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Philips 28PW6006 - RGB Ghosting Problems

Discussion in 'Televisions' started by Popgin, Apr 23, 2002.

  1. Popgin

    Popgin
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    Finally took delivery of my shiny new 6006 today, and i love it - but i have one small prob.

    If I fire up my dvd player, i get a small amount of ghosting - in the form of very faint, inch thick vertical bars passing across the picture. Now, i'm no expert, but through a system of elimination it's become clear that this is due to some interference from the set's tuner - if i switch to the Ext from a dead channel of static, the bars are replaced with faint echos of said static instead - the same result if i disconnect the arial.

    I've disconnected the infamous 19th pin in my scart lead - but to no avail.

    Basically - what i want is a completely empty "dead channel" to switch to the ext mode from - one empty of any signal information (rather than the static dancing of, say channel 67 or whatever) - the blank screens that some sets display if they can't get a clear signal.

    BUT, try as i might, i can't find a mode on this set to get one.

    Any ideas?
     
  2. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    I have the 32in 6006 model.

    I get this to some degree in RGB with both my Sony 725 DVD player and my NTL Pace digital box.

    The picture from my Sony DVD is very dark when compared to my Pace box,which is very odd.I've since changed my DVD output to S-Video and it is now excellent,both sharp,bright and without any inch wide bands at the very far sides,much better than I thought and have seen S-Video before.

    I am in the process of watching NTL digital with just the composite output.This reduces the bands on both sides quite a bit and completely on the right hand side,especially in darker scenes.

    Try turning down the brightness,as this can reduce the bands,on my Sony 725 in RGB anyway.

    It would seem that this Philips model is fussy about it's RGB output,a shame really as the picture is excellent.
     
  3. John Jennings

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    I suffer from this occasionally on my 28PW6006 (it's bizzare that it only happens occasionally). I worked out how to get a completely dead screen to switch to AV from though, hopefully this'll work for you;

    What I've done is tune channel 0 to my VCR RF frequency. When my VCR is in standby this means that channel 0 is a perfectly black screen. Then when I go to the AV input I want to watch I get no ghosting at all.

    There do seem to be some minor interference problems on some PW6006s due to cross-talk betweeen AV inputs too. A friend of mine has a 28PW6006 and has the folllowing prob; his digibox is in AV1 (RGB), his DVD player is in AV2 (S-Video). When watching DVDs he sometimes gets minor ghosting from his digibox (sometimes scrolling bars, sometimes a faint version of whatever channel the digibox is showing). Simply turning the digibox to standby completelt eliminates the ghosting though, so it's not an issue at all. I don't get this problem on mine though.
     
  4. Wayne Moule

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    I get ghosting on my DVD via S-Video from whatever analogue channel I was watching before.Tuning the analogue channel to channel 99,which has no signal,just noise,eliminates this.

    I have to switch my NTL digital box off as well,to eliminate the previous channel I was watching on it,before watching a DVD via S-Video.
     
  5. rmg

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    Well,

    Im gutted.

    After ages looking at all the different 28's on offer I settled on the 28pw6006.

    I bought it today from Hi-Spek in ST Albans and was really happy.....

    apart from *really bad* ghosting when using my PS2 via RGB.

    I have tried loads of different things but I am getting really bad ghosts of whatever is on the analogue chanel. Even if I go from a dead screen I get a grey 'sheet' across three quaters of the page.

    My main reason for buying a new telly was to have decent RGB for my PS2 gaming.

    Unless anyone can give me some advice I will have to call Hi-Spek tomorrow and tell them its no good.

    Im gutted because apart from this stupid problem the TV is lovely with a wicked picture.

    I cant believe Philips have buggered up the shielding (if that is what it is) so badly.

    I hate to say it but I would not recommend this TV to anyone. Not the curret batch anyway.

    /me goes to bed feeling very sorry for myself :-(

    --
    rmg.
     
  6. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    rmg.

    Have you tried unplugging everything,including aerial,bar the PS2?

    My NTL Pace box is generally excellent in RGB.
     
  7. rmg

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    Hi,

    Thanks for the reply.

    I have tried taking out all other scarts and the aerial and I still get the problem. It is really hard to see in the day but at night you can really make it out.

    I have tried plugging my ntl pace box in via ex 1 and the problem does not occur. However I am using the scart lead that came with it and I am not sure if this is fully wired for rgb?

    I am off now to get a fully wired scart to try with the digibox.

    If this causes the ghosting then I guess it confirms that the tv has a problem. If it is still ok then I guess it might be interference outside the set somewhere....

    I have tried the 'dead screen' method but my video either displays a blue screen when on, or snow when off. If I switch from a blue screen I still get a sheet of ghost image, (Not as bad as when I switch from a picture but still noticable)

    I will have a nother go at removing everything from under the telly and just trying the PS2 and the digi box on their own via EX1 with RGB.

    Will report back soon ;-)

    --
    rmg.
     
