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Panasonic th42pw4

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by Gliese 581c, Oct 21, 2002.

  1. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    I'm at the point of breaking with the buzzing from this set. I totally love the pic quality but the buzzing sound is driving me nuts.

    Also, while I was up looking at the set trying to find the exact area the buzzing was coming from (top right) I noticed a dead pixel. :(

    I need advice here......will this warrant a refund/replacement of the set ?

    Thanks:
     
  2. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    aRCaM

    Panasonic say:

    'Up to SIX dead pixels are allowed around the outside of the screen - each one must be separated by 5.0cm'.

    And

    'NO dead GREEN pixels are allowed in the centre of the screen'.

    Who defines 'the edge' and 'the centre' I'm not sure!

    Best regards

    Joe
     
  3. Jon Weaver

    Jon Weaver
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    I know its impossible, but can you try and describe how loud this buzzing is?

    I can't work out whether the buzzing is as loud as what you get from a CRT, or worse.
     
  4. TellW

    TellW
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    I had the buzzing problem too. I solved it with the following product.
    Go to www.conrad.ch and type the No. 342815-62 in the search field.
    It is a special plate for noise absorption.
    I fixed it on the back of the panal. It has exatly the right size for the th-42 and it brings down the noise level near to inaudible. The heat development is no problem because there ist still a lot of space for the air to circulate.

    Chris
     
  5. Jon Weaver

    Jon Weaver
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    When you say "on the the back of the panel", do you mean that you just stuck it on the back of the Plamsa. Or did you open it up and put it inside..

    Its a wonder why Panasonic couldn't use something like this when they build the display. They must be aware of the problem and you would have thought that it would be in their interest to fix it.

    I don't might admitting that I am really worried about this buzzing.

    CRTs buzz and its something you have to live with.. So, a buzz at CRT levels isn't a problem.. But, if the Plasma buzzes audibly, its going to be a nightmare.
     
  6. TellW

    TellW
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    I placed it on the back (not in the inside) and fixed it with two horizontal strings. The strings I attached to the holes where the suspension for the speaker is. You could also use (double-sided) adhesive tape. The dimension of this plate is 1000x500x60mm and so it perfectly covers the backside of the panel.
    The buzzing was very disturbing for me, espacially during watching TV late night with a low volume (8-10). With this absorption plate the buzzing problem is solved for me. But be aware that I have a table stand and therefor enough space behind the panel for the mounting of the absorption plate. I'm not sure if this solution would work with a wall mounted panel.
    Chris
     
  7. browellm

    browellm
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    TellW, I wish you had posted this before I sent mine back :(
     
  8. CarlB

    CarlB
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    I have just ordered a sheet of fire-retardent 25mm accoustic foam to try this approach. I used Custom Audio in the UK and delivery should take about 3 days. I am going to try mounting this behind the plasma first (not attaching it) to see what effect this has. The graph on the website shows the foam is pretty effective at absorbing higher frequencies so fingers crossed for this one...
     
  9. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    I contacted the company I bought the plasma from and described the 2 'faults' with the set. The dead pixel is about 4 inches to the left of center. Also, the buzzing is quite loud.

    I had 3 choices to give the company..1. refund.. 2..exchange for same set..3..pay more money for a different plasma. I thought that was fair.

    They said NO to all of my requests. They offered for a Panasonic guy to come out and repair the set. Dont know about you guys, but paying close to 4000 quid for a plasma and for it to be faulty from the start (I also only had it on for about 14 days) to be opened up and repaired is something that I cant accept.

    I have contacted trading standards...Ive had the plasma for 6 weeks in total. 4 weeks of that the plasma hadnt been switched on as I was waiting on a custom made Chord vga-vga cable, because the company I bought the plasma from couldnt supply the cable I needed and had to buy it somewhere else, I have a case that can be won in court.

    Trading standards have said that Ive to let the company send out a guy from Panasonic but I had to make it clear to the company that the panasonic guy coming out to look at the plasma is for inspection only and not for repair as I'm not 100% satisfied with my purchase. Trading standards said that I need to do this procedure so that Panasonic can verify that there is actually a fault there.

    Reading what Joe said about allowing SIX dead pixels is worrying though. Ive spent 4000 quid, and I aint accepting that statistic. With that sort of money spent I want ALL pixels lighting the way they should. Plus if I wanted a loud buzz while watching the plasma, I would go out the back garden and catch a few bees and sit them near ma telly. I dont expect the set to interfere with my viewing pleasure no matter how much money I spend.

    So as far as trading standards goes...I need to wait till the Panasonic guy has been to 'inspect' the set then it will get taken from there....I will keep you guys posted if any of you are interested.
     
  10. CarlB

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    aRCaM,

    Check the literature for the Panasonic plasma as well, as I am sure they advertise 'Silent Operation' as one of the features. May give you some more ammunition.

