny pq but not the design of the panels (and lets face it a plasma is a huge thing to have sitting on your wall, and the aesthetics to me are important.)
    When I saw the design of the Pio, and had a demo (from a slightly greater viewing distance than I have at home) I felt the pq was as good as any Panny I'd seen: blacks were sufficiently black, colours were natural, contrast was fine, and motion artefacts weren't an issue.

    Once the screen was installed at home, and I popped a disc into my Pio 737, I couldn't have been more gutted.

    Even after doing a quick adjustment to the picture settings (RGB in, Energy save "on", reduce contrast & colour, reducing some of the processing options etc. etc.) the picture was a huge disappointment.
    Switching to component from the 737 made no difference, nor did using s-video. I couldn't believe I'd got this poor a picture. It's proved to be even worse from Sky+.

    I've been on the brink of returning the screen and media box to the retailer for most of last week, as the pq has been awful. Yes, I've had a coule of drop-outs, but not for days. Yes, the delay in channel and input changing is too long (4-5 seconds). Lip-sync is also a problem to some degree, on both DVD and Sky+.

    BUT, these aren't the main issues. The amount of artefacts on the screen reduces the image to barely watchable. My eyes can't filter out the artefacts to let me just watch.
    Over large areas of the screen, video noise - what I can only describe as "fizzing" plagues medium to brighter areas (every DVD I tried, T2, Gump, Star Wars-Phantom Menace, Fifth Element, Super Speedway).
    On top of this, skin tones are reduced to what looks like two shades of pink plastic...barbie or grey.
    Furthermore, there is motion lag as peole talk or move their heads. It's as if they leave part of their face behind for a moment (Phantom Menace especially).
    Pans are a series of jerks...watching the balls in the Snooker Final was an excercise in frustration.

    I have spent hours trying to dial in a set-up which cures these issues. Two nights were 9pm to 2am jobs.

    Last night, in a "let's see what happens if I do this" moment I reduced contrast WAY down. It was as if I was asking for far less image processing to be done to the signal, and as a result the "fizz" was greatly reduced. I played around with some of the other parameters and ended up with the most watchable image so far, albeit not the punchiest in terms of absolute contrast and brightness.

    Final Settings for input 3 RGB, DVD:

    CONT: 12 :eek:
    BR: +6
    COL: -21 :eek:
    TINT: 0
    SHARP: -3

    PRO ADJ:
    PURE CINE: STD
    COL TEMP: MANUAL: RED H -7,G H +1, B H -1
    MPEG NR: LOW
    DNR: MID
    CTI: ON
    DRE: MID
    COL MAN: RED -4

    As I say, much less contrast than ideal, but DEFINITELY the most watchable image to-date. Lip-sync still an issue.

    Anyone with any comments as to why this is so :confused:

    Dealer has suggested a change of media box.

    drago.d

    ps I'm using QED "Sqart" scart to scart for the RGB.
     
  2. lumpsucker

    lumpsucker
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    Drago.d,

    Thanks for that honest and informative post. I don't get my 504 installed until probably Wednesday but I shall pull up your settings if I get PQ problems.

    thanks again.

    Simon
     
  3. drago.d

    drago.d
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    lumpsucker,

    I'll keep my fingers crossed for you that mine is not typical of the breed. Let me know how you get on.

    Good luck.

    drago.d
     
  4. paulefox

    paulefox
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    doesn't sound too good , i was thinking of buying this plasma but i think that I might wait till they have sorted out the screen burn problem with them. I might get a projector instead
     
  5. drago.d

    drago.d
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    BTW,

    I've also tried using input 1 (RGB) out of curiosity. You would expect both RGB inputs to be identical, but using the same settings gave a different image. :confused:

    Perhaps I do need a change of media box :rolleyes:

    drago.d
     
  6. Andrew_B

    Andrew_B
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    paulefox wrote: ...I think that I might wait till they have sorted out the screen burn problem...

    Yeah, and the re-gassing every 12 months! And the IR remote problem(?) :rolleyes:

    Don't worry about screen burn, it's a non-issue, we've gone over this loads of times already.
     
  7. paulefox

    paulefox
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    there are plenty of people saying it is a problem
     
  8. Andrew_B

    Andrew_B
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    The majority of who, either don't have a plasma or work in Dixons. Really, it's not a problem.
     
