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PC-Ultra or PB12-Ultra/2?

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by Steve Zodiac, Dec 7, 2004.

  1. Steve Zodiac

    Steve Zodiac
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    Having read quite a bit on this forum regarding SVS subs, I've decided that either there are a lot of SVS employees here, or, they are simply very good subs!

    Having made an enquiry to SVS regarding the above mentioned models and stating the room size, Erik suggested that the PC-Ultra would be fine.

    I am hoping that this new sub will last many years without feeling the need to upgrade. If I do go for the PC-Ultra, does anyone think that I may regret not spending the extra on the PB12-Ultra/2 now?

    Steve.
     
  2. Nimby

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    Performance aside, personal opinion would come down to living with a large furry tube or a large box in your room.

    Perhaps a partner should be involved in the buying decision?

    Nimby

    SVS European Branch (nightwatchman)

    Only joking: SVS supplies direct via the internet from the USA.
     
  3. Ian J

    Ian J
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    The Ultra 2 is reputed to have a better driver but you probably need a well trained pair of ears to hear the difference and then only at very loud levels.

    At "normal" listening levels I doubt whether the average person could hear any difference at all. As Nimby said, go for the one with the shape you prefer.
     
  4. juniper

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    One other thing to consider Steve is size and weight. The PB12-Ultra/2 weighs 190lb :eek: , so if you are set on where it will stay ('cos. you won't be able to move it around unless there are about four of you) then then a box Ultra will be great - it should provide additional headroom (you don't say how big your room is) too. I have the PB12-Plus/2, and gives me more bass than I require in a 28' x 20' room. Having said that if I'd had the money I'd have gone for the PB12-Ultra/2, on the basis that (IMHO) I don't think there is such a thing as too much headroom, and to my tastes the box Ultra is just so much more aesthetically pleasing as far as the finish is concerned.

    So to sum up my 2p worth, if size, weight and money are not considerations for you, and especially if you're wondering now whether you might want to upgrade already, then go for the big :eek: box. If all you want is great bass, then the PC-Ultra obviously has it in spades.

    Good luck with your choice!
     
  5. Steve Zodiac

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    Thanks for the replies.

    I really don't mind either design and my partner says she doesn't mind which one I buy, but she has only seen small photos on the PC! I did give her an idea of the size of these things with a tape measure and they both seemed to meet with approval. Planning permission was granted! The only concern (apart from the additional £600) with PB12-U/2 is the weight, but either model shouldn't be moved much - hopefully. The room is a "through" room and is 29' x 13' in total. The area where the system is located is 17' x 13'.

    I thought that the PC-Ultra and the PB12-Ultra/2 had identical drivers, it was just that the latter had two drivers and an extra amp, which are mounted in a hefty box, as opposed to the tube design.

    I'm certainly not looking to spend money for the sake of it, but, as I said, I don't want to regret in the future not going for the PB12-U/2 now. It's not really as though I thinking of upgrading before I buy, it's that I thought there was a possibility that someone with a similar model to the PCU, may have regretted, to some extent at least, not buying the two speaker boxed model instead.
     
  6. Ian J

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    My mistake, I was thinking about the PB12-Plus.

    Secrets of Home theatre tested the PB12-Ultra/2 and their opinion was that it was worth the extra as it sounded much better than the cheaper box sub.

    A further alternative worth exploring might be a pair of PB-10 subs
     
  7. Steve Zodiac

    Steve Zodiac
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    Now your just trying to confuse the issue!! I've pretty much decided on buying one of the two models I've mentioned, but I do appreciate the suggestion.

    The one thing I didn't say was that I will be using the new sub with a set of six Def Tech ProMonitor 80 surrounds and a ProCentre 100 centre, which I have been very pleased with. I hope that they will blend ok with the new sub until sometime in the future when I may replace them with something a little better.

    In terms of the speakers to sub cost ratio, this may seem well out of balance for the present time!
     
  8. Ian J

    Ian J
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    I moved up to M&K speakers from the Def Tech Pro Cinema range and very good they were too. It's a shame that they were never marketed well as I believe them to have been head and shoulders ahead of the other satellites available at the time.

