Discussion in 'General TV Discussions Forum' started by sonofmoth, Dec 6, 2002.
Hope this works but I want to see how big a problem it is
I have had the ferrite ring fitted to my 9527 and it does not work, there is no difference at all.
Sent mine back to comet as i thought the T.V had too many faults black bars, switching itself off, major pixelisation ( is that a word?) on motion especially sport ........Now got Sony 32fx66 and I am a happy man!
The last two points are TV setup I believe - although there will always be subjective views on Pixel Plus
I think it does, it is a very popular subject with Pixel Plus owners and prospective owners alike. As Philips and the TV press don't seem to want to do anything about what is a design flaw in an otherwise excellent TV then I feel that it should be up to this forum to collate some evidence of the problem so that at least one of the above will take notice.
Having the post sticky would mean that readers would instanlty see it. One of the problems with forums is that many people do not go past page 1 and therefore questions get repeated and important topics get lost.
I am sure someone will back me up on the importance of this and the request for stickiness.
Me too, I have talked and written to several different departments at Philips, and they all say that I am the first person to complain about this, and then ignore me.
This would prove that argument wrong.
It might be worth including an explanation as to what the black bars are, and how to see them. some people dont use the RGB scarts etc...
Hi there am new to this site but I too have the Philips 9617 connected to digi box and video and dvd and those bars are sooo visible especially when watching Harry Potter or Et, so annoying. I had the TV replaced thinking it was a one off but its been replaced and the problem is still exactly the same. Is there a cure for this please help.
see the ferrite rings post. I've had them fitted to my 9617 and so far, so good. I've only once seen a very faint hint of the bars and its FAR better than it was
This ferrite ring thing, where did you get it from I tried the link from the french web site thing and had google translate it but i dont have a clue what im looking for. Can anyone help?
I printed it off in French & English, printed off reports from other people with the same problem in this forum and took it to my engineer who ordered the part and fitted it.
I've had a 9527 for about 3 weeks and not seen any sign of the black bars. Initially I was ready to return the TV because there was some very wierd pixelisation (it is a word now) and the Pixel Plus seemed to struggle. However, after a good deal of experimenting with setup and reading this forum, I think it is an excellent picture. Also benefits from very good sound.
I've owned a 9617 for ages and so far I've been very pleased... BUT!, a couple of weeks ago I briefly used the composite in on the side of the set and I did happen to notice faint bands like the ones described here. I ignored it initially as I assumed it was because of a dodgy lead or something, but earlier today (after trying to solve my connectivity problems) I used the S-Video input on the side aswell. Shockingly, the two bars show-up even more clearly with that input (probably because the image is excellent except for the banding). So, despite thinking I'd finally bought myself a decent set, it looks like I haven't got away with it after all!.
I was actually planning on re-organising all my connections in order to accomodate 2 DVD's, Sky and a Gamecube, although I started fiddling with things because of an un-related problem (which I may start a thread on tomorrow). Anyway, I'd intended to have my DVD recorder permanently plugged into the side S-video socket, but obviously with these bars that's not really an option now.
I have to emphasise that images from both RGB scarts (and the tuner) are completely free from vertical bars. I tried playing Dark City through S-video today and the bars were noticeable throughout, yet I've watched it before through RGB and it was fine...
Sorry to hear of another case of black bars! It seems that nobody is immune. I'll have to try the other inputs on mine. If any manufacture could actually produce a TV that works properly on a consistent basis they would clean up.
These black bars are very mysterious ... I looked at the poll and 33% of respondents dont have the problem. Is there some link perhaps?
Could it be that the problem has been corrected and the newer batch of sets dont have "bb" syndrome? Or am I being too optimistic?
I dont have one yet - but would love to get the "Eurpoean TV of The Year" - EISA Awarded 2003/2003 this tv that accolade. Keep waiting and checking ...
One last note : does the 9527 accept progressive input and if so which varieties? The 9420 pixel plus 4:3 set here takes up to 1080i
My friend and I have both recently bought the 9527 from Comet online. Neither of us have the black bars. There is a progressive scan feature when playing NTSC DVDs, although they can look a little grainy depending on the input.