  8. rmg

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    Reporting back ;-)

    The digi box does not do it. The picture is really good with no visible interference / distortion.

    The PS2 has it no matter what I plug in / leave unplugged.

    And it is only doing it via RGB. If I switch to composite the ghosting dissapears.

    I guess this means it isnt the telly?

    Im gonna borrow an x-box later and see if that does it ;-)

    --
    rmg.
     
  9. rmg

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    Oh dear,

    I have just seen the thread posted by carrie in the other 6006 thread.

    This one > http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=31969

    I have exactly the same problem. rgb ghosting / noise from middle of screen to far left and very bad colors and contrast :-(

    Anyone know how good hi spek are when it comes to returns?

    funny thing is the digibox is fine, but both ps2 and xbox fail miserably :-(

    --
    rmg.
     
  10. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    Are the PS2 and XBox RGB and composite only?Isn't the picture good enough in composite anyway,as this telly has an excellent picture with this output?

    Other than that,send it back if you're not happy and can't come to a happy compromise with it.
     
  11. rmg

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    Well,

    The standard leads that come with ps2 and x box are composite but you can get rgb leads and they give a *much* improved picture.

    You are right tho, the composite picture delivered by this telly is outstanding.

    Although not quite as sharp as proper rgb.

    I have spoken to the dealer and they have agreed that I can take it in to be checked. I really hope that another set does not have the issue because apart from this niggle I am very happy with the set.

    If it is, I will have to choose something else!

    --
    rmg
     
  12. John Jennings

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    I really don't have a prob with mine. I use a PS2 on my 28PW6006 without any ghosting probs at all. Have you considered using a different PS2 RGB cable?

    The fact that there's no problem with your Digibox suggests it's not a fault with the telly, but either with the PS2 or the cable. Maybe if it's a bad cable it could be picking up interference?

    John
     
  13. rmg

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    Hi,

    Yes, I thought that it was the PS2 but I completely removed that and plugged in a friends x-box with an RGB scart and got exactly the same problem.

    The only thing that freaks me out is that the digibox does not have the problem, although if I look *very closely* I think I can see a faint line with the digi box as well.

    Its going back this week, (im not far from the shop) and I pray its a set specific issue as I am in love with the telly apart from this problem.)

    From the sounds of it I have the same problem has Carrie had in the Phillips service menu thread.

    --
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  14. rmg

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    Just noticed that you started that thread and was heavily involved in it ;-)

    I will try and take a piccy of the prob with my digicam tonight.

    Im also gettin the same rgb contrast probs that carrie had.

    --
    rmg
     
  15. Carrie

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    Try turning the brightness up if you want to illustate the problem with the ghosting to an engineer. I tried various things with my returned set as I mentioned in the other thread, but no go. It's a real shame as the set was very good in SVideo and composite. So close and yet so far.

    I too would advise anyone not to buy this television, at least not for a couple of months - in case this lot is just a bad batch.
     
  16. John Jennings

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    Well, reading all of this I went to see if I could see the problem on my telly (which I'd never noticed the prob on). And guess what, it is there, but to such a miniscule degree that you really can't notice it.

    In daylight conditions I couldn't notice a damn thing, with curtains closed at dusk I couldn't notice a damn thing. Tried at midnight with no lights in my lounge on, not a damn thing. Tried again at midnight, with no lights at all in the house on and I could just about notice a few really faint vertical lines and bars.

    These could only be seen with a perfectly black screen (using a DVD paused between names during some film credits). As soon as a single line of text came on screen the glow surrounding the text meant I couldn't notice them any more (and believe me I tried for a fair while with different images and differnt RGB sources. I'm really, really, really picky about these kind of things, as anyone who's seen my other posts about my PW6006 will attest :D).

    As I said, this could only be seen in perfect pitch dark conditions, even with just a 40W table lamp on in the hallway outside the lounge, with the lounge door still closed (so the only light was some creeping under the door) then I couldn't see the lines any more. Believe me, I really tried to look for them very hard indeed!

    You're right though, they're not there at all on composite or S-video though. It'd seem that maybe there is a bad batch out there where this tiny RGB flaw is exaagerated. I've had two PW6006s and haven't had the problem at noticeable levels on either of them.

    Cheers,
    John
     
  17. tom-m

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    Just out of interest, does anybody know where their tv was made? According to the box, mine was made in france, and though I've scrutinized the picture thoroughly, I can't find the same faults listed here.

    Perhaps I was lucky, but I hope everyone gets their problems sorted out though, as it's amazing how your tv can really stress you out:(

    tom-m
     
  18. John Jennings

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    Mine is French made too (half of text on the cardboard box it came in was in French on mine).

    The RGB problem probably is there on yours too Tom, it's an absolutely tiny problem on mine (I had to turn the brightness right up (so that black tones became light grey) and view the screen in an absolutely pitch black room to notice anything at all, and even then I wasn't 100% sure if I was seeing a problem or not). There's not a chance in hell that I'd be able to make out the problem if there was a moving image on the screen.