    I ran mine with a REL Storm and see no reason why they shouldn't perform very well with an SVS
     
  9. 1 GND

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    Steve, Juniper summed up the choices perfectly.

    I bought the PB12 Ultra/2 on the recommendations on this site (and wondered if it was overhyped) and am very grateful to all concerned as I absolutely love it! Go for the best, buy the box and I guarantee you will not regret it. It is only part of of my system I cannot think of upgrading.
     
  10. 1 GND

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    Oh and I forgot to add, you should hear it with music!!!! Fantastic!!!!! :clap: :clap:
     
  11. Steve Zodiac

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    Glen's reply caught me at a weak moment and I've just placed an order with SVS for the PB12 Ultra/2.

    Considering that the new sub idea only started around four weeks ago, when I saw a second-hand Definitive Technology ProSub 80 (the same as my present sub) on eBay and thinking it would make a good addition for around £120, this has snowballed rather quickly through second-hand REL units, new REL units, then after reading AVF last Friday night until 4am Saturday morning, I've finally placed an order. Finally is probably the wrong word, all things considered!

    I hope Mrs Zodiac is going will still be smiling after I tell her when she gets home later and more to the point, when she sees the thing in the flesh!

    Thanks to all for the advice.

    Steve.
     
  12. 1 GND

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    :thumbsup: Good Man!! :thumbsup:

    Mrs Zodiac will probably have a shock, but then again Mrs Dowie is now out of councelling and listening to CD`s all day instead!

    You`ll love it mate, Well done!! :clap: :clap:

    Let us all know what you think when you get it..... :)
     
  13. Nimby

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    190lbs? Piece of cake. A child could move it.

    I'm sure I've posted here before on the ease of moving heavy things about if you first roll them onto an old blanket or a rug. On smooth floors the friction is very low. On fitted carpets a layer of thick polythene or vinyl can replace the rug. Just pull on the blanket, rug or vinyl. Don't push on the heavy object.
    Avoid damaging nicely finished surfaces on rough floors though! Putting a subwoofer base down will usually avoid scraping off the veneer from the top or sides. Particularly if you use some extra padding to protect it. But you try this idea entirely at your own risk! Don't try it with anything with spikes or feet sticking out the bottom. Or you'll need a new floor finish!!
    Think twice, move once. When you get to your desired spot you roll the sub onto another bit of carpet or rug. Remove your "wheelie" rug. Then roll your sub upright onto the bare floor (or onto whatever surface you intend to have beneath the sub. A helper might be useful for the rolling with very heavy objects. Or they can help you lift the sub straight onto a rug ready for moving to its resting place. :)

    Nimby Dostievsky :blush:
    The encyclopedic guide to moving heavy subwoofers.
     
  14. Steve Zodiac

    Steve Zodiac
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    I'll certainly add a comment here (hopefully positive) when it's up and running, then I too can spread the Word!

    That's a good idea Nimby about the thick polythene on the carpet to move it. There won't be a wood veneer to scratch though, they are only available in the black finish at the moment. I wouldn't have gone for a wood finish anyway as it's going to be fairly out of sight. It's also around £225 extra for a wood finish - when it is available.

    It should also look smaller in a dark colour!
     
  15. juniper

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    Congratulations on your purchase Steve - I remember my own angst whilst in the throes of trying to hit the purchase button. It seems somehow trivial now! Cannot wait to hear your thoughts when you get it. Oh come to me Darla :thumbsup:

    Would echo also Glen's comments as to the fact that mine is the only part of my system that I cannot possibly even think of justification for upgrading, and for me that is saying a hell of a lot!
     
  16. Steve Zodiac

    Steve Zodiac
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    Hi again,

    I've been meaning to post a few follow-up comments for some time now, as it's been a good few months since I received the PB12-Ultra/2.

    First of all, the negative comments: It looked bigger than I thought it would....that's it, nothing else at all. We soon got used to it visually and we've never had a visitor say: "What the hell is that"! All I would advise anyone contemplating buying one of these things, is to find a cardboard box the same size and put it where you think the sub will be finally positioned. I have read this elsewhere on AVF and it is certainly a good idea.

