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PHILIPS LCD 2009 Series - 7404/8404

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PuntNL

Established Member
http://images.philips.com/is/image/...404H_12-GAL-global?wid=430&hei=430&$jpglarge$
47PFL8404
42PFL8404
37PFL8404


Enjoy a movie night in
with Ambilight

Treat yourself to a movie night in. Enjoy the pleasure of the movies in your living room with Pixel Precise HD and the immersive power of Ambilight.

Philips - 8000 series LCD TV 47" Full HD 1080p digital TV - 47PFL8404H/12 - 8000 series - Televisions - Sound and vision





http://images.philips.com/is/image/...404H_12-GAL-global?wid=430&hei=430&$jpglarge$
52PFL7404
47PFL7404
42PFL7404
37PFL7404


Be part of the action.
With slim design and invisible sound

Featuring the stunning Pixel Precise HD and fantastic invisible sound, enjoy the pleasure of the movies in your living room. This full HD 1080p display combined with a super slim design, ensures you're always part of the action.

Philips - 7000 series LCD TV 47" Full HD 1080p digital TV - 47PFL7404H/12 - 7000 series - Televisions - Sound and vision

Mod Comment: images altered to a link, don't hotlink to images from sites you do have permission to do so from
 
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PuntNL

Established Member
Saw there was no general thread yet for the 7000 and 8000 series of Philips 2009 LCD series. Thought it was a good idea to open one, to post impressions, problems and settings...
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
Saw there was no general thread yet for the 7000 and 8000 series of Philips 2009 LCD series. Thought it was a good idea to open one, to post impressions, problems and settings...
thats a good idea i have started a few threads but they were generally about when i got my 47inch 7404 and also about settings that i use and other philips tvs so i think that it good that we have one for our models.:thumbsup:
 

PuntNL

Established Member
Yes thought so too :)

I bought the 47PFL8404 today. Will install it tonight and start playing around with it and its settings immediately.

One question maybe someone can answer. I don't really like what I have seen so far from the Game mode. Too much contrast, sharpness and the cool tint. Now I was wondering if only switching off HD Natural Motion in my personalized settings will result in the same low input lag?
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
Yes thought so too :)

I bought the 47PFL8404 today. Will install it tonight and start playing around with it and its settings immediately.

One question maybe someone can answer. I don't really like what I have seen so far from the Game mode. Too much contrast, sharpness and the cool tint. Now I was wondering if only switching off HD Natural Motion in my personalized settings will result in the same low input lag?
hey puntNl congrats on your purchase. one thing i definately do when playing games is to have hd natural motion off further more on this forum i have a thread called i just brought my philips 47pfl7404 and on the second page of that thread you will find some extensive settings of mine which i use with what i feel are great results.
have a go with them and see how they work for you and if you don't like them then your always free to find what works best for you.:thumbsup:
 
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PuntNL

Established Member
So after playing around for an evening and tweaking the settings a little using a basic calibration disc I came up with the following settings on my 47PFL8404:

Contrast: 78
Brightness: 50
Colour: 55
Sharpness: 3 (for PS3 and Blu-ray: 2)
Noise Reduction: Off
Tint: Normal
HD Natural Motion: Minimum (for PS3 and Blu-ray: off)
100Hz: On (for PS3 and Blu-ray: off)
Advanced sharpness: Off
Dynamic contrast: Off
Dynamic backlight: Best pic
MPEG Art Reduction: Off
Colour Advancement: Off
Light Sensor: Off

Also tried to test the input lag using singstar and the microphones. I am happy to report that turning off HD Natural Motion in my personal settings gives the same result as going for the badly calibrated Game Mode. Don't know the exact ms, but Singstar is totally playable, which means input lag is low...
 
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tomic20

Standard Member
does it support subtitles from an external srt?maybe from a hidden menu?

I have 7404h and cant make it work...not a big deal for me, but i was just wondering...
 

PuntNL

Established Member
Really don't know if I like HD Natural Motion or not... It makes everything very smooth, but also kinda unnatural.