    I guess we're the lucky ones Tom. I know all too well what you mean about the stress from TVs though. Roll-on a direct neural link from a DVD player to the brain's visual cortex :clown:

    John
     
  19. Wayne Moule

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    Could everyone tell me which make of DVD player you are using for RGB output please,that has no interference?

    As I said,my Sony 725 is now excellent in S-Video,but is too dark in RGB to watch,with no real visible banding in RGB though,as long as I turn the brightness down a touch.

    :confused:
     
  20. John Jennings

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    I've tried a Pioneer 444, a PS2 and a PS1 (obviously not DVD, but just testing another RGB source).

    Cheers,
    John
     
  21. tom-m

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    Wayne, mines an old Grundig 210A, (which I was originally using with an hitachi 25" 4:3 tv), it's had a new lease of life since I connected it up to the 6006.

    As for RGB/S-Video, on mine the difference is very minimal, so little in fact that apart from slightly heavier colour saturation in RGB, I can hardly tell the difference.

    John, I'm so glad I can't see that interference problem, as I pulled enough hair out of my head when I first entered the service menu. I really don't want to see it...

    cheers
    tom
     
  22. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    tom-m.

    Yeah,S-Video is as good as RGB on mine too,which is impressive.

    Thanks chaps.
     
  23. Wayne Moule

    Wayne Moule
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    If any one is interested,I've solved,by chance,the 4:3 viewing and update of teletext.

    Type in the now and next programme guide number,606 on BBC,120 on ITV/C4,wait until it goes into the 4:3 aspect ratio and then just simply type in your next page,or hit a fastext button and it will stay in the 4:3 aspect ratio.More importantly,when you hit the update button,you can still view your programmes in the correct aspect ratio.This works on BBC1,BBC2,ITV and C4 9 times out of 10 and would probably work for the sports live update info as well.This does not work for teletext mix.

    I hope this is of some use.
     
  24. rmg

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    Hello,

    Me again.

    Well, I finally got of my backside and took the telly back to Hi_Spek.

    They said they would have to get an engineer to check it.

    Well, they have just called me and said they can find nothing wrong with it. :mad:

    So, this means one of three things:

    - It is there and they cannot see it.
    - They are not using an RGB connection to test it
    - The problem has stopped (yea, right!)

    So,
    Im off to Hi spek tomorrow armed with a PS2 and an X-Box to prove to them that the set has a fault,

    I will also request that I can try any replacement (If offered) before I leave!

    They have been good about things so far but I am vexed that they cannot see (what is to me) a very obvious shielding / ghosting problem.

    Anyway, I will hopefully be posting a smiley tomorrow!

    --
    rmg.
     
  25. rmg

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    :)

    Refunded.

    I *forced* them to switch of the lights in the store.

    Now, do I risk another 6006 or set my sites elsewhere??????

    <sigh> Back to the minefield that is 'choosing a decent telly'

    --
    rmg.
     
  26. RossG

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    There was I, just about to order a 28PW6006 from unbeatable and I read this thread. After reading all the horror stories about high end WideScreen TVs I'd decided to play it safe and buy a cheapy, after all we've spent the last 10 years watching a pretty ropey 4:3 Ferguson so any improvement would be well appreciated.

    Hmmm should I chance it or should I continue my search???

    One question to those of you with a 6006 and more than 2 inputs, do you manually change scarts or do you use a switch box?

    Ross
     
  27. rmg

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    Well,

    It is a lovely telly but I would recommend testing RGB input for ghosting before parting with your cash.

    I use a scart switcher from Argos, code ends in 0370. It is fully wired and well shielded. A bargain at a tenner. You need a scart to wire it to the telly. Its manual switching but easier than changing scarts!

    --
    rmg.
     
  28. John Jennings

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    I've had two of them from Unbeatable and the problem's not been there (at least at a noticeable level) on either. A friend of mine who owns one doesn't have the problem either (he bought from Unbeatable too, don't know if that's related).

    It really is an excellent TV for the price, and is still way better than anything else I've seen at a comparable price.

    As for scart switching, I've got my digibox in Scart 1 and use my AV amp as a switcher for Scart 2.

    Cheers,
    John
     
  29. Wayne Moule

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    RossG.

    What I do with more than 2 scart inputs is daisy chain.

    Luckily all of my JVC SVHS,NTL digital and Sony 725 DVD have two scarts at the back.You could link them all up by only using the one scart of the telly.

    I currently have my NTL box into scart 1 and the JVC linked via the Sony into scart 2 for S-Video.

    I think this telly is worth the chance at any price,taken from my experiences and definately at the present price.
     
  30. RossG

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    John thanks for reminding me about my AV amp doing the switching!

    As you both say at the current price its pretty damn ... well unbeatable in fact. What is their delivery delay like?

    Ross
     

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