Right. Panny 85 £329 Pioneer 420 £299 Readability and frame accurate recording is what I want as well as automatic chapter insertion. Can't find the English manual for the Panny only the American one. Don't know if this differs much though apart from socketry, region coding, voltage etc. Can't wait any longer for the JVC DR 7 plus it is a bit OTT for my needs. Already had a Tosh 32 but sent that back due to readability problems from day 1 with a variety of disc brands and speeds. Thats it. Must buy tomorrow. Hole, pocket & burning money etc.