Probably will have it on for TV broadcasts and off for Movies and Games via PS3.

Bumped colour down from 55 to 52...
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
Really don't know if I like HD Natural Motion or not... It makes everything very smooth, but also kinda unnatural.

Probably will have it on for TV broadcasts and off for Movies and Games via PS3.

Bumped colour down from 55 to 52...
hd natural motion isn't for everyone but i'm one of those people who loves the smooth motion and can't watch movies without it.
i always make sure that its off for games and sports though as it will cause alot of shimmer and artifacting i suppose the good thing about it is that you can turn it off if you really don't like it.
 

PuntNL

Established Member
hd natural motion isn't for everyone but i'm one of those people who loves the smooth motion and can't watch movies without it.
i always make sure that its off for games and sports though as it will cause alot of shimmer and artifacting i suppose the good thing about it is that you can turn it off if you really don't like it.

You should turn it off for gaming as it also brings quitte a lot of lag. I am guessing lag without HDNM is about 30-40 ms and with it on goes to something like 100-120ms.

Could you maybe post your settings, which you use now, in this topic. Maybe will get it going a little. Looks like not a lot people here with these sets.

EDIT: Small update in settings after 2 days...

Contrast: 78
Brightness: 52 --> 2 up for better shadow detail, almost without any loss of black
Colour: 52 --> 3 down, primarily for better skin tones
Sharpness: 3 (for PS3 and Blu-ray: 2)
Noise Reduction: Off
Tint: Normal
HD Natural Motion: Minimum (for PS3 and Blu-ray: off)
100Hz: On (for PS3 and Blu-ray: off)
Advanced sharpness: Off
Dynamic contrast: Off
Dynamic backlight: Best pic
MPEG Art Reduction: Off
Colour Advancement: Off
Light Sensor: Off
 
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ade4all

Established Member
i love the deep image from this tv (got 32") though i'm not keen on the hd natural motion either - but even with it off the image spanks all other tvs i've seen in its price range.
1 issue i have though is when connected to laptop through hdmi it will occaisionally ficker green & then the image goes into a kind of psychedelic inverse of what it should be - as if there's a hdmi handshake problem. I've loaded the latest software for tv & graphics card (ati hd3650) but still happens from time to time
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
for sd:
brightness:57
colour:50
contrast:65
sharpness:3
hue:0
noise reduction:minimum
tint:normal
pixel precise:
100hz clear lcd:eek:n
hd natural motion:eek:n minimum/off for sports/off if you don't like it.
tint: custom
white point red: 123
white point green: 100
white point blue: 69
red black level offset: 10
green black level offset: 8
advanced sharpness:eek:ff
mpeg noise reduction:eek:n
dynamic contrast:eek:ff
dynamic backlight:eek:ff
light sensor:eek:ff
colour enhancement:eek:ff
set screen format to widescreen


settings for xbox 360 this tv can output at 1080p via component input
contrast:65
brightness:65
colour:50
hue:0
sharpness:5
noise reduction:eek:ff
tint:normal
pixel precise
100hz clear lcd automatically shuts off
hd natural motion:eek:ff
tint: custom
white point red: 123
white point green: 100
white point blue: 69
red black level offset: 10
green black level offset: 8
advanced sharpness:eek:ff
mpeg noise reduction:eek:ff
dynamic contrast:minimum
dynamic backlight:best picture
light sensor:eek:ff
colour enhancement:medium
screen format:unscaled does dot by dot 1080p. in the xbox 360 setup menu set the screen to widescreen.


hd and bluray settings
brightness:50
colour:50
contrast:70
sharpness:3
noise reduction:eek:ff
tint:normal
pixel precise
100hz clear lcd:eek:n
hd natural motion:minimum/off if you don't like it
tint: custom
white point red: 123
white point green: 100
white point blue: 69
red black level offset: 10
green black level offset: 8
mpeg noise reduction:eek:ff
advanced sharpness:eek:ff
dynamic contrast:eek:ff
dynamic backlight:best picture
light sensor:eek:ff
colour enhancement:eek:ff

screen format: unscaled does dot by dot 1080p. you can also change the screen format to one that suits you ranging from widescreen, auto screen format, and superzoom if do not wish to use unscaled you will find a button on the remote that has format underneath it.
 