    My problem is that I still think the Panasonic has the best picture, especially as I output a progressive image from my DVD player. If I were to use a higher resolution panel then I would need to output interlaced and allow the panel to scale the image, which would be a shame after spending all that cash on my Denon 3800. This was emphasised by DenonJeff in one of the AVS Forum threads, so I have decided that native rate 480p is the best option for me. Hopefully the accoustic foam will help reduce the buzzing.

    Have you noticed different levels of buzz according to the input, as I mentioned in the 'Noise Problem' thread on this board? My component input buzzes quite a bit more than my SVideo input...
     
  11. Nike

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    This looks exactly the same as the 'acoustic tiles' that I bought from Studiospares in an attempt to quell the buzzing from my PWD4.
    If you actually have the buzzing problem I doubt this will fix it, only curb it slightly. I am not referring to the noise that varies with the white level displayed (which judging by the 'other' thread on this matter, is what some people are referring to), but a loud power-supply buzz that is there all the time regardless.

    Mine is clearly audable from 12 feet away (seated position) with what I consider 'normal' listening levels. (even action films can have quiet bit where just two people are talking!)

    It's damn frustrating, especially as there are people who claim to have 'silent' Panasonics. Are they all lying? Are they all deaf? - I think not...

    I'm currently waiting for my second 'swap-out' screen. Let's hope mine's not checked-out by the deaf bloke at Panasonic again. "What buzz?"
     
  12. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    Nike.....Not sure m8, but I dont think thats a psu buzz that we hear ? I could be wrong but I thought it was a buzzing coming from some components in the tv ? Also, it seems the buzzing is coming from the top right hand side of the set ? I personally cant see a psu being placed there ?

    CarlB....I agree with pic quality on our panny, I do believe its the best pic quality around on any 42" plasma at the moment. (I hope I dont start a war by saying that ;))

    But if the buzz or the dead pixel doesnt get sorted..then I'd like to change the set. Not for the fact the set is not working 100%, but for the fact that I want to keep my sanity :)

    One more thing....does this sound-proofing go between the plasma and the wall bracket or between the wall bracket and the wall ?
     
  13. TellW

    TellW
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    Attached some pictures how I fixed the absorption plate to the panel (the threaded bolt you can see on the picture isn't really necessary). I admit it, if you listen carfully there is still a slight buzz. But you have to turn the volume to zero and there must be no ambiente noise to hear it. Before I mounted this plate on the back of the plasma I could hear the buzzing ( it's the kind of buzzing that varied with the brightness of the panel) from 8m.
    Sorry to make the download of this post longer but I think is the easier to show the pictures than to explain it in words.
    Chris
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    tellW...thanks a lot for the pic :)

    I see yours is directly behind yout plasma......My plasma tv hangs from the wall using the wall bracket....so I would attach mine between the plasma and the wall bracket ?
     
  15. Paul D

    Paul D
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    I've just spent four hours demo-ing the 42" and 50" Pansonic plasmas at S&V!.

    On the 50 inch, i noticed there is a slight buzz from the fans when i checked round the back how it was connected up. But wasn't worringly loud etc.

    The 42 inch was near silent.
    Both were silent from about six feet back.

    So if you can hear it any further then your set must have a fault.

    I took with me 8 DVD for a complete test, before ordering.

    CTHD Superbit - For Clarity Test................= PASSED!
    Blade 2 ............- For RED Test....................= PASSED!
    Pitch Black .......- For Black Test/Halo-ing.....= PASSED!
    Twister ............- For Posturisation..............= FAILED!
    Grinch ..............- For poor transfer..............= Did well
    Shrek ...............- For Animation...................= WOW!
    Gremlins ..........- For old tranfer/grain.........= OK
    Monsters Inc.....- For detail level.................= Suprised how much detail was visable from low res screen, so WOW and PASSED!.

    Overall, both screens were more than acceptable dispite some normal "minor" plasma niggles. CRT TVs have their fare share of niggles as well etc. I just wanted to make sure that i didn't buy, THEN find there were things that would bug me. For the slight quirks i did see, i could easily live with them.

    I was suprised on how well both Plasma displayed nice bright vibrant images, with saturation levels to fall into. Brilliant!

    The 42 was slightly brighter than the 50.
    The 50 was more impressive due to the size!.
    But the 50 lost it during the "tornado" scene were they shelter under the little wooden bridge in the ditch etc. The 50 displayed weird colour patches (not posterisation) all over the place. It was like the display just didn't know what colour things were, and just threw colour "anywhere". The 42 looked normal, but at that time it was fed component whilst the 50 was being fed Svideo. So?

    This demo was on the older TH-PW4 screen.
    Never the less i liked it so much that i have ordered the new TH-42PW5B due in on Thursday!.
    I will demo my unit before purchase, so will look out for the buzzing and dead pixels. Any problems and i won't purchase etc.
     
  16. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    you couldnt hear it from 6 feet away ?

    I'm nearly 17 feet away and still hear it. I hear it very clearly too.
     