    From the positive point of view; all I can say about the PB12-Ultra/2 and SVS as a company is praise. As a company to deal with; the advice, ordering, being kept informed, delivery, packaging, the sub itself; were all first class. The sub sonically was beyond expectations for both movies and music. Earthquakes in movies are earthquakes in the room rather than effects! My Mother actually looked quite scared during the first few minutes of Toy Story 2 when the ground opened up under Buzz!!
    With music, my diminutive Definitive Technology ProMonitor 80's are made to sound like quality floorstanders with the backing of the SVS sub.
    Another plus point was that it was easy to set up using the comprehensive instructions, the built-in parametric equalizer accompanied by an SPL meter, an Excel graph and a few hours. The final frequency curve was quite flat and there wasn't any need for a feedback destroyer.

    So there you have it - no regrets at all, I am a very pleased SVS customer.

    Thanks again to all for their comments and advice.

    Steve.
     
  17. Ian J

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    That's no way to treat your mother :rotfl:

    That scene is one of my demo pieces and even after all this time it still makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand up and my SVS is a couple of rungs down the ladder from yours.

    Welcome to the club :thumbsup:
     
  18. 1 GND

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    Well done Steve !!!!! Knew you`d like it :devil:

    Off topic I know but very briefly..What do you think of your plasma? Am thinking about that model myself...
     
  19. Steve Zodiac

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    Hi Glen, I'm very pleased with the plasma. I was very sceptical about going from the Sony CRT to a plasma, but fortunately I have no regrets at all. (Sounds a bit like my previous post!)

    Before a saw a 55" plasma, I expected one to have an inferior quality image compared to the smaller sizes, but it didn't, or I should say, the differences when viewing 42", 50" and 55" Fujitsu's next to each other was marginal, compared to the difference in size and the impact from the size increase. 50" to 55" doesn't sound a lot bigger, but when they are side by side, the 55" does look quite a lot bigger.

    I ended up going for the Hitachi (actually unseen) because it had a DVI input (apparently, according to Fujitsu themselves, their 55" didn't, although some mags do say it has), the Hitachi was cheaper and magazine reviews said the Hitachi had a better image than the Fujitsu version. As you probably know, the panels in the Fujitsu and Hitachi 55" plasma's are identical.

    From what I have read regarding Fujitsu and their AVM processing, I would have expected their version to be better - but not according to the reviews I've read - not that I base purchases solely on magazine reviews. I've not seen the two models side by side so I can't say if this is true, but I can confirm that the Hitachi gives a great image even when compared to my Sony CRT. The blacks may be slightly blacker on the CRT, and, poorer quality sky transmissions may looker a little better on the CRT - simply because it is smaller; but overall the Hitachi is far more enjoyable to watch. The colours on the Hitachi are actually more realistic than on the CRT and geometry on the plasma is of course perfect.

    The people who have seen my plasma and know a little about the technology, are quite impressed by such a large, high quality image.

    I hope that was brief enough!
     
  20. jmbrailsford

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    Hi Steve,
    if you don't mind me asking I was just wondering how much the SVS PB12-Ultra/2 including carriage and customs fees from the USA.

    I think it will be far too expesive for me but it might give me some idea as to whether to look at any of the other SV Subs.

    Any recommendations for a garage conversion approx 2.5m by 5m, PB12-Ultra/2 would probably be too much for that size of room anyway.

    any help/info greatly appreciated.

    Mike.

    :thumbsup:
     
  21. Steve Zodiac

    Steve Zodiac
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    Hi Mike,

    Unfortunately I no longer have the exact breakdown but the overall cost was pretty close on £1500 all in, including an SPL meter and an 8m phono lead for the sub. The whole procedure from ordering to delivery was very straight forward - in fact it went much smoother than some items I have ordered in the UK.

    With regard to a PB12-Ultra/2 being too much for you room; I'm certainly no expert but if it's set up correctly it shouldn't be "too much", it will just have a lot of quality reserve for those louder moments! I would say that if you could afford the PB12-Ultra/2 and it would fit ok into the room (try the cardboard box idea), then go for it.