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PuntNL

Established Member
wow, a lot of settings. :)

what about your brightness, looks kind of high. Doesn't it completely destroy your blacks..?
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
wow, a lot of settings. :)

what about your brightness, looks kind of high. Doesn't it completely destroy your blacks..?
not at all to be honest i think it has very good blacks and i also feel that with certain movies with the black levels being quite good it tends to give movies that extra pop in my opinion.
 

PuntNL

Established Member
not at all to be honest i think it has very good blacks and i also feel that with certain movies with the black levels being quite good it tends to give movies that extra pop in my opinion.

Okay, will give it a go.. I tried setting brightness with a complete black screen and saw that 50 gives the deepest black and every 2 steps gives a small light bump, not tried it with movies. Kind of critical now as I switched from a plasma which had great blacks. But its something I wanted to give up for all the benefits of LCD :) and not having to bother with that image retention...
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
Okay, will give it a go.. I tried setting brightness with a complete black screen and saw that 50 gives the deepest black and every 2 steps gives a small light bump, not tried it with movies. Kind of critical now as I switched from a plasma which had great blacks. But its something I wanted to give up for all the benefits of LCD :) and not having to bother with that image retention...
i had a panasonic plasma before getting this tv and in my opinion i know it won't beat plasmas for certain things which i was fully aware of.
their both to different technologies and both have pros and cons but i knew this when i brought this tv and to be honest iam happy with it but whos knows what my next upgrade will be in the future led lcd or plasma?

but for the moment i'm content with what i have it provides me with a really incredible picture low power consumption hasn't caused me no problems and i really like the minimalistic styling of it to so can't complain.
 
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PuntNL

Established Member
i had a panasonic plasma before getting this tv and in my opinion i know it won't beat plasma for certain things which i was fully aware of.
their both to different technologies and both have pros and cons but i knew this when i brought this tv and to be honest iam happy with it but whos knows what my next upgrade will be in the future led lcd or plasma?
but for the moment i'm content with what i have it provides me with a really incredible picture low power consumption hasn't caused me no problems and i really like the minimalistic styling of it to so can't complain.

Same here, also come from a Panasonic Plasma. It has it advantages, but for me at this moment LCD is the way to go. Love the design, the picture an djust can't stand the image retention I had. Plasma owners keep saying IR is from the past, but I had some severe retentions in the 4 months I had the set and I was absolutely not abusing it.

Anyway back to my 47PFL8404.. LOVE IT... Will be my TV for the next 5 years, after that we will see.. OLED?
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
Same here, also come from a Panasonic Plasma. It has it advantages, but for me at this moment LCD is the way to go. Love the design, the picture an djust can't stand the image retention I had. Plasma owners keep saying IR is from the past, but I had some severe retentions in the 4 months I had the set and I was absolutely not abusing it.

Anyway back to my 47PFL8404.. LOVE IT... Will be my TV for the next 5 years, after that we will see.. OLED?
i definately agree with you although i did game alot and didn't get a ounce of image retention on my plasma i will add that i don't think its a myth and that it still happens some people are luckier than others not to get it but it does still happen.
i also think that you have to be more aware especially with gaming tv station logos and films with black bars although i do love the superior black levels of a plasma.
 

PuntNL

Established Member
I gathered some stuff, mainly from Philips LCD reviews by AVForums, to make adjusting the settings of this set maybe a little more understanding. Hope its useful for some people:

Mode: Personal
Contrast: 78 (In the “Picture” settings screen, the first adjustment is “Contrast”. This is a little sneaky, and is actually a combined Backlight and White Level adjustment. Independent controls for both would be ideal, but this is much better than a display with no Backlight control at all. At its highest values, dropping the Contrast control will lower the intensity of the backlight lamps behind the panel. After the physical backlights are at their lowest possible intensity, the display then begins to limit the digital white level of the display.)