I have a Philips 32Pw8717, and it have the same prob. I have only 2 scarts at the back and s-video, composite at the front. From the 2 scarts I have only one RGB scart plug is available which is ext1. The black bars are not displayed on EXT1 but on the others especially the front Av inputs the bars are extr. clear. These are displayed mainly on black images. This is the Second Philips Tv that I have changed as the First one used to switch on and off continously and had black spots on the screen. Yesterday I have phoned the Local agent here at Malta and he is comming today. I can't understand how these product pass from the quality control!
Couldn't agree more! I have so far had two 9617's (with a 3rd to come in a few days) and I was shocked to see how one set differed over the other in picture quality. The latter being very blurry with the 'bars' (on the far left and distant right) being noticeable as well as the general quality of the picture being totally inferior than the first.. Philips really shouldn't be allowed to get away with sending sets like this out!
I am on TV number 2 now and it also has the bars. It will be going soon and I will buy another make. I am fed up with engineers taking the TV away and the time off work to arrange all this. £1600 worth of telly should not have this problem.
I bought the 9617 on the day it came out I have Sky +, X Box ,Gamecube and DVD player attached and I cant see these bars anywhere .
Just thought i`d post as it sort of disproves the later model theory .
I don`t know if its an accurate poll as many only come to these forums when they find a problem ,I`m not sure 66% of these TVs have it but I really don`t know just my thoughts and also as another guy said I hope mine doesn`t suddenly start doing it .
Well, I'm waiting on my 3rd 9617 that will be here later today.. From what was originally a joyous experience I am dreading turning the set on incase it has problems. I have been promised that if there is anything wrong with this set then I can go for one in a new batch, a route that I really hope I don't need to go down!
I had a look in-store at a FQ80 that I was going to consider instead of the 9617 (if the problems continue) - but I just don't like the look of it that much! - If I had the money I'd buy a B&O instead.. at least your assured quality with those sets.
Finally: .. are all of the 9617's made at the same factory, country, etc?
I took delivery of my 3rd 9617 earlier and have to say that its suffering from the same terrible picture as the previous one (heavy pixilation, shimmering and poor focus) with the black bars in almost the same position as the previous one and equally as visible.
Tip: in order to see the black bars more easily/quickly:- when changing channels via the NTL remote (maybe SKY+ too?) immediately press the Freeze button during the interim *blank* screen before the next channel appears.. then alter the contrast to MAX and the Brightness to about 80%.. the two bars are now clearly visible..
Is anyone else getting major pixilation during broadcasts? .. even the SKY NEWS logo has a heavy pixelated shimmer around it.. and almost all of the text in broadcasts has the ReadyBrek (shimmer) round it.. with many channels as blocky as a poor MPEG file.
I'm going to try one more in the next two weeks when a new batch arrives. I've lost all interest now .. anyone thinking about buying a Philips 9617 should think seriously about the potential problems you might face!
I also have the black bars (9527), these are only noticeable when veiwing on scart 1 & 3 on RGB the composite output option from my digibox is fine.
I used a DVD setup disc (Sound & vision home theatre tune up) to set the contrast, Brightness etc & this dramatically reduced the bars to the point where they are almost unoticible, if you dont have access to a setup DVD then use the THX setup included with Monsters inc this works fine.
As for the pixelisation & shimering have you tried turning the Digital Noise Reduction off? With sky digi the signal quality should be good enough to leave this option off as all the extra processing just adds to the artefacting.
Im afraid however for fast moving action pics & sport especially Footie you will have to revert to 100Hz mode as the only option.
I am not too sure about the set-up discs that have been mentioned. There really is only so much that you can tweak at the end of the day.. and even when done the tweaks are often useless in none DVD viewings. I find that after using THX especially that the picture is too dark afterwards.. and any *normal* broadcasts just dont look or feel right; should we really have to turn the contrast down just to avoid the bars that shouldn't be there in the first place?
Its a fact that the black-bars exist and *are* noticeable (so many people and so many sets cant be wrong) .. I personally am more concerned about the overall quality of the picture [the first set was very nice in terms of picture, the latter two are terrible], but dont tell me that Philips cant make a set without thick black bars? .. they shouldnt be there, not on a set costing in the region of £1400 .. Its also crazy to suggest that the pixilation problem is not a nuisance .. no one is going to watch perfect DVD/broadcasts every time the set is in use, so should heavy real-media like pixilation be expected? I turned the new set on earlier today and tuned in to BBC2.. Columbo was on at the time and I could hardly make out the guys face, so bad was the pixilation .. blocks everywhere.. I tuned into EXT1:RGB->NTL->BBC2 and the very same.. half the channels result in a similar quality of picture.. this aint progress. Once again I was impressed with the first set I had but it was badly scratched.. Had I known that when buying a Philips you take a lucky-dip.. chancing your money on the possibility of getting a decent set I would never have bothered.