    It's been said previously and I can now say the same - it's the one item of my AV set-up that I can't imagine ever replacing.
     
  22. 1 GND

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    Sorry Steve for reply delay but have been working late.

    Thanks for the breif reply..you`re a star! I saw this plasma on display on holiday in Dubai and must admit was very impressed. Just can`t decide whether to buy now or wait to see what`s round the corner. Fantastic set up you have though. Thanks again.
     
  23. fursale

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    Hi,I have a PB12-Ultra/2 on the way and can't wait.
    Would anyone have a excel graph file they could send me.
    I have tried but have never used excel before.

    Thanks
     
  24. Nimby

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    Check out Home Theatre Shack for free Excel and REW downloads plus support forum and excellent illustrated helpfiles.

    I'd use REW if you can. Short sweep with immediate on screen response curve and BFD filter suggestions.
    The tests are so quick you can make small adjustment to sub position, phase, house curves and level and have the visible results in seconds.

    May one assume that you are US-based to get your hands on an Ultra?
     
  25. Kclman

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    Steve where did you purchase your svs ultra/2 from please?
     
  26. Ian J

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    18 months ago when Steve bought his Ultra there was only one source of supply and that was SVS themselves.
     
  27. fursale

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    Thanks I will check that out.I am in Knoxville TN and the sub is coming from akron Ohio,about 500 miles away.
    Check out Baxglobal's tracking info.
    They must have sent it on a f-15 from toledo to nashville (600 MILES).
    Actually there is a 1 hour time difference so it works out.
    Could be testing the integrity of the building by evening.:D

    Date Time Pieces Activity Location Remarks
    19-Sep-2006 0745 1 Departed Nashville, TN, US ETA KNOXVILLE 1145/19
    19-Sep-2006 0700 1 Scanned Nashville, TN, US
    19-Sep-2006 0633 1 Arrived Nashville, TN, US
    19-Sep-2006 0615 1 Departed Toledo, OH, US
    19-Sep-2006 0534 1 Scanned Toledo, OH, US
    19-Sep-2006 0200 1 Arrived Toledo, OH, US
    18-Sep-2006 2300 1 Departed Akron/Canton, OH, US
    18-Sep-2006 1848 1 Scanned Akron/Canton, OH, US
    18-Sep-2006 1838 1 Shipment Labeled Akron/Canton, OH, US
    18-Sep-2006 1500 1 Received Akron/Canton, OH, US
     
  28. Steve Zodiac

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    What Ian said is of course correct, but I don't think SVS ship direct to the UK anymore.

    AV-Sales now sell SVS including the PB12-Plus/2, but it would appear that they do not sell the Ultra version.

    Steve.
     
  29. Kclman

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    Thanks, No I have contacted them and they have no fixed date for the arrival of the ultra, they told me I could by the plus/2 and then upgrade at a later date to the ultra drivers.

    However they have no idea how much this will cost.


    I really need sub for my system, should I wait or plump for the plus/2?

    Thanks again!
     
  30. Steve Zodiac

    Steve Zodiac
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    If you look at the specs for the PB12-Plus/2 and the PB12-Ultra/2, you'll find that even though the cabinets are the same size, there is a difference in weight of 50 pounds; so I very much doubt that it is just the Ultra drivers that make up this difference in weight. I would guess that perhaps the PB12-Ultra/2 box is possibly a little more substantial. Also, the PB12-Plus/2 has a 900 watt amp and the PB12-Ultra/2 has a 1000 watt amp. I personally wouldn't think the extra 100 watts was worth worrying about though.

    To upgrade to Ultra drivers isn't going to be cheap at $579 - or about £300 each! If you do feel you must have the Ultra model then I would wait for that, rather than buying the new drivers at a later date.

    I bought the the PB12-Ultra/2 because at the time it was available direct and was the best sub SVS made with a built-in amp. If I really needed a sub now and the Ultra model wasn't available, then I would buy the PB12-Plus/2, which sonically, probably isn't very much behind the PB12-Ultra/2.

    I'm sure you'll be very happy with either model.

    Steve.
     

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