Brightness: 52
Colour: 52
Sharpness: 3 (for PS3 and Blu-ray: 2)
Noise Reduction: Off
Tint: Normal
HD Natural Motion: Off (This control in the menu is for “HD Natural Motion” (estimated 80 ms of additional lag), which can be turned off, or switched between Minimum or Maximum settings. This is the frame interpolation mode, which causes film content to look smoothed over, as if it was shot in video. Off it went.)

100Hz: Off (Next was “100 Hz Clear LCD”, which was greyed out (inaccessible) and permanently set to Off. The reason for this is that 100hz systems typically rely on generating new inbetween frames in order to improve motion resolution, but this causes an unfilmic motion effect in film-originated images. Some manufacturers let us use 100hz modes to improve motion resolution without causing the unfilmic effect, but there's no such choice here.)

Advanced sharpness: Off (“Advanced Sharpness”. This is a very selective sharpening filter, the strength of which is related to the main Sharpness control. It's certainly not the most convincing detail enhancement system I've seen, so I left it off for standard def content (and of course, for high def as well).

Dynamic contrast: Off (This control is 100% electrical rather than optical. It appears to alter the video processor's gamma curve: crank it up and it'll wash the picture out – it's best left off.)

Dynamic backlight: Best picture (The brightness of the backlight lamps behind the LCD panel is raised or lowered depending on the video signal. It has two settings: “Best power” or “Best picture”.

MPEG Art Reduction: Off
Colour Advancement: Off (Lastly, we have “Colour Enhancement”. Turn it on and the TV will add Blue to the Greyscale mix (in other words, don't turn it on).

Light Sensor: Off
 
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dodgydaz

Established Member
I still love my 7404. It looks stunning - switched on or off!!!

One thing I was wondering guys, what with you posting your settings etc. Have you used one of the THX DVD's for calibrating - and if so did you still have to tweak it a bit. Also, does it make a difference if you use different types / lengths of HDMI cable to display the THX test screens?

I bought a DVD off Amazon recently specifically for the THX calibration bit. I tried it and set up my DVD channel (hdmi 3 on my TV). It looks good, but thought, do I now need to just unplug the DVD HDMI from the back of the TV and then plug it into HDMI 1 and 2 to calibrate those, or do I need to use the HDMI lead for the specific device. ie - do I unplug the lead from the back of my SKY+ box and plug it into the DVD so the settings are exactly right for that cable - or does it not make any difference?

Am I making sense?

I am currently using Markies settings for my other sources which is good enough for me really, but you know what it's like. If you can squeeze a bit more out to make the picture absolutely brilliant I wanna try it.
 

PuntNL

Established Member
I used the knowledge which I posted above for the different settings along with the pixel protector DVD which has various test screens. I don't have any measurement tools except for my eyes.

So you are also using brightness around the 60's. I really feel that going above 50 will make my blacks look washed out...
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
I still love my 7404. It looks stunning - switched on or off!!!

One thing I was wondering guys, what with you posting your settings etc. Have you used one of the THX DVD's for calibrating - and if so did you still have to tweak it a bit. Also, does it make a difference if you use different types / lengths of HDMI cable to display the THX test screens?

I bought a DVD off Amazon recently specifically for the THX calibration bit. I tried it and set up my DVD channel (hdmi 3 on my TV). It looks good, but thought, do I now need to just unplug the DVD HDMI from the back of the TV and then plug it into HDMI 1 and 2 to calibrate those, or do I need to use the HDMI lead for the specific device. ie - do I unplug the lead from the back of my SKY+ box and plug it into the DVD so the settings are exactly right for that cable - or does it not make any difference?

Am I making sense?