  9. Costas

    Costas
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    drago.d
    If things are as you describe above there is something DEFINITELY wrong with the media box or screen. Please report directly to Pioneer. Call them on 01753 789500. It is very strange to be down to +12 on Contrast and -26 on Colour! The Picture quality should be very good to excellent depending on the source and type of connection. I still have a 737 and 757 both showing very well through RGB and excellent through component. I also had a 433 before I bought the 434. One of the main advantage of the 434 is that poorer input sources other than DVD display a smoother clearer picture with less artifacts.

    What you have must be a picture fault in addition to the dropout software issue. Pioneer will definitely address it upon reporting it.
     
  10. drago.d

    drago.d
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    Dealer has a new media box in stock for me to swap with tomorrow. I hope this does the trick.

    After that, if the problems aren't cured he says Pioneer will send a techie out to look at my screen.

    drago.d
     
  11. Costas

    Costas
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    That it is good to hear. Hopefully it will all be resolved by the media box replacement
     
  12. drago.d

    drago.d
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    Cheers Costas,

    I'm keeping everything crossed ;)

    drago.d
     
  13. drago.d

    drago.d
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    New media box installed today.

    There is NO difference in the pq :mad:

    I have had to resort to my settings posted at the start of this thread in order to get the picture to equal that from media box 1.

    To top it all off, there is NO audio !!!! from the built-in tuner to either the plasma speakers or the line out to the Denon :rolleyes: Now thats what I call audio drop-out.

    Dealer is holding another media box for me to swap with.

    drago.d

    ps. think I'll post the total audio drop-out in a separate thread for anyone who might have similar probs.
     
  14. Diapason

    Diapason
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    You need to go into each individual channels settings and set the sound to I rather than B/G, etc. That should give sound back to you. It scared me for a while as well...

    Si
     
  15. drago.d

    drago.d
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    Diapason and MTJ,

    guys, thanks for the help there, all sorted

    Perhaps the mains lead being a 2 pin (Euro) type should have made me think about what the default audio setting on the built-in tuner channels was likely to be

    Still, only the pq to worry about now.

    drago.d
     
  16. gringottsdirect

    gringottsdirect
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    Reference screen burn, if you check out plasmas in Comet, Currys, Dixons or Powerhouse that show BBC News 24 constantly, the DOG is clearly burnt into the plasma. Anyone buying off display must notice.
    Recently saw " screen burn " on a 26" JVC LCD that was running a Lord Of The Rings promo in store too. The dividing lines between widescreen image and black bars was permanently visible.
    No idea how much it would take to do a screen burn, never managed it myself, but could be an issue for someone.
     
  17. drago.d

    drago.d
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    Have lived with the 2nd media box for about a week now, and although I've had to use exactly the same picture settings to obtain a picture that doesn't distract me all the time, I have to say that the screen does seem to be improving slowly as more and more hours are put on it :confused:

    Anyhow, the issues with skin tones, image lag (if thats the right term), judder on pans, lip sync, and slow (4/5 secs) channel & input switching are still there to varying degrees.

    My dealer has informed Pioneer, so now I am waiting for them to contact me so they can come and see the plasma themselves.

    One other thing, I have been aware of the fan noise from both the media boxes. This is clearly audible from 3.3m away, and is much more prominent than the Sky+ box. I had assumed this was normal, whereas others have reported having to get within 0.5m to hear it, or that it was improved with a change of box.
    Perhaps with the updated software the fans are reset to work less hard??

    Following replies to my thread re: upgrading power cables, I thought I'd try one of Mark Grant's to use with the Sky+ box. This would seem to be a cost effective way of dipping my toe into the water, as a prelude to upgrading those on the plasma and media box.

    Anyway, lets hope I hear from Pioneer soon,

    drago.d



    drago.d
     
  18. loonatic

    loonatic
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    I viewed a 434 today and was not that impressed sadly.

    The strangest thing was the way that people's faces looked like they were pressed up against the glass and moved un-naturally in connection with the rest of the faces.

    Now this might have been to do with setup but this was viewed in a pretty well regarded independant store running a 686 DVD via HDMI.

    Also, the problem I had with my 433 is still present so it's off my list of possible's which is growing shorter by the day.

    Cheers, Lee
     
  19. drago.d

    drago.d
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    I know exactly what you mean about the faces pressed up against glass description :(

    drago.d
     
  20. drago.d

    drago.d
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    Still waiting to hear from Pioneer. Dealer is chasing them up, but with Christmas just round the corner I'm sceptical that anyone will come to check the screen/media box out before the New Year :thumbsdow

    In the meantime, I'm waiting for one of Mark Grants Sky+ box mains cables to arrive:D

    BTW, has anyone tried my settings, and what was the picture like?

    drago.d
     

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