Philips should and could do better...
My supplier contacted me today and has agreed to take my set back (PW9617) and replace it with another of my choice. Now this leads me to another problem, firstly if it wasnt for the black bars I find the TV superb, the pixalisation is only evident occasionly on my set, I too watched columbo the other day and it was fine.
So anyway what if any TV set do I replace this one with, the suppliers have recommended the Sony KV32 FQ80.
What do you think peeps?
I have been reading this thread with interest. Having had a Sony KVFS70 TV I have to say that this sounds very like the Sony Scrolling Bar problem. I seem to remember that Sony's official explanation for the scrolling bars was that it was a "100Hz Seam" that was present on ALL 100Hz systems as either scrolling or static bars. Could this be the Philips equivalent?
In any case Sony seem to have done a quite a bit a work fixing this problem with the release of the KVFS76. They recently swapped old FS70 for an FS76 and the bars are gone! So a new Sony might be a good alternative.
Well, I have agreed to take a chance with one more 9617 when a new batch comes in (will have to wait maybe 2 weeks for this though) *but* have also agreed that if this set is just as bad [and I just hope it isn't!] that I will go for the FQ80 instead. I really don't see there being that much choice outside of the FQ80..
The odd thing about the black-bars is that the first set I had it was only *slightly* noticeable.. particularlly in football and hardly ever in normal viewings. You could see a little 'haze' vertically down the right side at times (the bar(s)) .. but were very well hidden.. On on the other two sets that I've had since they have been *clearly* visibile.. the 3rd that I have now even more evident than all the others (the thick bar on the right side)...
In a way I might possibily be able to live with the bars.. I just want a picture similar to the first set; .. clear, in-focus and with no visibile blocky artifacts on most broadcasts.
If you do get a Sony FQ80, please let us know how you get on with it!
Well have now spent most of the last two hours trying to research the sony KV32 FQ80 and have so far drawn a blank as far as reviews go, the specs seem very good but I cant find a review of this set anywhere. Does anyone out there own one, I dont care so much about features all I really want is a good picture-- can it match the 9617? (but without the black bars).
Am running out of time to decide.
There really isn't any decent info on the FQ80 available; bar the one or two snippets of info on this site, of which most are comments and find fault with the set.. the 'buzzing' seems to be the most common. I'd have thought that it would be a good set, but without any firm info, as you say, its difficult to change from the 9617 to FQ80.
Im thinking of buying the 9617 this month but Im really worried about these bars you mention. I was reading on this forum that it is a certain type of tube on the same model causing the bars as on another (think they mentioned EM2) there isnt any bars showing.
Is the tv good value if you get it without these bars? I saw it in the showroom buy couldnt see any of these bars on dark scenes.
Is the sound quite good for a small room?
would appreaciate any input
I would not hesitate for one moment to recommend a 9617.. but thats *only* if you were fortunate enough to get one that worked well! The difference in quality between an as intended 9617 and my previous ageing 32 Philips Widescreen (that had DNR & Natural Motion) was simply unbelievable .. so good was the quality of imagery the 9617 churned out. Everything looked that much clearer, crisper.. credits in films, general text.. picture quality in films amazed, all wowed me in the first few days. Your just sooo impressed with the set to begin with; but thats if you get a good one, remember!
Had my first set not had the scratches on the case of the unit I would have had no problem keeping that particular set; it was nearly perfect in every respect, although I could see a 'slight' vertical haze (albeit only in football games) down the far right of the screen [when the screen panned]. The only thing thats been *issing me off since is that Ive had two sets since and both had had appalling picture quality (and 'bars' on both sets since, much more visibile than the first) with heavy digital artifacts present in many broadcasts.. nowhere near as good as the original set I'm afraid! Im sure this was just a batch problem and thats why Im taking my chance with a 4th set in two weeks time..
I like the Philips 'stand' too .. much better than the awkward looking one that comes with the Sony FQ80; plus you can get more under it! The look of the set is much nicer too.. from the side on you can see that it doesnt seem to have the same bulky footprint as the Sony..
Oh.. and the sound is very nice! No problems there..
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