  17. CarlB

    CarlB
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    I sit 10 feet away and can hear it clearly in a silent room. I wouldn't trust any demo room due to ambient noise or accoustic differences to your own room. My set has been back to Panasonic and returned in the same condition, so they do not consider it to be a fault.

    I am sure all the units buzz, it a just a matter of personal sensitivity to the frequency (a poster on these boards commented that he could not hear a buzz but it drove his wife mad), room accoustics and ambient noise level. Personally my plasma is in a small dedicated room with plenty of reflective surfaces so I can clearly hear the noise. That is why I shall try some accoustic foam behind the panel to see if it reduces the reflection a little. I also commented that my SVideo input seems to buzz less than component, so maybe some people do not hear the buzz so much if they are using SVideo connections.

    There are many variables, but dealers such as Joe Fernand have confirmed that all these Panasonic units buzz.

    Personally I can live with it, but continue to try and remedy the situation as best as possible. I consider the picture on the Panasonic to be the best available so my only course of action is to make the situation as agreeable as I can. The accoustic foam is a step in this direction, but to be honest with the majority of movies played at -15db on my system I hardly ever hear the buzz. I guess it's more irritating on a psychological level as I know it's there and listen out for it now (as much as I'd like not to)! :D
     
  18. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    I defo hear what your saying there CarlB.

    If for any reason my other problem cant be solved, I will try the sound proofing method too to see if it helps.
     
  19. DaveCheltenham

    DaveCheltenham
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    In my younger days I was like you aRCaM and could hear anything like that including deafening 15kHz whistles from early 625 TV's with the same reaction; what whistle?

    They must send the old timers out from Panasonic if anyone complains of buzz.
     
  20. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    lol.... yeah :)

    Retirement age in Panasonic must be 75+ hehe
     
  21. symanski

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    As title! I read an article in Television magazine about plasma screens (should have it somewhere) that discusses the Panasonic, but is applicable to other screens too.

    Like LCD displays, you can get dead or stuck pixels. There are over a million pixels on the screen, even more for the higher resolution screens. Likewise on LCD screens, which are approaching ten million pixels.

    All screens are built to a high standard, but even with 99.999% of all pixels fully operational, you will have ten faulty pixels.

    There are two states for a faulty pixel, dead or stuck. Dead pixels aren't a problem as the ones arround will do a sufficent job to keep the illusion of a picture. Stuck pixels are a real problem.

    Any pixel that's stuck on are laser zapped in to dead pixels. You won't notice a dead pixel in a simlar way as you'd notice a stuck one.

    To find a dead pixel, you've really got to look for it! From a normal viewing distance, the surrounding pixels keep up the illusion.

    This is directly refering to the Television article, and not through any contact with any other source, retailer or manufacturer. You may wish to find a copy of the article for your own reference.

    All the best,

    John.
     
  22. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    aRcAM

    I think only Revox (£14K+ for a 42" display) guarantee a fault free Plasma display - every manufacturer has quoted 'allowable' figures for stuck and dead pixels.

    I'm no lawyer so it will be interesting to find out how Trading Standards approaches that subject.

    Every Panasonic panel I have put my ear close to makes a bit of a buzz - possibly some more than others and definitely more noticeable in some rooms than in others; though at 17' yours does sound a bit over the top.

    Panasonic literature for the PWD 4 Series models say they employ 'silence engineering' that results in 'quiet' operation - they dont claim they are silent though!!!

    Hopefully the Panasonic Service Engineer can suggest a 'fix' to quell your overly noisy panel but he/she will not provide a 'silent' remedy.

    Best regards

    Joe
     
  23. nickt

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    Joe,
    Panasonic have removed the PW4B page from their website, but it was almost identical to the new page at :-

    http://www.panasonic.co.uk/product/plasmadisplaytv/TH42PW5B.HTM

    I quote :-

    All this produces bright, crisp pictures with deep contrast and natural colours combined with silent running operation.

    Nick
     
  24. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    thanks nickt.......yep, silent is what they say, and silent it definately aint.

    I'm looking forward to seeing what this engineer has to say.
     
  25. symanski

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    I'd be interested in what is said about noise from the equipment. It's something that has bothered myself before too. Philips DCC player had a very loud hum, but a friend who bought the same model didn't. A "Corner" HiFi shop in Glasgow wasn't too keen to fix the problem.

    All the best,

    Dr John Sim.
     
  26. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    Hello both

    Remember aRCaM has a PWD4 - so chose your ammunition carefully!

    I still have PWD4 literature if you want a copy!

    Joe
     
  27. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    Joe : If you could pass on some info that would be great.
     
  28. Joe Fernand

    Joe Fernand
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    aRcAM

    PM me with your postal address and I'll stick a brochure in the post tomorrow.

    Regards

    Joe
     
  29. Gliese 581c

    Gliese 581c
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    Joe, your PM mailbox is full. :(
     
  30. CarlB

    CarlB
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    Accoustic foam sheet has drastically reduced the buzzing for me. See details in the 'Panny noise' thread.
     

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