I am currently using Markies settings for my other sources which is good enough for me really, but you know what it's like. If you can squeeze a bit more out to make the picture absolutely brilliant I wanna try it.
hi dodgydaz i put up my settings for anyone trying to get a watchable picture and as a start up.

the only judge of a good picture is yourself i say feel free to try whatever you want to get the the best picture that you can get.

i didn't use any calabration discs to get the picture i have, i went on what i felt looked good to my eyes good luck on whatever you try.:smashin:
 

Silverblack

Prominent Member
I gathered some stuff, mainly from Philips LCD reviews by AVForums, to make adjusting your settings maybe a little more understanding. Hope its useful for some people:

Mode: Personal
Contrast: 78 (In the “Picture” settings screen, the first adjustment is “Contrast”. This is a little sneaky, and is actually a combined Backlight and White Level adjustment. Independent controls for both would be ideal, but this is much better than a display with no Backlight control at all. At its highest values, dropping the Contrast control will lower the intensity of the backlight lamps behind the panel. After the physical backlights are at their lowest possible intensity, the display then begins to limit the digital white level of the display.)

Brightness: 52
Colour: 52
Sharpness: 3 (for PS3 and Blu-ray: 2)
Noise Reduction: Off
Tint: Normal
HD Natural Motion: Off (This control in the menu is for “HD Natural Motion” (estimated 80 ms of additional lag), which can be turned off, or switched between Minimum or Maximum settings. This is the frame interpolation mode, which causes film content to look smoothed over, as if it was shot in video. Off it went.)

100Hz: Off (Next was “100 Hz Clear LCD”, which was greyed out (inaccessible) and permanently set to Off. The reason for this is that 100hz systems typically rely on generating new inbetween frames in order to improve motion resolution, but this causes an unfilmic motion effect in film-originated images. Some manufacturers let us use 100hz modes to improve motion resolution without causing the unfilmic effect, but there's no such choice here.)

Advanced sharpness: Off (“Advanced Sharpness”. This is a very selective sharpening filter, the strength of which is related to the main Sharpness control. It's certainly not the most convincing detail enhancement system I've seen, so I left it off for standard def content (and of course, for high def as well).

Dynamic contrast: Off (This control is 100% electrical rather than optical. It appears to alter the video processor's gamma curve: crank it up and it'll wash the picture out – it's best left off.)

Dynamic backlight: Best picture (The brightness of the backlight lamps behind the LCD panel is raised or lowered depending on the video signal. It has two settings: “Best power” or “Best picture”.

MPEG Art Reduction: Off
Colour Advancement: Off (Lastly, we have “Colour Enhancement”. Turn it on and the TV will add Blue to the Greyscale mix (in other words, don't turn it on).

Light Sensor: Off
i would prefer it if you didn't alter my settings:nono: if you want to add your own and make adjustments then feel free when people ask what settings i use i give them what i use.

i know what every element of the processing does so if people don't like what they see they can experiment on getting a picture which looks good to them thats the whole idea of playing around with different settings until you find what looks good to your eyes.
 

PuntNL

Established Member
i would prefer it if you didn't alter my settings:nono: if you want to add your own and make adjustments then feel free when people ask what settings i use i give them what i use.

Sorry don't know what you are talking about. These are my settings, which I gained from adjusting out of the Movie mode. Only thing I did is that I searched for Philips reviews to find out what every setting does (especially the enhancements). Posted it along my settings, so people can get a feeling with why I went for those settings. Everyone is free to know if they use yours or mine. I dind't use yours as a base, I went from scratch to these in my own experience and view..

EDIT: I adjusted the phrasing in that post, you could read it that I was talking about YOUR settings ;-), But I meant your settings in a more general way as in everybody who wants to adjust them...
 
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gfighter

Standard Member
Got the 42PFL7404 last week. Only negative things that I have noticed are:

1) There seems to be a dimming, then brightening when watching Sky+ through SCART. It's only slight and does not seem apparent on Xbox360 or DVD, through side HDMI and s-video respectively.

2) On some videos streamed through Xbox360 there is sometimes a loss of sound that is corrected by restarting the TV.

Anyone else notice this? I just flashed firmware to latest version in the hope that it solves issues.
 
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